The Shroud Of Turin

[Shelley]

Adam's Calendar, 285,000 years old

Michael Tellinger, Adam's Calendar : http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/su...annunaki35.htm

and this one from Andrew Collins : http://www.andrewcollins.com/page/ar...sa_4_adams.htm

http://www.michaeltellinger.com/adams-calendar.php

[Shelley]

Worship

It would indeed be a confused issue to regard that worship of a Jesus in Christendom is the only worship allowed, as in worship of one god in Jesus, in view of the early Christians practicing donkey worship , with 2nd century archaeology evidence of the alexamenos graffito, here :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexamenos_graffito

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onolatry

The Donkey is from the horse family, such as donkey, pony, horse. Horse worship was with Hindi and Hinduism and held a ceremony as symbolic between vedic queens and the horse.

[Shelley]

Hindi ~ Bine

http://dict.hinkhoj.com/words/meaning-of-BINE-in-hindi.html

interesting that Bine is Hindi and also that Ka is Ancient Egyptian especially with what Michael Tellinger has found in Africa, the oldest civilization known yet to man, first dated around 75,000 years old, now more recently dated to 285,000 years old, which he claims is of the ancient egyptians and further on down from those circles is the hindi remnants from the vedas and hindusm aged at 50,000 years old, both not that far apart and in Africa.

[Shelley]

Ancient Egyptian ~ Soul

There were 5 components within the Ancient religious concepts of Egypt and the human soul, here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient...pt_of_the_soul

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rF183BKRGo

[Shelley]

Ka is Ancient Egyptian

Sanhedrin record 43, or 43a a word used " Bine-ka "

[Shelley]

Jesus & Mary ~ Sanhedrin records

You could have a point Harry with Pilate, the fact is in the Sanhedrin under record 43, there is a record of an actual Jesus and a mother named Mary, whom some of the Jews claimed was a magician and born out of wedlock to a slovenly mother named Mary.

Pilate was under pressure by Cesar in Rome to maintain peace with the Jews, even though the Romans heavily oppressed the Jews with taxation and the Jews were not happy with pagan accepting king Herod whom the Romans had placed in Judea as king of the Jews. Personally i think the Romans favored Herod because he was marvelous and useful as an architect, very talented in that area, Romans were fond of building, ordering and taking control as they thought themselves as the only ones civilized, everyone else being barbarians to the Romans. many Jews of that time of king Herod were unhappy with his paganized temples, the main complaint being the famous * Aqueduct * from the Romans that the Jews didn't have enough money to pay for and were unhappy, after all that was what the Romans bleated on about, but when you take a look at all the taxation, Jews amongst other people were stopped on the streets, on the spot and charged for carrying this scroll, this religious item and that item, it wouldn't surprise me if mistakes were made and people were getting charged twice or more for carrying the same item, if that happened then being disgruntled would certainly follow, however even without those kinds of mistakes happening, it was not nice being so heavily taxed for everything carried. I mean it is rather crafty to be making money out of other peoples religion now isn't it, rather than just your own pagan one as was regarded by monotheism at the time, and at that time the Jews were a patriarchal system, not a matriarchal system as it was previously. But as the Jews would have it the biblical Jesus was a different Jesus and a different mother to that of number 43 of the Sanhedrin record, that this Mary would not have given birth to Jesus out of wedlock, so the Jews would claim. As they say, if that Mary had given birth out of wedlock she would have been stoned as a punishment. Marriage for Jews at that time was about ownership of a female, if she had grounds for a divorce but the husband didn't she lost and he won because he was a male, indeed marriage & divorce was only for the men to decide not the females, females had to suffer if that was the case with the men in her community and of course her husband. How thoroughly egotistical and repugnant i find that one! So the Jesus of the bible is probably not the same Jesus of 43 of the Sanhedrin. Although the Jews cried out for a Jesus to be crucified, the Romans dealt with it, because there isn't a proper procedure that the Sanhedrin regarded of the biblical Jesus, the Crucifixion mentioned in the bible was done in haste and not by Jewish standards of a time period by the Sanhedrin methods, so probably between the romanised bible and the Jews, they are probably not talking about the same Jesus.
personally i think the biblical Jesus was a Jesus that was perhaps different to both Jew and roman after all. It just kind of got lost in translation way back in history.

http://www.come-and-hear.com/sanhedrin/sanhedrin_43.html

[Harry D]

For what it's worth, I believe Jesus to be an historical person. He was a mystic who underwent a profound experience of spiritual enlightenment which naturally caused many to flock to his cause. The Jews were fearful that the growing popularity of this rabble-rouser might draw the ire of Rome and therefore handed him over to Pilate, whereupon he had a mock trial and was sentenced to death. Pilate's portrayal as a reluctant executioner giving into the crowd was clearly a work of fiction. Pilate reputedly had no qualms about sending Jewish rebels to their deaths whether they were guilty or not.

[Shelley]

rare disorders ~ making a corpse

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ely-alive.html

http://io9.com/5547673/5-real-diseas...-like-a-zombie

http://www.oddee.com/item_98718.aspx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cotard_delusion

yes, and i have heard the term from some people, this : " Zombie God ".

[Shelley]

Christondom

Resurrection has never been proven fact as far as i know, a rare disorder of where people have been thought to be dead, just by memory a woman woke up in a morgue banging on the door, she was obviously in there because they thought that she was or could be dead.

As for Jesus Christ that Christendom claims through the Orthodox and Catholic Church primarily, how can anyone with absolute proof and certainty state, that the Jesus Christ of Christendom is actually The Christ that their holy book claims and their churches claim, it is only a belief, not solid evidence or fact ( And i wanna be a poe ! ) belief is a dualism, it could be right or it could be wrong. However, modern forensics which gain more credibility towards solid evidence and proof to assertain that it would be a fact and not a fiction, where was this available in AD 33? Because as far as i know this type of forensic evidence wasn't around in AD 33 for the Turin Shroud, as far as i am aware even the Catholic Church will not say anything as towards a claim that the Turin Shroud is the shroud of the Jesus Christ they uphold in their church.

[Shelley]

Interesting

It's interesting as far as anyone can see about a death by Crucifixion, but over all it is just about blood, bad dna samples, breathings, secondary drownings, excruciating painful methods of dying ( almost certainly ! ) and a lot of heat like what you would find as a milder case of a traumatized abused BDSM or S & M victim. A very good piece was textiles to date the material which was 1st century ~ In the timeline period of AD 33.

[Harry D]

I'd love to know the process involved in making the 'Shroud', since we can safely say it is not the burial cloth of Buddy Christ (or anyone else for that matter). If it was an authentic burial cloth, it wouldn't have a perfect print of the subject's body, and the pose of the figure is impossible to replicate.

[Patrick S]

Interesting to see the shroud discussed here. JtR, Turin Shroud, Zodiac, Pyramids, a few of my recurring areas of fascination over the past thirty-some years.

I find it interesting to observe the desire by the masses - both contemporary and ancient - interested in topics 'shrouded' (sorry) in mysteries such as these to ascribe them to well known or famous individuals.

Shroud = The Ripper

DaVinci = Walter Sickert

Of course we also have the personalization aspect, as well. "My father was......" In fact, I saw a news story today that the Zodiac case has been "solved" by a man who discovered that is own, sweet, dearly departed dad was the Zodiac. As best I could tell, the primary evidence seems to be that his dad looked like a police sketch of Zodiac after the Lake Barryessa attack.

[Sunbury]

i tend to agree but I am more cynical. Bishops needed big Cathedrals to be important and they needed money. The towns needed pilgrims as a source of income also. An example is the monks at Glastonbury Abbey "found" the remains of "King Arthur" suddenly whilst renovating and needing funds.

The Bishop of Chartres had the "Sancta Camisa", believed to be the tunic worn by the Blessed Virgin Mary at the time of Christ's birth. When the old Cathedral was burnt down, the monks miraculously found it a few days later in the ruins.

Anyone looking at history of the Shroud should study Chartres Cathedral history. The Church back then was not all cherubs and niceness. The Bishop of Chartres went on the Fourth Crusade against the Cathars in Southern France specifically to loot to get monies to build the new Cathedral. That Cathedral still stands and I have visited it, it is awe inspiring, it's early history though is black.

[RivkahChaya]

Surely not a hobby for the common people? Paper and cloth were neither one cheap at the time.

No-- I don't think they did much but work and sleep. I mean among people who could afford to have hobbies. My point was it was a known technique for making an image.

[Ginger]

People made paper and cloth relief rubbings all the time then. It was a common hobby in the Middle Ages.

Surely not a hobby for the common people? Paper and cloth were neither one cheap at the time.