All Things Conan Doyle & Holmes

[Zodiac]

Holmes had a revolver and Watson had a pistol.

From The Hound Of The Baskervilles, page 189:

"But the next instant Holmes had emptied five barrels of his revolver into the creature's flank. With a last howl of agony and a vicious snap in the air, it rolled upon its back, four feet pawing furiously, and then fell limp upon its side. I stooped, panting, and pressed my pistol to the dreadful, shimmering head, but it was useless to press the trigger. The giant hound was dead.

There's also a mention a few pages before that of Inspector Lestrade having a firearm of some sort on him as well, but it doesn't say what sort.

Cheers,
Adam.

Hi Adam,

Yes, thanks, just dug out my copy. I too noticed the curious quote, "Holmes had emptied five barrels of his revolver into the creature's flank". I think that we can safely assume that Conan Doyle meant to say "chambers of his revolver" rather that "barrels"!!! There had, of course, been multi-barreled pistols, with basic revolving mechanisms, earlier in the century. The infamous "Pepper-box/Pepper-pot" revolvers, popular from the 1830's to the 1850's, but these were notoriously unreliable cap and ball weapons and had long since been supplanted by the the revolver proper, in both single and double action.

A new kind of multi-barrel Pepper-box type weapon, now using a metal "Pin-Fire" cartridge, did become popular, among certain elements of the criminal classes, in the late 19the century. This was a very small, short, easily concealed and usually 4 barreled little gun, the grips of which also served as a knuckle-duster and often came with a built in knife blade too! They were said to be very popular among the street gangs of Paris!

Lestrade does mention having a pistol himself, referring to his hip pocket. All I can surmise from this is that it would have been one of the many popular makes of "pocket revolver" that flourished at the time. Similar models, marketed for a ladies defence, were known as "Purse Pistols". These guns were the forerunners of the 20th century snub-nosed revolver, such as the Colt Detective Special.

Best wishes,

Zodiac.

[Adam Went]

Holmes had a revolver and Watson had a pistol.

From The Hound Of The Baskervilles, page 189:

"But the next instant Holmes had emptied five barrels of his revolver into the creature's flank. With a last howl of agony and a vicious snap in the air, it rolled upon its back, four feet pawing furiously, and then fell limp upon its side. I stooped, panting, and pressed my pistol to the dreadful, shimmering head, but it was useless to press the trigger. The giant hound was dead.

There's also a mention a few pages before that of Inspector Lestrade having a firearm of some sort on him as well, but it doesn't say what sort.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Zodiac]

The Musgrave Ritual - one of the better stories IMHO.

221b Baker Street must've been built of stern stuff to withstand the repeated impact of .45's fired at close range.

Is the Martini-Henry Rifle the same as in Rorkes Drift fame? I remember seeing a documentary about this battle, and they were turning up brass cartridge-cases all over the place. I was surprised at how thin the brass was, very flimsy.

What kind of gun(s) do you reckon Holmes and Watson used to knock off the Hound?

Graham

Hi Graham,

Yes indeed, as the Good Doctor says, 221B was not ideally suited as a pistol range! In terms of power though, the .450 Boxer MkI pistol round was closer to the .38 S&W round than it was to a .45 Colt round.

Yes, that is indeed the famous Martini-Henry, and yes, a major problem with the Short chamber Boxer-Henry .450 cartridge was that it was made of a rather thin sheet of brass rolled around a mandrel, which was then soldered to an iron base. This proved to be somewhat flimsy, as you rightly point out, and less than ideal in the field. Later, the rolled brass case was replaced by a solid brass version which remedied the problem somewhat.

I honestly don't know, off the top of my head, the make or models of guns used by Holmes and Watson to dispatch the dreaded hound, or even if we are given any clues in the text to help us. Will have to dig out my copy tonight and have a look. They would have been revolvers of course. I seem to remember them both firing a shot each at the hound as it bounded past them, then Holmes emptying five rounds into the beast as it attacked Sir Henry. Any of the revolvers mentioned in the previous post could fit the bill, but I couldn't say for sure.

Best Wishes,

Zodiac.

[Robert]

Ah, that would be Sherlock Holmes versus K9.

[Graham]

The Musgrave Ritual - one of the better stories IMHO.

221b Baker Street must've been built of stern stuff to withstand the repeated impact of .45's fired at close range.

Is the Martini-Henry Rifle the same as in Rorkes Drift fame? I remember seeing a documentary about this battle, and they were turning up brass cartridge-cases all over the place. I was surprised at how thin the brass was, very flimsy.

What kind of gun(s) do you reckon Holmes and Watson used to knock off the Hound?

Graham

[Zodiac]

Boxer Cartridge.

Re: guns, Watson reported that there was a large and patriotic "VR" in bullet pocks over the fireplace at 221B, courtesy of Holmes' target-practice with a box of Boxer cartidges...is Boxer a trade-name or a type of cartridge?

Graham

Hi Graham,

Yes, Watson mentions it in "The Musgrave Ritual".

"I have always held, too, that pistol practice should be distinctly an open-air pastime; and when Holmes, in one of his queer humours, would sit in an armchair with his hair-trigger and a hundred Boxer cartridges and proceed to adorn the opposite wall with a patriotic V. R. done in bullet-pocks, I felt strongly that neither the atmosphere nor the appearance of our room was improved by it."

The pistol in question may have been a Beaumont-Adams revolver, chambered for the .450 Boxer Mk I pistol cartridge. This was the standard issue British army service revolver from 1868 to 1880, when it replaced by the .476 Enfield MkI/II. (The boxer no longer been considered a viable military round). These were themselves replaced by the .455 Webley MkI service revolver in 1887. Interestingly though, while it may have fallen out of favour for military use, the .450 Boxer would remain a very popular round on the civilian market.

Just to confuse the issue even more, , despite their stated differences in caliber, both the .476 Enfield and the .455 Webley revolvers would also happily fire the cheaper .450 Boxer Cartridge! So Holmes could have been using either of these too!!! I don't know what Mrs Hudson must have thought!

Best wishes,

Zodiac.

P.S. The above pistol cartridge should not be confused with the much more powerful Short Chamber Boxer-Henry .450 cartridge, which was a rifle round, most famously used in the Martini-Henry Rifle and Carbine.

[Baron of the High Rips]

"Maybe we'll see Sherlock Holmes versus the Daleks yet..."

Or Sherlock Holmes versus the Ciphermen.

I'm actually going to be in a very Holmesian Doctor Who play at the end of September called Hellblossom

[Zodiac]

I justed moved down the road from Arthur Conan Doyle's old house in South Norwood, SE25 and according to one of my friends who works on behalf of Croydon's Historical Society says that ACD wrote a murder mystery set there. Anyone ever heard of it?

Hi Baron,

The Adventure of the Norwood Builder.

Best wishes,

Zodiac.

[Robert]

"Maybe we'll see Sherlock Holmes versus the Daleks yet..."

Or Sherlock Holmes versus the Ciphermen.

[Baron of the High Rips]

They are cartridges for a 22 calibre carbine, a boxer henry. They were standard ammo for the time as they were used during The Anglo-Zulu War and the Anglo-Afghan War, which the latter Dr Watson served and was subsequently shot in.

Otherwise I justed moved down the road from Arthur Conan Doyle's old house in South Norwood, SE25 and according to one of my friends who works on behalf of Croydon's Historical Society says that ACD wrote a murder mystery set there. Anyone ever heard of it?

[Graham]

Re: guns, Watson reported that there was a large and patriotic "VR" in bullet pocks over the fireplace at 221B, courtesy of Holmes' target-practice with a box of Boxer cartidges...is Boxer a trade-name or a type of cartridge?

Graham

[Natalie Severn]

I agree with you Chris.I found it fascinated me-partly because of the acrobatics with the camera and the interesting shots from the top floors of buildings etc -especially where the City butts onto Whitechapel and new and old mingle and converge unexpectedly.But the plot seemed a bit overwrought and strained,I must admit.

[Chris]

Going back to Sherlock, much as I liked the first episode, I'm afraid the second fell far short of it. It had its points - and again took a big chunk of the plot from Conan Doyle in the form of the book cipher from The Valley of Fear - and was entertaining enough in its way, but somehow it seemed a lot sillier and more lightweight.

I was almost expecting the Tardis to appear and save the day. Maybe we'll see Sherlock Holmes versus the Daleks yet...

[Zodiac]

Thanks very much for that, Zodiac. A dog it is then.

Best wishes,
Steve.

P.S. You seem to know a lot about guns... and they never did catch the Zodiac did they... Mummy!

LOL!!!!

The Zodiac.

[Steven Russell]

Bull pups

Thanks very much for that, Zodiac. A dog it is then.

Best wishes,
Steve.

P.S. You seem to know a lot about guns... and they never did catch the Zodiac did they... Mummy!