Gordon Brown resigning?

[johns]

Leaving aside the pro's and con's of Mr Brown's reign as our supreme overlord, I was glued to the telly on Tuesday (sad I know) and couldn't help noticing that the "smooth transition of power" from Brown to Cameron didn't seem all that smooth to me.

I'll explain...

1) Brown resigns effective immediately then pops down the road to see Liz.
2) Liz accepts Brown's resignation so we're in that "limbo" that always happens when there's a change of PM.
3) Cameron gets a call and he's off down to Liz's for tea and biccies.
4) He is now our new overlord without the Lib Dems signing the deal off.
5) Then he's outside #10 announcing various bits and bobs.
6) After midnight (Wednesday morning) the Lib Dems ratify the Coalition deal so that the new Con/LibDem Government can be formed... else Cameron would have a minority.

Now either Brown just thought "Ah damn it... I'm off down the Palace to resign no matter what"

Or

He knew that Cameron and Clegg had the deal in the bag

Or

He thought they had the deal in the bag, but they didn't, and Cameron goes down to Liz's thinking "I hope that bunch of Lib Dems pull this deal off else I'm knackered here."

Or

I don't really know what else...

I find these scenarios a wee bit difficult to believe.

Say what you like about Mr Brown (and any PM come to think of it) they would never leave the country in a position of not having a government.

Or did I nod off at some point and miss a step?

[Natalie Severn]

You are right John.We were glued to the box all night too and noticed all that-Andy thought it was Brown being difficult and had a laugh about it ! But we"re not watching tv now because the sight of those two ,two - stepping it into no 10 which they keep showing us on every tv news bulletin, is causing us to reach for the sick bag all the time.

[Victoria]

Hi Richard

Sorry for the late reply...

Do you have any more information about Cameron's lot owning the Palace?

Thanks

I believe it is to do with his wife Samanthas' side of the family.
She belonged to the Astor and Sheffield family, who owned,
up until 300 years ago, Buckingham House .. and of course now
known as Buckingham Palace.
I wonder if that is where the saying .. 'Buck House' comes from?

[Nurse Sarah]

I believe it is to do with his wife Samanthas' side of the family.
She belonged to the Astor and Sheffield family, who owned,
up until 300 years ago, Buckingham House .. and of course now
known as Buckingham Palace.
I wonder if that is where the saying .. 'Buck House' comes from?

Hi Victoria

Thanks for the reply, that's interesting information.

I imagine that saying could well come from those words.

Cheers.

[Victoria]

You are welcome Nurse Sarah,
it has been on our news here (Australia) ..
on ABC radio (like BBC)

[Chris]

But we"re not watching tv now because the sight of those two ,two - stepping it into no 10 which they keep showing us on every tv news bulletin, is causing us to reach for the sick bag all the time.

But doesn't it do your heart good to see two young men so utterly in love with ......... themselves?

[The Grave Maurice]

He knew that Cameron and Clegg had the deal in the bag

This, john, seems to me to be the most likely of your scenarios. Brown spent a considerable amount of time trying to woo Clegg and, at some point, must have realized that a deal was not possible and decided to resign.

What I find even more unlikely is that a long-term accord can be struck between the Lib-Dems and the Conservatives. I imagine that you Brits will face another election sometime in the autumn.

We Canadians have spent quite some time under a minority government and, IMO, they often work quite well, but not for long.

[Natalie Severn]

But doesn't it do your heart good to see two young men so utterly in love with ......... themselves?

Chris, you have summed them both up .......brilliantly!

[Chris]

What I find even more unlikely is that a long-term accord can be struck between the Lib-Dems and the Conservatives. I imagine that you Brits will face another election sometime in the autumn.

On a more serious note, the Tories have made such big concessions that I think Cameron must be serious about this for the long term. The concessions include a move in the direction of fixed-term parliaments, which I assume will be enacted fairly quickly, and which would make it impossible for Cameron to call an election unilaterally (and also impossible for the Lib Dems and Labour together to force an election, if the coalition broke down).

I think Cameron appreciates how unpopular reducing the deficit is going to make the government, and is hoping that the coalition (which represents 60% of those who voted) will be broad enough to defeat Labour at the next election.

[Natalie Severn]

Well Chris,we must wait and see really .The Lib/Dems traditionally are much closer to Labour, not only because of people such as Shirley Williams and David Owen who were once in the leadership of Old Labour, but also because the likes of David Steel and Charles Kennedy,who are both ex leaders of the Lib/Dems have always been far more vehement in their opposition to the Tories than ever they have been to much of Labour policy .Indeed it has been evident in their approach to Green issues,Immigration, Democracy and the Proportional Rep , that the Lib/Dems have even been to the left of the Labour Party. Moreover, many who voted Liberal in Constituencies that were usually held by Tories, actually voted Liberal to keep out the Tories! One wonders how betrayed such voters now feel?
The figures may,actually, be better presented thus- in my reading of what happened .The Tories had 309 seats, Labour 257 seats lib/Dems 58 seats ,therefore the two parties that are "ideologically" closest,ie the Labour Party and the Lib/Dems represent 15 million people, whereas the Tories represent only 12 milion people.Nor should it be forgotten that almost the entirety of Scotland voted Labour which was something of a surprise,since many had thought Scotland would have more SNP seats than other.
The Tories were the single party to obtain most seats in parliament, but they did not have the majority to govern with a majority or form a government that would have lasted more than a few weeks or months on its own.
However, one thing I am delighted about is the fact that proportional representation has been brought forward on the agenda .A "hung parliament" was what people voted for,in point of fact, and in my view this was a first step to reconsider a fairer voting system.As long as the referendum on the start of this process isnt defeated at the outset- and sadly a lot of Tories say they will be voting and campaigning against the Lib/Dems on this-then I will be really pleased to see such voting reform at last .

[Chris Scott]

The full text of the coalition agreement can be read here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8677933.stm

One section that I found very pleasing was the commitment on civil liberties which have been treated in such a cavalier way by Labour. The agreement reads:
10. Civil liberties

The parties agree to implement a full programme of measures to reverse the substantial erosion of civil liberties under the Labour Government and roll back state intrusion.

This will include:

•A Freedom or Great Repeal Bill.
•The scrapping of ID card scheme, the National Identity register, the next generation of biometric passports and the Contact Point Database.
•Outlawing the finger-printing of children at school without parental permission.
•The extension of the scope of the Freedom of Information Act to provide greater transparency.
•Adopting the protections of the Scottish model for the DNA database.
•The protection of historic freedoms through the defence of trial by jury.
•The restoration of rights to non-violent protest.
•The review of libel laws to protect freedom of speech.
•Safeguards against the misuse of anti-terrorism legislation.
•Further regulation of CCTV.
•Ending of storage of internet and email records without good reason.
•A new mechanism to prevent the proliferation of unnecessary new criminal offences.

I agree that "talk is cheap" and I wait to see what actually happens but this commitment to reversing some of the recent damage is very welcome

[Chris]

However, one thing I am delighted about is the fact that proportional representation has been brought forward on the agenda .A "hung parliament" was what people voted for,in point of fact, and in my view this was a first step to reconsider a fairer voting system.As long as the referendum on the start of this process isnt defeated at the outset- and sadly a lot of Tories say they will be voting and campaigning against the Lib/Dems on this-then I will be really pleased to see such voting reform at last .

The trouble is that the system being proposed for the Commons wouldn't really be proportional, even if it got through (though it would tend to benefit the Lib Dems, and to some extent Labour).

What surprised me was that the Tories had agreed to an elected House of Lords - and one elected by proportional representation. I think that's very significant, no matter what happens about the referendum.

[Neal Shelden]

Caps,
Right on! In fact Brown came to the school I taught at .The school like many of the new schools that were built during Labour, was the result of the government prioritising schools and hospitals in particular.After Thatcher"s demolition job our hospitals were falling apart and our schools dilapidated with buckets under the roof to collect water when it rained.The picture is very different now in most areas of London, thanks to Labour.
I thought Brown was viciously attacked by the Tory press who all combined in a witchhunt of lies and propaganda to get rid of him. Do you realise that many councils throughout the country changed to labour? London in particular,but also Liverpool and many many others that the Tory press has ignored and remained silent about.In the General Election Scotland went almost totally over to Labour.
Gordon Brown by the way is acknowledged as having been a supremely brilliant chancellor. He was a decent politiician who did his best to keep people in jobs and keep the economy regenerating itself.A difficult task in the midst of this global economic crisis.Certainly the national debt is a great concern but recovery is predicted as long as people continue to remain in work and able to spend-that is according to the Keynsian economists which Brown is .Only time could tell if he was right---we may never know now.
I hope he gets to fully enjoy his lovely wife and children now .
Best,
Norma

The only thing I'm going to remember the Labour government for is the way they tried to change my country of England into a country of God knows what from God knows where. I didn't vote Labour in 1997 so that their priority would be offering jobs and housing to people that didn't have a right to be here.
Thank God Labour have gone and never let them back, especially the weird Milliband.
I have to say that only a woman would suggest that an old frump like poor Sarah Brown was lovely, and good looking Sam Cameron was plain.

[Graham]

The only thing I'm going to remember the Labour government for is the way they tried to change my country of England into a country of God knows what from God knows where. I didn't vote Labour in 1997 so that their priority would be offering jobs and housing to people that didn't have a right to be here.
Thank God Labour have gone and never let them back, especially the weird Milliband.
I have to say that only a woman would suggest that an old frump like poor Sarah Brown was lovely, and good looking Sam Cameron was plain.

Absolutely spot on, Neal. Women? Pshaw!

Blair tried his damndest to bugger up this country, but he was a rank amateur compared with Brown and his coterie of grotesques.

Graham

[Natalie Severn]

Thanks Chris [Scott],
You are quite right and the Lib dems were right over Civil Liberties.Lets keep our fingers crossed.

and

Chris,

Yes, I was surprised about their agreement over an elected House of Lords.It would be a great improvement too.
And I realise the point you make about PR.All I am saying is that the Lib Dems hold it very dear to their hearts and I think it may be a first step towards this.