Reincarnation

[Graham]

I hadn't realised what was censored. i thought you were insulting your cat!
Gabs

Yes, I'd forgotten that Americans (and maybe others, as I don't think you're American) refer to their pets as "kitty-cats", which in the UK is a particular make of cat-food or, if you remove the letter 'y', a rather tasty chocolate-biscuity snack. I am fully aware of what p-u-s-s-y means in Americanese - the same here, except we have much more colourful words to describe that part of the female anatomy.

If I ever insulted my beautiful Joolz, he'd go into a 3-day huff.

Graham

[prowling cat]

I hadn't realised what was censored. i thought you were insulting your cat!
Gabs

[Archaic]

"Deep Thoughts"

Pretty funny, Sam. I had my first censorship experience the other day- I tried to write "shuttlecock" on another thread, and it was asteriked out- which made me laugh because the "naughty bit" hadn't even occurred to me until then! So I just took out the hyphen & then it was fine.

I'm not sure about Reincarnation, but I do believe animals go to Heaven. (They better!! How could it be Heaven without them?)

I really recommend that Peter Novak website to anyone who's curious about these kinds of questions. His basic premise is that the soul has a "dual" nature, which can be thought of in terms of paired complements such as Soul/Spirit, Yin/Yang, Conscious/Unconscious, Ka/Ba , etc.
During our lives we either integrate and become "One" or we fracture our divided selves further. (There are references to this in the Holy Books of many cultures) If we are "splitting apart" during life instead of integrating, we may suffer the dread "second death" after passing. This mysterious event is also spoken of in many different faiths. Novak believes it is the moment in which our "twin aspects of soul" separate completely & might even undergo annhiliation.

One cool aspect of this book is that it offers the very best explanation for certain phenomena such as hauntings or poltergeists that I have ever encountered: that they are essentially 'divided souls' with no objective self-awareness who have trapped themselves into "going through the motions" and now lack the coordinated mind & will to change their circumstances.

I can't possibly explain Peter Novak's whole theory here, but after reading that book, for the first time in my life I felt like I actually understood what Jesus really meant when He spoke those cryptic words, "Whosoever believeth in Me, though he die, yet shall he live;
but whosoever liveth and believeth in Me shall never die."

Novak uses a great deal of modern scientific research to back up his theory; for instance, "split brain" experiments in which the 2 halves of the human brain are prevented from communicating with each other. You don't have to agree with everything in his book for it to help you see beyond whatever 'paradigm' you were raised in... and once you grasp the fundamental concept, it's so SIMPLE, yet it's a whole new way of looking at life- and at death.

Celesta, I look forward to hearing your impressions once you've read it. Best regards to everyone, Archaic

[Sam Flynn]

PS: why has the word p-u-s-s-y been edited out?

... not "edited", Graham - more "neatly trimmed".

[rain]

If the spirit/soul is immortal, then one must assume that at the point of death the spirit/soul is transferred into a new life. If not, where does the spirit/soul go? Hopefully not to where my old boss is, the bastard, otherwise choir invisible, white raiment, etc., or not, he'll get my disembodied knee in his immortal balls.

Or am I being flippant?

Does my *****-cat Joolz get to be reincarnated, too?

Only asking.

Graham

PS: why has the word p-u-s-s-y been edited out? Small minds at work here?

as far as I know cats get reincarnated.

[Graham]

If the spirit/soul is immortal, then one must assume that at the point of death the spirit/soul is transferred into a new life. If not, where does the spirit/soul go? Hopefully not to where my old boss is, the bastard, otherwise choir invisible, white raiment, etc., or not, he'll get my disembodied knee in his immortal balls.

Or am I being flippant?

Does my *****-cat Joolz get to be reincarnated, too?

Only asking.

Graham

PS: why has the word p-u-s-s-y been edited out? Small minds at work here?

[Celesta]

Hey Archaic. I got it! $5 less than the price the bookstore wanted for it, incldg the postage. They also have some used ones for less than $3. Thank you again. I'm looking forward to this.

[Celesta]

Good deal, Archaic! Thanks. I wonder if they'll do paypal. Thank you.

Bestest, Cel

[Archaic]

http://www.amazon.com/Lost-Secret-Death-Divided-Afterlife/dp/1571743243/ref=ntt_at_ep_dpi_1

Hi, Celesta; I found 'The Lost Secret of Death' on our US Amazon.com- only $6.75 new!

My own copy of Novak is so dog-eared that I should buy another one, but I just realized I currently have 39 Books on my Amazon 'Wish List' right now!!!

Time to go buy a $1 Lottery ticket and see if I can afford to spend the whole rest of my life reading.
Regards, Archaic

[Celesta]

Have you noticed that it's all the big monotheistic faiths that may exclude the idea of universal spirit? I'm sure there's something worth pursuing there!

Jane x

Ah-ha! Yes. The concept detracts from their core message---salvation through a single deity and his messenger. Yet to me God is the universal spirit. The spirit that moves through all things, as Tom Brown put it.

[Jane Welland]

Yes...

Have you noticed that it's all the big monotheistic faiths that may exclude the idea of universal spirit? I'm sure there's something worth pursuing there!

Pantheistic religions typically include animals in their pantheon - Egyptian, Greek, Roman, etc. Yet we traditionally consider at least two of these cultures to be at the height of ancient sophistication.

Possibly, there are links between the type of culture a society expresses and the type of religious faith it favours - I'll be off to consider that one!

Jane x

[Celesta]

I'm not sure what gets reborn. Some people claim that the soul and the spirit are two different things. Maybe the spirit is the essence of existence and the vehicle for the soul. The Druids believed that there really was no death, and that death was just a passage from one form to another. I think these people were tuned into a larger scale of existence than most people today are even willing to recognize. I don't know of any tradition outside of Christianity, Judaism, or Islam, that does not believe strongly that all beings have a spirit. Native American spirituality probably would not exist without that concept, as is probably true for other similar traditions. The old Druids, shamans, and other holy persons believed they could communicate with other levels of existence and with beings within those levels. I've always incorporated what made sense to me into my own view of the universe and the nature of life. It's all too big to be shut up into a narrow worldview.

[Jane Welland]

I agree, Celesta

The heart of life is spirit, and I don't think it resonates much differently from one critter to another.

Yes, that's what I think - I can't accept that animals don't have spirits, even though I've heard it argued many times that they haven't! I know some regious philosophies have it that animals don't have spirits - but I don't see how that works, exactly. I always think you should have the same regard for all living creatures. I re-incarnation is correct - then maybe we were once all animals - or plants even! I don't know, but it's interesting to wonder about it.

And on that - if re-incarnation is correct, then I'm not sure I know what it is that gets reborn - the obvious answer is the soul - but what does that mean? Do you think, for example, that if you had the memories of another person, it would mean that you were that person in the past? Or perhaps it isn't as simple as that!

Many questions, precious few answers!

Jane x

[Celesta]

For anybody who has ever pondered the nature of Human Life, Human Death, and the Human Soul,
I highly recommend a book by Peter Novak called 'The Lost Secret of Death.'
The first link is to Novak's website; the second link offers a couple of reviews of his book; one is by a PhD. This book is the follow-up to his book called 'Division of Consciousness'.

http://www.geocities.com/divisiontheory/

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Lost-Secret-Death-Divided-Afterlife/dp/1571743243

nd will expand so much that you will go up one full hat size!
Best regards, Archaic

Archaic, Thanks for the link, too. I stopped in at Barnes and Ignoble today, but they only had the book in their "warehouse." Looks like I may do some shopping around for it. Once again, thanks.

[Celesta]

Hi Jane,

That's pretty much the way it is with me, too. I've explored so many spiritual ways. I find that each time I do that it becomes a time of significant personal growth. I'm spending more time these days researching the history behind the various spiritual movements. There's something beyond this existence. I concur with the studies on plants, and I think you were dead on when you said this:

"Perhaps, being all made of the same stuff fundamentally, the human, animal and plant worlds aren't so far removed from one another as we might have thought."

The heart of life is spirit, and I don't think it resonates much differently from one critter to another.