Gordon Brown resigning?

[Limehouse]

Wasnt that just wonderful though! And you see we English have tons to be proud of getting rid of filth like Griffin and his pals.

BTW Limehouse, regarding barons and baronets and castle owners and the like.......
do you know the one about the millionaire Tory toff who charged us tax payers to clean out the moat of his castle in the expenses row?

Here it is---its by none other than our own poet laureate , the great Carol Ann Duffy:

What did we do with the trust of your vote?

Hired a flunky to flush out the moat!

Best
Norma

ps loved the Woody Guthrie song! Did you know that Bob Dylan paid a huge tribute to Woody Guthrie
in his terrific autobiography,"Chronicles,part one" ?

Hi Norma,

Good for Carol Ann Duffy. And good for the people who uncovered the expenses scandal (evwen if it was a Tory rag!).

I think the people did an honerable thing sending Griffin and his type packing.
Fair enough, immigration is an issue that bothers a lot of people (not me) and they were looking for a protest vote. Griffin saw it as his chance to gain popularity but the people made it quite clear they are not having any of his nasty brand of politics.

re Woody Guthrie, he is a long time hero of mine (along with his pal, Pete Seegar - still going strong at 90-odd years of age). After a long time away from the folk scene, in recent years I have found myself returning to the genre for inspiration and also just because a lot of folk music is just so beautiful. Dylan is, indeed, a great champion of Guthrie and so is Billy Bragg, a performer I have seen many times at various festivals up and down the country for the past thirty-odd years. Sadly, Guthrie died an early and undignified death from Huntingdon's disease, which robbed him of his mobility and his beautiful mind.

Take care.

[Limehouse]

Love the song too!!

(I also remember something similar - the "Margaret Thatcher the milk snatcher" rhymes when she was in office and cut free school millk for all children over age 7, I believe...How can these people live with themselves???)

Hi Capps,

Yes, Mrs Thatcher was known as the 'milk snatcher' and there were various unfalttering songs sung about her at various times when she was in office!

If you love such songs, what about this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTdC11JaO9A

Take care.

[cappuccina]

Hi Limehouse!!

Yes, Buffy St. Marie sang some very powerful songs...

Don't forget Malvina Reynolds too, one of my faves...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmNSEbgt1Dg

[johns]

I mean the government could still be ousted by a no-confidence vote (by a simple majority of MPs), even though a fresh election couldn't be forced.

So what would happen in that case Chris? I thought that if a government lost a Vote of Confidence (VoC) it forced an election.

Expanding this interesting discussion even more, I heard on the radio today that the Coalition propose to raise the VoC "threshold" to 55% of MPs rather than a simple majority. Silly idea if you ask me. I think the current arrangement is 50%+1 MP.

[Limehouse]

Caps, I was going to post Pete Seegar's version!! Great minds think alike eh?
Of course, Malvina wrote the song.

It's very funny really because when I was small, this song was played over and over again on a radio programme called 'Junior Choice' which was a junior version of 'Housewives' Choice' and it usually played sweet little songs like that one by Burl Ives. Anyhow, this song got requested and played over and over and I don't think anyone ever picked up on the very obvious subversiveness of the song!

It makes me giggle to think of all those kids singing along!

[cappuccina]

We used to sing this in nursery school! I would have been 2-3 yo at the time!

[Natalie Severn]

We used to sing this in nursery school! I would have been 2-3 yo at the time!

Caps,
Its heartening to read you and Limehouse chatting about these singers and musicians from such a great tradition as theirs, but I must admit its the exchange itself between you both that is music to my ears----!
With love and thanks,
Norma

[Limehouse]

Caps,
Its heartening to read you and Limehouse chatting about these singers and musicians from such a great tradition as theirs, but I must admit its the exchange itself between you both that is music to my ears----!
With love and thanks,
Norma

Thanks for your kind words Norma.

I'm going to post another Woody Guthrie song (sung here by Pete Seeger) and it will possibly upset a few people who don't favour Trade Unions but I think it's an important reminder that most of us would not be enjoying the things we take for granted like the Minimum Wage and 28 days holiday per year if it was not for the Unions and the last Labour Government.

I like this version because it tactfully avoids the 'boys' suffix (which side are you on BOYS) which excludes the millions of women who fought (and still fight) for equal opportunities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jElUvFSBa30

Warm regards.

Julie

[Graham]

Well now.....I've been a Union member all my working life from 1963, and I never did, would never, and never will vote Labour, New Labour or even Something In Between Old Labour And Could Be New Labour. However, I will support the rights of all employed people, but I am not a Socialist.

Woodie Gurthrie's song harks back to the days when the US Government regularly sent in troops against organised labour, something I believe has not happened in the United Kingdom since the General Strike of 1926, and even then it was but a gesture on the part of the Government of the day. The history of the Labour Movement in the USA and the UK is very, very different.

You don't get me, I'm part of the union.

Graham

[Chris]

So what would happen in that case Chris? I thought that if a government lost a Vote of Confidence (VoC) it forced an election.

Expanding this interesting discussion even more, I heard on the radio today that the Coalition propose to raise the VoC "threshold" to 55% of MPs rather than a simple majority. Silly idea if you ask me. I think the current arrangement is 50%+1 MP.

That's not the proposal. For some reason the BBC misunderstood it and reported that, which has confused a lot of people. The 55% threshold is specifically for a motion to dissolve parliament. A no-confidence motion would still be a simple majority.

If the government lost a vote of confidence, then the prime minister would have to resign, and the Queen would ask someone else to form a government.

This is similar to the current situation for the Scottish parliament, except that the threshold there is 66%, not 55%, and there is an additional provision for dissolution if it's found impossible to form a new government.

[Natalie Severn]

[QUOTE=Graham;134304]Well now.....I've been a Union member all my working life from 1963,

Hi Graham,

But the IWW [The Industrial Workers of the World] was part of a common class struggle ,so couldn"t it be argued that it was linked to all the trade unions of the industrialised world?
One of the songs Pete Seeger, Paul Robeson and Joan Baez sang a lot was "The Ballad of Joe Hill" :

I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night,
Alive as you and me
Says I but Joe
Your ten years dead
I never died says he.


So Graham,the struggle is alive and well and communication is helped by all this new technology! So if those two posh boys think they can finish us off.....well we are still here!

Norma

[Natalie Severn]

Thanks Julie,
I am about to go to that link but before I go I want to say that Joe Hill wrote the song " The Rebel Girl" to immortalise Elizabeth Gurley Flynn, another IWW activist so yes,we were part of that struggle from the beginning!
Norma
x

[Graham]

[QUOTE=Natalie Severn;134308]

Well now.....I've been a Union member all my working life from 1963,

Hi Graham,

But the IWW [The Industrial Workers of the World] was part of a common class struggle ,so couldn"t it be argued that it was linked to all the trade unions of the industrialised world?
One of the songs Pete Seeger, Paul Robeson and Joan Baez sang a lot was "The Ballad of Joe Hill" :

I dreamed I saw Joe Hill last night,
Alive as you and me
Says I but Joe
Your ten years dead
I never died says he.


So Graham,the struggle is alive and well and communication is helped by all this new technology! So if those two posh boys think they can finish us off.....well we are still here!

Norma

Patronising nonsense, Norma. I think it's safe to say that I have been aware of the singers you mention long before you ever heard of them, as well as Joe Hill, whose cause and memory these days isn't quite so shiningly angelic as once it was. I saw Joan Baez in 1963, by the way, and I wouldn't mind betting this was long before you saw the light of day. It may also interest you to know that as a singer myself I've performed The Ballad Of Joe Hill - without totally agreeing with whatever message it purports to put across.

I'm a union member for one reason and one reason only - my own personal best interests. Class struggle my arse! I don't know where you people pick up this rubbish - Corin Redgrave, maybe? Paul Foot?

Politics, especially politics in the Western democracies, is not about 'posh boys' seeking to 'finish us off', it's about putting the interests of the country first. The nearest I ever came to being 'finished off' was when dear Mr Callaghan was doing Prime Minister impressions, and not very successfully, either. Anyway, just look forward to the day when you'll visit Planet Earth, and all will be revealed.

Graham

[Limehouse]

Well now.....I've been a Union member all my working life from 1963, and I never did, would never, and never will vote Labour, New Labour or even Something In Between Old Labour And Could Be New Labour. However, I will support the rights of all employed people, but I am not a Socialist.

Woodie Gurthrie's song harks back to the days when the US Government regularly sent in troops against organised labour, something I believe has not happened in the United Kingdom since the General Strike of 1926, and even then it was but a gesture on the part of the Government of the day. The history of the Labour Movement in the USA and the UK is very, very different.

You don't get me, I'm part of the union.

Graham

You are not alone Graham. Many union memebers are not Labour supporters.

Thatcher came close to sending in the troops against the miners.

[Limehouse]

[QUOTE=Graham;134321]

Patronising nonsense, Norma. I think it's safe to say that I have been aware of the singers you mention long before you ever heard of them, as well as Joe Hill, whose cause and memory these days isn't quite so shiningly angelic as once it was. I saw Joan Baez in 1963, by the way, and I wouldn't mind betting this was long before you saw the light of day. It may also interest you to know that as a singer myself I've performed The Ballad Of Joe Hill - without totally agreeing with whatever message it purports to put across.

I'm a union member for one reason and one reason only - my own personal best interests. Class struggle my arse! I don't know where you people pick up this rubbish - Corin Redgrave, maybe? Paul Foot?

Politics, especially politics in the Western democracies, is not about 'posh boys' seeking to 'finish us off', it's about putting the interests of the country first. The nearest I ever came to being 'finished off' was when dear Mr Callaghan was doing Prime Minister impressions, and not very successfully, either. Anyway, just look forward to the day when you'll visit Planet Earth, and all will be revealed.

Graham

Graham,

You accuse Norma of being patronising but your post is as patronising as anything I have read on this site.

Now, tell me, what are the best interests of the country?

For me, it is the well-being of its citizens. That is a government's first duty.
That means ensuring people have equal opportunities to thrive and develop.