World Reacts to Trump's "****hole Countries" Remark

[ChrisGeorge]

If the man wants Norwegians.. I humbly suggest Norway send him one they don't particularly care for..
Anders Behring Breivik.
The pair would get on like a house on fire.


Phil

Ha ha, well said, Phil.

On another front, Chelsea "champions" in what century?

Chesrs

Chris

[Pcdunn]

Are we supposed to like corrupt countries who try to dump their problems on us?

Like England, who sent petty criminals to the American colonies as bond-servants? All right, an unfair example, as we weren't our own nation at that time.

Perhaps you mean Ireland, Russia, or Mexico? All of them were countries with less than effective governmental responses to economic, religious, and political crises. To my knowledge, though, only some Irish were "dumped" on the United States by the Anglo-Irish government during the Great Potato Famine, being court-ordered to be sent on ships across the Atlantic.

Most immigrant Irish-Catholics in the mid-nineteenth-century, Russian Jews in the early-twentieth-century, and Mexicans of current times came to escape intolerable conditions at home on their own, from what I have read.

I do agree that corrupt governments are a problem, and wish Mexico would take care of its own people.

[Phil Carter]

Ha ha, well said, Phil.

On another front, Chelsea "champions" in what century?

Chesrs

Chris

Thanks Chris.

We are the current champions. Until City wrap up this year's Premier League that is. ☺

I believe its Liverpool or Spurs who haven't won THIS century.. ...oops! 😅


Phil

[Pcdunn]

Sure, I can agree with the fact that quotas have been used to limit immigrants based on race. I will agree with you there. Will you agree that certain groups have also been let in en masse to bolster the Democratic Party on election day? Personally im in favour of quotas for a variety of reasons, one of them being to keep in check mass migration of certain groups. Everything else being equal best to allow in a wide variety of national and racial groups. Immigrants are usually more easily integrated that way. No more lottery or chain migration. Why take Haiti off the TPS list? Probably because Haitian immigrants will add half a million Democratic voters within a generation.


Im fairly confident Trump will answer Yes, they can be let in if they meet the merit requirements. Then again I don't see Trump as overtly racist, but he probably does view the immigration issue as most politicians view it - as a way of winning or losing elections. Do you really, really think Dems would be so pro-immigration from poor countries if these immigrants were likely to vote Republican? I realise all this can sound a bit racist on my part. However, I prefer to see it all as political self interest.

Im struck by how those closest to Trump by and large agree he isn't racist but those furthest from him insist he is racist. Those furthest from him somehow attempt to read his mind despite multiplie decades of Trump's close friendships and close dealings with African Americans.

As you can perhaps tell im not opposed to those who suggest there is a racial/electoral element to Trump's immigration policy but I don't think Trump himself is racist. That's why I think a merit based system is only as racist as you or I wish to perceive it as.

Wow, Jason, quite a lot to respond to, here. I'm not aware that "certain groups" were EVER "let in en masse to bolster the Democratic Party on election day," as you have said, so I cannot agree with that. Could you possibly offer an example of what you mean, or a source for this information? (I do know, of course, that Irish and Irish-Americans generally voted Democratic, but was there a definitive connection?) Speaking of "mass immigrations" being kept in check, that was what the American Nativists (Know-Nothings) wanted at various points in our history.

I am not aware of Trump's "friendships and close business dealings with African-Americans," though I have read that he tried to exclude blacks as renters in his properties. Do you have examples or sources?

[jason_c]

Wow, Jason, quite a lot to respond to, here. I'm not aware that "certain groups" were EVER "let in en masse to bolster the Democratic Party on election day," as you have said, so I cannot agree with that. Could you possibly offer an example of what you mean, or a source for this information? (I do know, of course, that Irish and Irish-Americans generally voted Democratic, but was there a definitive connection?) Speaking of "mass immigrations" being kept in check, that was what the American Nativists (Know-Nothings) wanted at various points in our history.

I am not aware of Trump's "friendships and close business dealings with African-Americans," though I have read that he tried to exclude blacks as renters in his properties. Do you have examples or sources?

Sorry, but I think you are bordering upon deliberately shoving your head in the sand here. I openly admitted Republicans are anti-immigration partly due to electoral reasons. I wish you could as easily admit the Democratic Party as just as bad on the opposite side. It would aid our discourse so much if you could admit BOTH parties are full of vested interest sh*tbags. Of course there will not be many official memos or emails(but we have occasional ones below) from the Democratic Party that suggest they are pro-immigration because it benefits them electorally. However, we do know that a majority of immigrants do vote Democratic, this will be a larger majority within poorer immigrants. We do have centrist Democratic Party tenet of the Emerging Democratic Majority.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...rns-10/265005/

"Minority voters increased their share of the voting population. Voters in 2012 were 28 percent minority, an increase of 2 percentage points from the 2008 level and a massive 13 percentage point increased from the 1988 level of 15 percent. The share of African-American voters remained at its 2008 level, 13 percent, disproving predictions that black voter enthusiasm would flag and black voters would not turn out for the president a second time. Hispanics, in line with their growing share of the electorate, increased their share at the polls to 10 percent from 8.5 percent in 2008 -- and did so despite similar skepticism about their level of voter enthusiasm. Asian Americans, now America's fastest growing minority group, also increased their share of voters, from 2 to 3 percent."

"Minority voters imaintained their overwhelming support for Obama. Minority voters backed Obama 80 percent to 18 percent in 2008 -- and did exactly the same for the president this year. His support among African-Americans was almost as overwhelming (93-6) as it was in 2008 (95-4). And his support among Hispanics (71-27) improved substantially over its 2008 level (67-31). In addition, Obama achieved historic levels of support among Asian-Americans. This year he carried them 73-26, compared to 62-35 in 2008."

If you believe that both Democratic AND Republican eggheads and tacticians do not minutely study these numbers then I have a bridge to sell you. I can promise you beyond my own reasonable doubt that Democrats gleefully rub their hands at these numbers. The current Dem Party immigration policy is based upon this electoral benefit. So much so that the white working class are often predicted to be dying out. When the prediction comes from Democrats it does not come with a sad face smilie.

Recently we had this leaked email/memo below from Clintons former Communications Director about Dreamers “The fight to protect Dreamers is not only a moral imperative, it is also a critical component of the Democratic Party’s future electoral success,”. If Dreamers are critical to the Democratic Party's future electoral success you can safely assume past immigration policies were critical to the Dem Party's success too.

http://www.newsweek.com/daca-memo-de...outrage-775988

Believe me once again when I say this is not a recent flash of inspiration from the Democratic Party. It has been a long-term tactic.

I'll try to find some of Trump's business and personal links to minority and African-American communities for you soon.

[Phil Carter]

My last comment comes after the U-turn made today by President Trump.
In front of the press hoards, he was asked again who he would let in to the USA.
"I want them to come from everywhere... Everywhere".

Now..not being politically minded..nor trying to be too judgemental...I was struck by this "all inclusive comment" which suddenly, apparently, welcomes ALL peoples from ALL nations. Now..perhaps I am wrong..but hasn't this man been using much of the last year restricting people from certain countries trying yo come to the USA? Iraki and other nationalities will be delighted in his new statement...Oh... And by the way...he wont be building THAT wall either.. because Mexicans are also included in this most generous welcome to come to the USA.

"Everywhere"

I'm sure the Yemeni, Palestinians, Haitians, Somalians and for that matter ANY predominantly religiously muslim country are delighted too!!!.

Even the French are welcome.

Apparently.


Happy New Year America. Only three more years to go. ☺



Phil

[Svensson]

Only three more years to go. ☺

I highly doubt it..

[ChrisGeorge]

My last comment comes after the U-turn made today by President Trump.
In front of the press hoards, he was asked again who he would let in to the USA.
"I want them to come from everywhere... Everywhere".

Now..not being politically minded..nor trying to be too judgemental...I was struck by this "all inclusive comment" which suddenly, apparently, welcomes ALL peoples from ALL nations. Now..perhaps I am wrong..but hasn't this man been using much of the last year restricting people from certain countries trying yo come to the USA? Iraki and other nationalities will be delighted in his new statement...Oh... And by the way...he wont be building THAT wall either.. because Mexicans are also included in this most generous welcome to come to the USA.

"Everywhere"

I'm sure the Yemeni, Palestinians, Haitians, Somalians and for that matter ANY predominantly religiously muslim country are delighted too!!!.

Even the French are welcome.

Apparently.


Happy New Year America. Only three more years to go. ☺



Phil

Hello Phil

The man is a hypocrite. He will say anything at any time to advantage himself. Then immediately afterwards in another venue he contradicts himself.

On the campaign trail, he assured African Americans and Haitian immigrants that he would be their champion.

He declares, "I am the least bigoted person you will ever meet. I assure you."

His words and actions demonstrate such declarations to be lies and not what is truly in his heart. Trump is a slug.

Best regards

Chis

[c.d.]

And let's not forget that he has stated that no one has more respect for women than he does. Uh huh. A little hard to believe when his strategy for winning the affections of the fairer sex is to simply grab them by their *****.

c.d.

[Pcdunn]

Sorry, but I think you are bordering upon deliberately shoving your head in the sand here. I openly admitted Republicans are anti-immigration partly due to electoral reasons. I wish you could as easily admit the Democratic Party as just as bad on the opposite side. It would aid our discourse so much if you could admit BOTH parties are full of vested interest sh*tbags. Of course there will not be many official memos or emails(but we have occasional ones below) from the Democratic Party that suggest they are pro-immigration because it benefits them electorally. However, we do know that a majority of immigrants do vote Democratic, this will be a larger majority within poorer immigrants. We do have centrist Democratic Party tenet of the Emerging Democratic Majority.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...rns-10/265005/

"Minority voters increased their share of the voting population. Voters in 2012 were 28 percent minority, an increase of 2 percentage points from the 2008 level and a massive 13 percentage point increased from the 1988 level of 15 percent. The share of African-American voters remained at its 2008 level, 13 percent, disproving predictions that black voter enthusiasm would flag and black voters would not turn out for the president a second time. Hispanics, in line with their growing share of the electorate, increased their share at the polls to 10 percent from 8.5 percent in 2008 -- and did so despite similar skepticism about their level of voter enthusiasm. Asian Americans, now America's fastest growing minority group, also increased their share of voters, from 2 to 3 percent."

"Minority voters imaintained their overwhelming support for Obama. Minority voters backed Obama 80 percent to 18 percent in 2008 -- and did exactly the same for the president this year. His support among African-Americans was almost as overwhelming (93-6) as it was in 2008 (95-4). And his support among Hispanics (71-27) improved substantially over its 2008 level (67-31). In addition, Obama achieved historic levels of support among Asian-Americans. This year he carried them 73-26, compared to 62-35 in 2008."

If you believe that both Democratic AND Republican eggheads and tacticians do not minutely study these numbers then I have a bridge to sell you. I can promise you beyond my own reasonable doubt that Democrats gleefully rub their hands at these numbers. The current Dem Party immigration policy is based upon this electoral benefit. So much so that the white working class are often predicted to be dying out. When the prediction comes from Democrats it does not come with a sad face smilie.

Recently we had this leaked email/memo below from Clintons former Communications Director about Dreamers “The fight to protect Dreamers is not only a moral imperative, it is also a critical component of the Democratic Party’s future electoral success,”. If Dreamers are critical to the Democratic Party's future electoral success you can safely assume past immigration policies were critical to the Dem Party's success too.

http://www.newsweek.com/daca-memo-de...outrage-775988

Believe me once again when I say this is not a recent flash of inspiration from the Democratic Party. It has been a long-term tactic.

I'll try to find some of Trump's business and personal links to minority and African-American communities for you soon.

Thanks for your reply, Jason. Of course politics are about getting votes, and politicians have always appealed to various ethnic groups, and minority groups, too. Politics use tactics, just as businesses do, and the military, etc. So what?

What I'm having trouble understanding is whether you think "immigrants" automatically equate to "Democrats"? I mean, that is a personal choice, isn't it, at least for the half of American voters who do vote? There are black and immigrant people who vote Republican, surely?

Could it not be, in reality, that poor and minority people vote Democratic because that is the party who cares about people who aren't rich and white?

[DirectorDave]

There are black and immigrant people who vote Republican, surely?

Could it not be, in reality, that poor and minority people vote Democratic because that is the party who cares about people who aren't rich and white?

And is that not why Trump won? Because poor people and non-white people did vote for him?

He appealed to the poor and people of colour in the exact same way as Obama did.

I think that is part of the democratic party's problem, thinking that they can do their virtue signalling and the poor huddled masses will vote for them?

And the whole Hillary campaign of "We've not had a woman president, I'm a woman, vote for me!" I'm not surprised that the very demographic she was from thought that was patronising told her to bolt and voted for Trump.

[jason_c]

Thanks for your reply, Jason. Of course politics are about getting votes, and politicians have always appealed to various ethnic groups, and minority groups, too. Politics use tactics, just as businesses do, and the military, etc. So what?

What I'm having trouble understanding is whether you think "immigrants" automatically equate to "Democrats"? I mean, that is a personal choice, isn't it, at least for the half of American voters who do vote? There are black and immigrant people who vote Republican, surely?

Could it not be, in reality, that poor and minority people vote Democratic because that is the party who cares about people who aren't rich and white?

Are you as casual about politicians appealing to blue collar white voters as you are about them appealing to minorities? Im personally in favour of politicians appealing to anyone they so wish(even if I disagree with their policy positions). If possible I'd like you to clarify your position on this.

Do I think immigrants automatically equate to Democrats? No, not in their entirety but when 70%-80% of them vote Democrat they are as good as a Democratic block vote. I do not think I am alone in this belief. The Democratic Party view them as good as a block vote. They are part of the Democrat base.

I have made no comment or judgement on the "how or why" immigrants vote Democrat. Im going to assume they vote Democrat for a variety of reasons. My point simply was that immigrants(esp poor ones) vote Democrat. Democrats know this; Republicans know this. Any policy position either party takes on the issue of immigration is going to reflect this fact. This is a major factor in why Republicans are generally hard on immigration and Democrats in favour. If you favour Democrats position on immigration then fine but lets not pretend vote counting isn't front and centre of the policy differences between the parties on immigration. Of course neither party would explicitly admit all this but as adults I think we both know it to be true.

[ChrisGeorge]

And is that not why Trump won? Because poor people and non-white people did vote for him?

He appealed to the poor and people of colour in the exact same way as Obama did.

I think that is part of the democratic party's problem, thinking that they can do their virtue signalling and the poor huddled masses will vote for them?

And the whole Hillary campaign of "We've not had a woman president, I'm a woman, vote for me!" I'm not surprised that the very demographic she was from thought that was patronising told her to bolt and voted for Trump.

On the campaign trail, candidate Trump told African Americans and Haitian immigrants in Little Haiti, Miami, Florida, that he would be their primo champion "I can assure you. . . believe me."

His subsequent words and actions show that to be a lie. Most politicians lie to an extent but this man is in a category all his own. Unbelievable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3_S23KlMMk

[Svensson]

Well, after the shithouse/shithole (take your pick) comments from Trump, it seems he is following up his talk with actions.

Let month, he rescinded Temporary Visas for 60,000 Haitians (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/20/u...y-status.html).

Yesterday, he moved to block Haitians from applying for certain Visas:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration-haiti/trump-administration-bars-haitians-from-u-s-visas-for-low-skilled-work-idUSKBN1F702O

In isolation, nothing too dramatic but there is certainly a pattern now. I would rather have the press concentrate on Trump's action than his words as this is where there are plenty of skeletons (IMHO).

[DirectorDave]

On the campaign trail, candidate Trump told African Americans and Haitian immigrants in Little Haiti, Miami, Florida, that he would be their primo champion "I can assure you. . . believe me."

His subsequent words and actions show that to be a lie. Most politicians lie to an extent but this man is in a category all his own. Unbelievable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3_S23KlMMk

But this is what I'm trying to point out to you, he was talking to Haitian's and African American's already in the USA.

The mistake you are making again is to group people as all the same based on ethnicity.

The idea that you are Haitian or Black and that means you will automatically want people to jump the immigration que is infantile thinking.

How is stopping people from from cheating the system not looking out for their interests?

Assuming that people of colour do not want a fair and sensible process of immigration is as patronising as telling someone to vote a certain way because they share a gender with a candidate.