Move to Murder: Who Killed Julia Wallace?

[WallaceWackedHer]

I can't agree with that statement, sorry. House breakers typically will avoid confrontation at all costs , and if disturbed will run a mile to escape the situation . Take James Hanratty as your average run of the mill burglar . He relied on cunning and stealth, caught a few times never carried a weapon are you confusing Liverpool UK with Liverpool New York?

You don't think crooks have anything on them in case things go south or they need to pry something open? One of my friends, for some reason, used to hang around with a guy who broke into houses. He would flee if caught (don't think he ever was though), but he never went into people's homes with just his bare hands.

And in any case we can see here that the perpetrator obviously DID act with violence, so evidently they had that mindset.

I would NEVER enter someone's home bare handed, that's pure madness. Robbery is obviously a very dangerous situation for the criminal, not only the victims. To go in with empty pockets is just insanity.

[Herlock Sholmes]

I should like for someone to post the full statement the residents at 27 Wolverton Street gave (I believe you identified them as the Holmes family)

From memory I believe that the surname was Holme rather than Holmes. I think that their names were Walter and Bertha.

[Herlock Sholmes]

The police knew Johnston had a key to access that home for one thing,

But did they?

Do we know for a fact that the Johnston’s key would have opened the Wallace’s door or was Johnston just offering to try his own key to see if it worked should Wallace have been unable to get in?

[Herlock Sholmes]

You have seen the 27 Wolverton Street statement I believe?

As far as I can recall no statements from the Johnston’s have been reproduced in books. They are DPP files (taken on 21st January) and so it would only have been someone that gained access like an author....so you need Antony (unless Rod has seen them...which is possible)

[WallaceWackedHer]

From memory I believe that the surname was Holme rather than Holmes. I think that their names were Walter and Bertha.

You are right and I have the quote here. Sadly this is a short statement, and does not then go on to either corroborate or deny the events that took place later:

Next door to the Wallace’s lived Mr and Mrs Holme at number 27. Mr Holme arrived back from work at 6.30 pm, and while he and his wife were having tea in the kitchen a noise was heard which attracted their attention. Mrs Holme asked her husband if someone was at their front door, Mr Holme replied that the sound came from the Wallace’s. Mrs Holme stated that it was like the sound of someone falling — shortly afterwards the front door of 29 was heard to close. Since it would have taken a few minutes for the Holmes to settle down to tea these times may be less than accurate. The sound of a falling body is distinct and the walls of the houses in Wolverton Street were thin. Certainly this disturbance was heard at a time when Wallace was still on the premises. Did, perhaps, Wallace leave by the front door at some time between 6.30 pm and 6.50 pm, and is that the reason why he gave differing accounts regarding the circumstance of his departure from the back door?

Bartle, Ronald. The Telephone Murder: The Mysterious Death of Julia Wallace (Kindle Locations 3388-3393). Waterside Press. Kindle Edition.

As we know, NONE of the Johnston family heard that, even Arthur literally adjacent to the room in which Julia was killed. So either they are mistaken about what they heard (the timings do seem off and more consistent with Alan Close's visit - though admittedly if someone asked me to time when certain events happened I could DEFINITELY not do so with any accuracy rofl), or the Johnston family are all deaf as doorposts.

It may well be that they are mistaken. However I don't see any mention of the apparent thuds coming from the direction of the parlor at 8.25 which the Johnstons believe they heard, if Mr. and Mrs. Holme had given any further information in their statement, that would have been helpful. They didn't hear the crashing cupboard door I assume? Evidently that was removed with some care, or days in advance.

[WallaceWackedHer]

But did they?

Do we know for a fact that the Johnston’s key would have opened the Wallace’s door or was Johnston just offering to try his own key to see if it worked should Wallace have been unable to get in?

They should have if they didn't. Another neighbor, Mr. Cadwallader (hope I spelt that correctly) had been able to wander into Wallace's home while drunk, mistaking it for his own house, causing Julia to scream. Mr. Cadwallader lived at 33 Wolverton street and was friends with Mr. Johnston. Cadwallader died so he couldn't have done it... But Johnston and other neighbors on the street were aware of the security issue.

[moste]

As far as I can recall no statements from the Johnston’s have been reproduced in books. They are DPP files (taken on 21st January) and so it would only have been someone that gained access like an author....so you need Antony (unless Rod has seen them...which is possible)

I just googled The Wallace Murder case. Outline.com and there is a complete rundown of the entire mystery which the author explains is completely unbiased to any of the possible suspects. Near the end we hear from the Johnston's grandchildren and how they know without doubt of their relations innocence in all of this.

[moste]

https://inacityliving.blogspot.com/2012/11/the-wallace-murder-case.html

[WallaceWackedHer]

I just googled The Wallace Murder case. Outline.com and there is a complete rundown of the entire mystery which the author explains is completely unbiased to any of the possible suspects. Near the end we hear from the Johnston's grandchildren and how they know without doubt of their relations innocence in all of this.

They didn't even have grandchildren in the home at the time (in fact, I think they didn't even have grandchildren at all at this time?). It was Arthur Mills, Norah, Robert and his girlfriend, John and Florence living there.

The call in on Wilkes is more legitimate IIRC as it might have been from someone who was in the home.

Though it's the same thing that produced the bullsh*t Parkes nonsense where he claimed Parry admitted he dropped an the iron bar down a grid (even though the bar was in fact behind the fireplace at 29 Wolverton Street - hence he's lying, obviously).

The only word we have as to the legitimacy (etc.) of the claims of the Johnstons is from members of their own family - and Wallace in regards to whatever happened at 8.45... They were off to visit her the night of the move? Allegedly they already had tonnes of stuff packed, why not take some of it with them that night to lighten the load for the next day instead of leaving the home empty handed?

Where are the statements of Norah, Francis McElroy, Arthur, Robert, and his girlfriend? Where is the FULL statement of 27 Wolverton. Where is the full statement of the widowed Cadwallader at 33 Wolverton? Do they match the testimony of Wallace and the Johnstons? Did they not hear any commotion at all when the body was discovered?

If Wallace was involved I think Gordon Parry was probably tricked into making that phone call under a false pretext, setting him up as a scapegoat. It didn't MATTER if Marsden had an alibi for the killing or not, either way the alias and false alibi heavily implicate Parry who is close friends with Marsden, and perhaps even Marsden via conspiracy to commit the deed, assuming a third assailant.

In other words, Gannon's theory (minus Wallace's involvement) is exactly what Wallace WANTED us to think if the housebreaker framing attempt fell through, in my view. It may also be correct, as I've always felt Marsden's alibi was pathetic...BUT recall Wallace had recently been ill, Julia was ill, Alan Close was ill - sounds like there was legitimately some sort of bug going around which does add slight credence. But of course it's dodgy.

You are aware Wallace had a well developed moustache? I forgot this fact, but that might ruin him if he got blood spray on his face (probably trickier to remove blood from any thick hair - DEFINITELY head hair but maybe thick moustaches/beards too?).

It's more conceivable he hit her in such a way that blood would spray AWAY from him, rather than him going Bateman in a raincoat, gloves and hat, then chucking the hat and gloves into the fire - though gloves would be crucial yes. APPARENTLY it was decided that there were no blood marks consistent with blood dripping off of a waterproof surface at the scene. Not sure as to the truth of that. And the staining of the jacket was heavy both inside and out... So was it used as protection or as a makeshift rag?

I don't really buy Tom's idea. I think stuff is being embezzled by him from what the actual words of the supposed confession really were (e.g. why was Julia in the parlor, how didn't she hear the cupboard door ripped off, or them going upstairs?) - Evidently she was killed first so if they really tried to rob the place they went to the parlor first. And even if he made it up they are still obviously suspect.

I initially thought the cash box was inside the cabinet. In crime scene photos though it appears to be on top of a shelf, which is way more blatant to a burglar. Lol. Conspicuous box 7 feet off the ground...

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I'm on the tricked Parry and scheming Wallace train, with Amy motive. Until corroborated by full statements from 27 and 33, I also think the Johnstons played a part. Even if only to show up at the scene at the right time to act as witness... Remember how long it took Johnston to fetch the police and for the police to arrive. Plenty of time for crime scene tampering.

Slemem also makes legitimately good points in his book, why is Florence so preoccupied with matches when her brain-oozing neighbor is lying there in front of her? Wallace wasn't the only unnaturally calm one that night, evidently.

I think people just hate that a guy who writes about Jesus being an extraterrestrial, and about lizard people etc, might actually have uncovered an important grain of truth about the case in a mere side chapter of one of his books

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Moving the next day is a practice which has been employed by other killers like Steuerman (the Bagel King), by the way... I don't know that the Johnstons killed her though. But I think like Parry they were possibly railroaded into doing SOMETHING by Wallace. There are other possibilities.

They have never been really explored as potential suspects before which is insane.

[WallaceWackedHer]

More newspaper reporting:

It is believed robbery was the motive, as for £4 treasury notes are missing from a box in the living room. The box was hidden behind some books on a shelf, and the assailant must have made an extensive search before finding it ... The woman's injuries might have been caused by an instrument such as a jemmy [crowbar].

...

The street has been visited by a burglar who has perpetrated more than a score of raids of houses in the neighbourhood.

I didn't before know the box was hidden behind books, and I am not sure if by "neighbourhood" they mean very close surrounding streets/Wolverton itself, or just the entirety of the Anfield district?

I believe it was said that aside from the home broken into in December, there was another on the street "12 or 18" months prior.

More on Amy:

Mrs. Wallace stated that she had no idea what she said to the Press representatives would be published. She thought when she admitted them into her home they were policemen.

The coroner said he had no doubt that if Mrs. Wallace would point out anything that was inaccurate, the Press would undoubtedly publish a correction.

Mrs. Wallace: I have not read it. I was too annoyed.

The Coroner: Did they say they were police? - No. They knocked at the door, and as I thought they were police, I admitted them. They then told me they belonged to a certain newspaper.

The Coroner: You did not start to give an account before they told you who they were? - No ; I was not giving an account. I thought they would say "Do you mind if we put this in the newspaper?"

On the crime:

Police believe that Mrs. Wallace was struck with a small heavy instrument which the murderer placed in his pocket.

...

It is thought to be certain that the murderer's clothes were saturated with blood, and that before making his escape, he went to the bathroom and washed himself.

...

The washing basin, along with pieces of piping and the kitchen sink, have been removed for microscopical examination [this turned up nothing].

A minute scrutiny of every part of the house including door knobs, floors, and carpets has been made.

Seems the doors in that home were all knobs, which would require turning, making it even more difficult to avoid getting either fingerprints or blood (from used gloves) upon them, unless all doors were left open, or two people were in the home.

[moste]

WWH. Quote: They didn't even have grandchildren in the home at the time (in fact, I think they didn't even have grandchildren at all at this time?). It was Arthur Mills, Norah, Robert and his girlfriend, John and Florence living there.
So you mean anything that could be gleaned from the grandchildren in the Johnston family would be useless on account of them not being there at the time?

[moste]

Quote:. The call in on Wilkes is more legitimate IIRC as it might have been from someone who was in the hoMe.

WILKES ! Wilkes thought Parry did it ,because Parkes said so!

[WallaceWackedHer]

WWH. Quote: They didn't even have grandchildren in the home at the time (in fact, I think they didn't even have grandchildren at all at this time?). It was Arthur Mills, Norah, Robert and his girlfriend, John and Florence living there.
So you mean anything that could be gleaned from the grandchildren in the Johnston family would be useless on account of them not being there at the time?

Their testimony is of course far more unreliable than a first hand account (and we see from Parkes that even "first hand accounts" can most definitely be fictionalized).

In fact, the testimony of anyone in that house is unreliable if the family were involved in any way, let alone grandkids lol.

This is why the testimonies of neighbors is a far more important factor.

Do you HONESTLY believe it's reasonable to suggest that the Johnstons can hear Amy through the walls with great clarity, and "gentle knocks" on the back door (which they considered "usual" - which I've already proven why it isn't), but not a woman being knocked down and then having her brains repeatedly bashed into the floor with an iron bar?

Arthur was literally in the front room bordering their parlor, that's where he lived and slept. Was he deaf? Where is his statement? Do the neighbors testimonies corroborate with the story given by the Johnstons/Wallace?

Why did Mr. Johnston tell the press Wallace had to force the door open?

Why didn't they bring some of their "already packed" luggage on their journey to their new home to lighten the load the following day?

Did the residents at 27 Wolverton Street hear Wallace knocking on the front door that was directly next to theirs? If not, then why (I wouldn't be surprised if Wallace really did knock though, to be safe)? Did anyone other than the Johnstons hear the commotion in the home when the body was discovered, or corroborate the times gived by Wallace and the Johnstons? Did anyone hear the heavy thuds at 8.25 that the Johnstons claimed to be coming from the parlor area? Not the residents at #33 (if it really was from their home) OR #27? If not, then why?

[WallaceWackedHer]

Quote:. The call in on Wilkes is more legitimate IIRC as it might have been from someone who was in the hoMe.

WILKES ! Wilkes thought Parry did it ,because Parkes said so!

Parry did not kill Julia. Parry also probably wouldn't have taken part in a plan to rob from his "friends" (Wallace claimed Parry was a personal friend of his and Julia's. We know Parry had given Wallace a calendar as a gift only a month earlier, Julia "doted" on him, etc.), and Wallace did not get him fired. Maybe he would betray friends of his? I don't know... But I think he's more the type to try and target a stranger's car or pinch pennies from a telephone.

Oh and with regards to the telephone. An engineer was called to the kiosk and there WAS A FAULT, which he fixed, other operators at the switchboard could not connect the call. So the idea that the caller was trying to scam a call is cast into SERIOUS doubt. So the only thing we have against Gordon Parry as the caller, is that he had a false alibi, and Beattie's assertion it was not Wallace's voice.

The portrayal of Parry in "The Man from the Pru" (available for free on YouTube) reminds me of this bit from the Simpsons lol:

Note the "out of the way" route Wallace took from his home to go to the chess club. He "may have posted a letter" but of course he cannot remember for sure.

If Parry called, I do not doubt that he was tricked into doing so under a false pretext. He was a perfect scapegoat indeed.

I also noticed (I saw it in the photo, but thought I might be mistaken somehow), that the Wallaces appear to have had one of those grid fireplace things. We used to have one when I was really little except the grid extended all the way up. Is that what it is? If so, I don't think you could burn something in there by accident. The grid design is created specifically for safety... Although we had like, a little cage around it as well because I was very, very young at the time.

[moste]

To make any kind of headway in a case as complex as this we would need reasonable accuracy on all issues . Take the given statement reported on from various sources , ' Wallaces insurance collection round consisted of 600 customers visited weekly. Really?
This was a personable chap who would have a little joke , a chat, maybe an occasional 'pop in for a cuppa' with his favourite customers.His rounds covered Clubmoor, Anfield , and districts in North Liverpool, that required him to take trams or buses to and from his home for lunch breaks. If what we have learned is his typical daily jaunt, he doesn't leave home untill 10 to 10.30 am. Pops back home around 1 30 pm. to 2 pm. then has an afternoon stint of perhaps 3 to 3 1/2 hours. I don't know if he worked all day Saturday, but in any event 600 Visits in a week is ( to borrow a WWH phrase, )Bullsh*t.