Richard III & the Car Park

[GUT]

Why do Brits say "car park" and Yanks say "parking lot"?

Who knows.


Three countries separated by a common language ( when you include us Aussies)

Many examples.

Just look at a car, gas, petrol, hood, bonnet, trunk, boot.

Then let's not start on spelling.

[GUT]

To most Aussies I know a car Park is where you park a car as is a parking lot and a car lot is where you buy a car, as is a car yard.

Probably the biggest differentiation I can think of is that here you'd never call a multi level car park a parking lot, well in my experience anyway, the term Parking lot probably only applying to a yard you can park in. But a car park could be ground level only or multi level.

Which brings another example yo mind, ground floor or first floor.

[GUT]

And don't get me started on the whole bathroom, toilet, loo thing.

Everyone knows it's a dunny.

[Beowulf]

"Why do Brits say "car park" and Yanks say "parking lot"? ~ by Pcdunn


When I first read about King Richard being under the car park I thought they meant some sort of park accessible by car or something. I puzzled over this for weeks whenever I saw the stories.

I was very surprised when I finally realized what it meant. I was equally surprised to think the King was under...a parking lot! Gad, how 'common'. No place for a grave of a very famous King. I wouldn't wonder if he was groaning about it all this time.

Really it's surprising they found him at all.

[Mayerling]

Why do Brits say "car park" and Yanks say "parking lot"?

Well, from what I understand, one can blame it on American lexicographer Noah Webster - in part.

Webster is still a name we recall because one of the best known dictionaries is named for him. But he came upon the scene as a figure involved in the American form of English in the 1790s and 1800s. He was a school teacher. The atmosphere in the U.S. post-Revolutionary War was, shall we say hostile to Great Britain. There were issues regarding the proper way history was to be taught, and about our political system. While we could not throw away our reliance on British models of government going back to the Magna Carta and the creation of Parliament by Sir Simon de Montford (I think that was his name), and on political theorists like Bolingbroke, Locke, and Hobbes, we hated to have to rely on these. Fortunately there were non-British models going back to ancient Greece (Aristotle) and Rome (Cicero), and to France (Montesquiou, Voltaire), but the French invariably also cited the British*. Let's face it, by it's unique isolation Britain was able to create a model of government few on the continent could match.

[*An easy, if curious, French differentiation from the British up to the French Revolution - France had "Parlements" too - but they were like law chambers for the leading jurists and lawyers of the major cities, and not a centralized body of two houses, Commons and Lord, as in Britain. And they rarely could think in terms of national policies, but more often of local interests of the upper classes.]

Webster was part of the movement to nationalize and recreate an all American culture. Being a school teacher he concentrated on spelling reform, deciding that the English we got from Britain was too complex and could be simplified. Hence, changing words with the "our" combination to the simpler "or" combination ("flavour" becomes "flavor", for example). This was not universally done - some words kept the old spelling ("devour", for example) because that "our" combination was originally from Norman French, and France had been our ally. Also we dropped terms or simplified them. Although we did not have cars until the end of the 19th Century, the term for the rear end of the car, the "boot", where one puts one's luggage, became the "trunk", which originally was simply the largest piece of one's travelling luggage. However the original word (aside from it's use as a noun for a special kind of footwear) was kept in a similar nature for a "naughty term" for the rear end of a person - his or her "bootie".

[Some changes actually never went far. Webster did consider changing the
"ocks" combination in words like "locks" and "socks" to the "ox" combination, which only remains around today in slang form for two baseball teams (Boston Red Sox and Chicago White Sox - both of which wore those colored (or "coloured") socks in their 19th century uniforms - indeed they were known as the "Red Stockings" and "White Stockings" back then). But that did not catch beyond those baseball teams. President Theodore Roosevelt was interested (as a prolific writer, and a meddlesome one at times) to push for increased use of the "ox" combination, talking or writing about "lox" on doors, not platters of smoked salmon used with bagels, but he got a surprising amount of ridicule for this.]

To be fair to Webster's changes (and those of later American lexicographers), in the 18th Century the concept of a dictionary itself was just underway (keep in mind organization of knowledge in "Encyclopedias", although known for centuries, did not get popularized until the French led by Diderot created the "Encyclopedie" in the middle of the 18th Century). The best known dictionary of the 18th Century is Samuel Johnson's work of mid-century, which is still loved, but it is loved because (like his late 19th Century successor Ambrose Bierce), Johnson enjoyed editorializing on certain subjects for the effect on the reader (example: his discussion of the meaning of the noun "oats" as used in Scotland). In fact, the term "Dictionary" was used for books on a variety of non-grammarian subjects, such as reference works on certain types of artists and personalities united by their work - like Charles Burney's book on musicians. There was nothing wrong with that, but it shows that Webster was in a field of flux here.

Anyway, the Anglo - American split on English begins with Webster. The Anglo - Australian is a matter presumably based on a similar historical anger. Keep in mind why Australia was built up. Up until 1782/83 (one can even say up to 1776) the greatest prison colony in the British Empire was the colony (now the state) of Georgia - founded in 1733 as a philanthropic endeavor (sorry - American spelling) by General James Oglethorpe, for transplanted felons. That ended with the success of the American Revolution. Prior to Emma Lazarus opening the floodgates of immigration to the "tired, your poor, your huddled masses", Americans were kind of skeptical about who came here - although initially it was towards continental Europeans who were Catholics. After 1783 the British noticed this nice piece of land that was a continent in size, and was a convenient dumping ground for their so-called criminal classes. The recipients of this treatment did not fully appreciate the rationale for this, and (I strongly suspect) still don't appreciate it. Note that a large number were also political prisoners (Irish revolutionaries) who really did not enjoy having to still be considered citizens under the British monarchy and government. Therefore the language problem between Britain and the Australian colonials grew throughout the 19th Century into the 20th Century. It also would mirror the political give-and-take over the years by strong Aussies (Billy Hughes, Philip Curtin) in the two World Wars about the use or misuse of Australian forces by the London Central Government (Curtin, at one point) threatening to order the return of troops to Australia rather than be sent to the middle east; he did this apparently after the British sent valuable Australian military units to bolster the defenses at Singapore, just in time to be surrendered to the Japanese). Yeah, I can see why the Aussies might campaign a more original form of English used in their homeland than say in the British Isles (or for that matter the United States).

Notice I have not touched on Canada, which having French and British traditions, resolved them over the years with bi-lingualism.

Jeff

[Pcdunn]

To most Aussies I know a car Park is where you park a car as is a parking lot and a car lot is where you buy a car, as is a car yard.

Probably the biggest differentiation I can think of is that here you'd never call a multi level car park a parking lot, well in my experience anyway, the term Parking lot probably only applying to a yard you can park in. But a car park could be ground level only or multi level.

Which brings another example yo mind, ground floor or first floor.

Americans call a multi-level parking area a "parking garage", I believe, not to be confused with a suburban home's attached garage, or the mechanic's garage where one takes a car for repairs.

A place to buy new or used cars is a car dealership, and where they keep their cars is a "showroom" (if covered) or a "car lot" (if out in the open air.)

I was puzzled by the earlier reference to "getting clamped"-- but I think we call a device to keep a car from being driven away is called "a boot" here, and drivers "get the boot" instead of "the clamp". Funny!

[Errata]

Americans call a multi-level parking area a "parking garage", I believe, not to be confused with a suburban home's attached garage, or the mechanic's garage where one takes a car for repairs.

A place to buy new or used cars is a car dealership, and where they keep their cars is a "showroom" (if covered) or a "car lot" (if out in the open air.)

I was puzzled by the earlier reference to "getting clamped"-- but I think we call a device to keep a car from being driven away is called "a boot" here, and drivers "get the boot" instead of "the clamp". Funny!

In the south we say "boot" and not "clamp". It may be regional like soda, coke, and pop.

[Robert]

Over here you get clamped if you park where you shouldn't or your ticket runs out or whatever.

The boot of a car is the back part used for storage - don't know what the US equivalent is.

For what you call the hood, we have the endearing term 'bonnet.'

[Pcdunn]

The boot of a car is the back part used for storage - don't know what the US equivalent is.

"Trunk" is what we use for the back of a car.

[Pcdunn]

In the south we say "boot" and not "clamp". It may be regional like soda, coke, and pop.

Nope, I've always heard "boot", and I'm from the West.

[GUT]

Americans call a multi-level parking area a "parking garage", I believe, not to be confused with a suburban home's attached garage, or the mechanic's garage where one takes a car for repairs.

A place to buy new or used cars is a car dealership, and where they keep their cars is a "showroom" (if covered) or a "car lot" (if out in the open air.)

I was puzzled by the earlier reference to "getting clamped"-- but I think we call a device to keep a car from being driven away is called "a boot" here, and drivers "get the boot" instead of "the clamp". Funny!

Thanks Dunny.

[Robert]

Thanks Pat. I had heard that term but I couldn't recall it.

Also we say 'petrol' and you say 'gas.'

[GUT]

A little funny really that even with all the differences we understand each other about 99% of the time.

Humour can cause some issues though as can sarcasm and the use of what in some countries may be considered naughty words but in another used freely.

I think I may have told the story before, on our last cruise we were going ashore in Darwin and Mrs Gut asked me some stupid question (as those of that sex are inclined to do) now I answered (as you would) "Buggered if I know", now we were in the lift at the time (elevator for some of you) with a little prim and proper looking American lady, who became so excited at the use of the word "bugger" and when I thought I had offended her and apologised she said "Oh no, not at all, friends told me I'd hear someone say it, and I didn't believe them, but here you ar out in public saying it..." Now what she'd have thought if she heard me greet a old school mate with "g'day ya old bastard, been a bloody long time..." Well Buggered if I know.

[Beowulf]

Over here you get clamped if you park where you shouldn't or your ticket runs out or whatever.

The boot of a car is the back part used for storage - don't know what the US equivalent is.

For what you call the hood, we have the endearing term 'bonnet.'

I thought this was funny. When John Landis made An American Werewolf in London:

"John Landis had a bit of a communication issue on the set with the effects crew. He told them to take the head of Inspector Villiers and throw it across the hood of a car. They looked at him in puzzlement, and after he picked up the head and threw it himself, they replied, "Oh, you mean the bonnet.""

[Aldebaran]

I recall once going into a London shop requesting a slip. No one knew what I meant until I described a "petticoat" well enough to make a light go on.