Move to Murder: Who Killed Julia Wallace?

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Originally posted by Ven View Post
    Ok, here's my earth shattering(?) view on the Julia Wallace murder.

    This paper I put together started out as a resource document, that morphed into the basis for a book/screenplay several months ago... but was unable to post it on Casebook. I had to write it this way to help me get my thoughts in order and explain how I think I happened. By reading the casebook threads I can see that all sorts of "possibilities" abound, however if you go down any of these paths then it also raises the possibility that a troop of travelling Ninjas committed the crime... just because there's no evidence against it seems to make it somewhat plausible. I have tried to stick to the evidence that is available from the trial transcript, witness statements, additional facts/comments made by you guys, etc.

    I am not a writer by trade and have tried to acknowledge all parties I have drawn information from. If what I have presented is not proper, please advise and I will redo to make it valid.

    I think you'll like this version Herlock... maybe not you WWH so much!
    I look forward to the constructive feedback!

    Cheers for that. Give me a minute I'll go through it.

    Parry is the man who placed the telephone call. Evidence does not support William as the caller except that the waitress (when the caller was purposefully putting on a gruff voice) thought it sounded like an older man. He'd have to have lied about his route before even knowing he'd been logged for it to even be possible.

    In the regular sounding voice heard by operators, they identified a local accent. But William grew up in Yorkshire, moving to Liverpool late in life, and would have had a different accent.

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  • MK114
    replied
    Yeah I vote for ninjas!

    Excellent point Ven you would make an outstanding defense attorney. We dont need facts or evidence. Maybe O. J. did it.

    I don't believe evidence is something some are concerned with.

    We can play what if's all night. The fact is over 90 percent of people are murdered by someone they know. Add in the victims of domestic homicide and it's even higher. The fact her husband is asking everyone what time it is and hes out looking for a address when he has never visited a client at their address and I believe we have our suspect. Then his goon buddy shows up to have his car cleaned with evidence of the crime in his vehicle.

    This is not a who dunnit.

    Respectfully,
    MK114

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  • Ven
    replied
    Ok, here's my earth shattering(?) view on the Julia Wallace murder.

    This paper I put together started out as a resource document, that morphed into the basis for a book/screenplay several months ago... but was unable to post it on Casebook. I had to write it this way to help me get my thoughts in order and explain how I think I happened. By reading the casebook threads I can see that all sorts of "possibilities" abound, however if you go down any of these paths then it also raises the possibility that a troop of travelling Ninjas committed the crime... just because there's no evidence against it seems to make it somewhat plausible. I have tried to stick to the evidence that is available from the trial transcript, witness statements, additional facts/comments made by you guys, etc.

    I am not a writer by trade and have tried to acknowledge all parties I have drawn information from. If what I have presented is not proper, please advise and I will redo to make it valid.

    I think you'll like this version Herlock... maybe not you WWH so much!
    I look forward to the constructive feedback!


    Leave a comment:


  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Also to add to the above I think it becomes important to point out this fact... That the Holme family statement suggests Alan Close knocked on the front door which was opened. About 5 minutes later they heard a sound like "somebody falling to the ground", then the door shut.

    Another thing:

    IF Julia was poisoned, that would mean she could have died ANYWHERE in the house, because there would be no blood (just maybe some furniture or ornaments knocked over - maybe that broken cabinet door and coins on the floor could be such a thing), she could be dragged into the parlor and THEN battered which would give the appearance she had died there.

    If she had died when taking in the milk but before returning the empty jars, she may have been in the kitchen.

    A slower acting poison, of course, could mean that she would be dead later, depending on how fast it acted, perhaps even while William was out. Do not forget he entered the home alone before his neighbors accompanied him. Do not forget his neighbors are potential suspects as well. But he could have administered the blows when he was in the house by himself. Although the blood in the body may not leak like that if she had been struck down too long after death. I do not know much about these things.

    But for certain, it would completely eliminate the niggling blood spatter problem. And as per the photos, I cannot for the life of me, no matter how much I zoom in, or even in the colorized image, find even a single speck of blood visible to my eye anywhere other than the pool around Julia which could well be expected to form even if her heart had already stopped beating and she was then bashed.

    ---

    ...There's also the possibility that she died from poisoning but the person harbored so much resentment towards her he couldn't help but bludgeon her. But paired with the crime scene, it's more along the lines of a burglary-gone-wrong staging.

    The blood "drop" in the toilet pan is certainly bigger and more prominent than any blood mark on the walls, sofa, violin case, or photographs etc. in the parlor.

    William also had said that he had thought Julia had "had a seizure" when he went into the parlor. We know a high number of fatal poisons cause seizures.
    Last edited by WallaceWackedHer; 10-04-2019, 10:41 AM.

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Originally posted by Sherlock Houses View Post
    Less than four days after Julia's murder this extremely interesting article appeared in the Liverpool Echo of
    Saturday, January 24th 1931. Whether or not the article has any bearing on her brutal murder is obviously open to
    question but I feel sure you'll agree that the various locations mentioned and the description of the very agitated
    taxi customer give rise to much further food for thought and speculation. Apart from the 3 inch height discrepancy
    it's almost as if William Wallace or a remarkable lookalike is being described.
    Fascinating.........

    Click image for larger version

Name:	L.Echo 24-01-1931.jpg
Views:	537
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    Yes, especially considering two separate authors (one a playwright) speculated that the murder weapon was taken away in an umbrella, which the man who took that taxi had upon him.

    And the apparent sighting of Amy Wallace with William at 20:10 that night near the ferries, the sighting by Mr. Sydney Green saying William is 5'10, and the sighting by Lily Hall giving the same exact outfit as described by Sydney Green who had given William's height as 5'10.

    ---

    Here's something else to consider... And this to me is the most puzzling, the fact that all the books and trial text and everything are completely contradicted by the crime scene photos in many cases... First of all, it is abundantly clear from morgue photographs that Julia's largest wound is actually on the front of her head (on the left of her head, above the ear and toward the front side - her entire skull is literally caved into her brain). The wounds on the back of her head are slim and not deep, they look almost like laceration marks, no skull fracturing. It reminds me of Michael Peterson's wife's wounds, which his defence now tries to claim were from an "owl attack".

    Everything you read ALSO makes you expect the parlor looks like the elevator scene from The Shining. But no, actually the room is cleaner than a f-ing SHOWROOM. I can imagine an estate agent leading clients around the parlor telling them they get a free dead body ornament centerpiece, it's THAT clean. I dare anyone to spot even a single drop of blood apart from the pool around Julia:







    I dare anyone to show me where the blood is. It must be MICROSCOPIC specks. From what we read it's apparently all over the chair, violin case, photographs, walls (up to 7 foot)... WHERE?! The place is so clean it's like something from Homes Under the Hammer.

    But what's curious...

    Is that this would align quite well with Julia Wallace being poisoned. Once the heart stops, blood no longer sprays. Instead, what would happen, is that it would simply leak and pool underneath where the wound is opened up, via gravity. Any specks on the walls etc. would be off of the weapon or something of that nature.

    If Julia was poisoned then there IS no time factor concern, and no concern about "cleaning up", because there's zero spray. It'd be like hitting a boxing bag with an iron bar, to get blood on you you'd have to physically get it onto some item and then flick that item at yourself. And we do see half eaten scones left in the kitchen. Suppose she is poisoned, and the scene is staged, and her skull caved in, to give the impression of a burglary-turned-murder to prevent any investigation into potential poisoning. Just consider that... William would have the most motive out of anyone to do this (instead of just injecting a tonne of morphine into her Shipman style), because he lectures in chemistry and has a laboratory in his own home.

    It's not something I EVER would have thought if there were no photos, but it is simply what the crime scene photos suggest. Because honestly, you won't find any visible blood in any photograph of that room that isn't the pool on the ground. The other thing you may consider is that it was simply meticulously cleaned... I think the mackintosh was not worn to protect from spray (I reiterate - WHAT spray?). One side is heavily covered, I think that is just the side that was in the pool that came out of Julia's open head wound.

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  • Sherlock Houses
    replied
    Less than four days after Julia's murder this extremely interesting article appeared in the Liverpool Echo of
    Saturday, January 24th 1931. Whether or not the article has any bearing on her brutal murder is obviously open to
    question but I feel sure you'll agree that the various locations mentioned and the description of the very agitated
    taxi customer give rise to much further food for thought and speculation. Apart from the 3 inch height discrepancy
    it's almost as if William Wallace or a remarkable lookalike is being described.
    Fascinating.........

    Click image for larger version

Name:	L.Echo 24-01-1931.jpg
Views:	537
Size:	186.7 KB
ID:	719778

    Leave a comment:


  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Originally posted by Sherlock Houses View Post
    Hope you'll excuse my intrusion here. I am a Liverpudlian [and I come from the Spion Kop] and have been interested in this very perplexing murder mystery on and off for a few years but I'm probably nowhere near as knowledgeable about it as most on this thread.
    I'm very familiar with the area around the the three Menlove Gardens as I take my dog most days to Calderstone's Park, literally a stone's throw away. Not that it has much bearing but my sister's brother-in-law Steve actually lives in Menlove Gardens West and has done for a good number of years now.
    Like many others I find the choice of the name R.M Qualtrough most intriguing. I won't pretend to have read this entire thread so I don't know if anyone has remarked about the following.... In his fruitless search for the fictitious 25 Menlove Gardens East, William Wallace stated that he knocked at the door of 25 Menlove Gardens West and spoke with the occupant, a Mrs Katie Mather. There's probably nothing to it but her husband's name was Richard. Given that there are 676 different permutations of two-letter initials the odds of an R.M. living at this particular address are pretty high indeed. Significant or not, who can say ?
    Actually the input of any local with information like this is vital.

    Through the grivepvine I recently heard two separate witness have testified that William was bixeual and hired rent boys to sexually satisfy him (I'm uncertain 70 year old Julia could). And further, that of course Julia was quite religious. John Gannon suppressed this infomration unscrupulously even thought it one of the biggest breakthroughs in the case since some extra testimonials in Gannon and the Wilkes Radio show. Bigger in fact. Perjury really...

    If true, that would be completely monumental, and unacceptable information to keep from people... Anectally my nan said that back in those days you coul potentially actually be jailed if you were outed as gay, and certainly lose friends etc. In other words it basically ruined your life completely.

    So even the Gannon theory then would need a small wrewrite. Considering the incredible guide he made eLilven his initial conclusion wouldn't detract. But a rewrite of it woud be as such:

    1) Sometime AFTER the diary entry with the freaking out William, Julia had learned that William was using rent boys. I don't believe she necessarily knew their names.

    2) Julia cared about his wife, he was bisexual, so he cared about her too. But she may have been threatening things like divocrce or exposue, which could be dangerous to those he was involved with.

    3) Marsden was about to marry the love of his life. This information would ruin basically his entire life, he doesn't have all that much choice, the blackmail is very strong here.

    4) Gordon might not even be a rent boy, but informants say that yes he was. I FEEL he wouldn't care but he did have a fiancé himself and it would have ruined his reputation as a "badboy" and life to an extent. I'm think moreso poor Gordon was tricked or paid off.

    5) William is still calm through all this because he can back out at ANY time. I'm sure that because I DO buy he cared about Julia, he would have tried multiple times to change her mind and move past this. But she refused.

    6) The last time woud have been around 6.40. There's simply no reconcilliation... So off William goes in his new jacket (the one he wore earlier MAY still be weit as it was left in the hall to dry). He tells Julia Marsden is calling on business (she doesn't even know Marsden is a rentboy - and does she DEFINTIELY even know him at all)? Either way he comes in the back admitted by William.

    Of course if you're going to go into someone's home and murder them, doing so from the froont door of terraced housing seems iffy.

    7) Marsden hangs up his jacket in the hall. By mistake he takes Williams rather than one of the others like a chump. Hence William's "her mackintosh; and my mackintosh" comment.

    10) Did he put it on? Well, maybe. Of course the satest thing is to chuck it over her head. Do you buy there's odds he might have done that? If he did, then he's a true sucka because he overshot the jacket onto the fire and was forced to bash her head in the anyway.

    11) Now, of course William is biding his time. He knows his wife's probably battered. But he needs to give Marsden time to check everything is in order about the scene and tidyness. So he gives him until a little after 8 when he finally returns.

    12) Lily Hall sees William and Marsden in tne try. OF NOTE: She describes his outfit the same as Green's tetimony.

    13) Marsden leaves, potentially to get ride from Gordon.

    And then William's checkmate move...

    If he makes it seem Gordon and Marsden did it, they're likely done for. TWO disgrunted Pru employees, specifically targeting Pru takings as revenge, and a name that links directly to Marsden. Ouch.
    Last edited by WallaceWackedHer; 08-24-2019, 01:43 AM.

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  • Sherlock Houses
    replied
    Hope you'll excuse my intrusion here. I am a Liverpudlian [and I come from the Spion Kop] and have been interested in this very perplexing murder mystery on and off for a few years but I'm probably nowhere near as knowledgeable about it as most on this thread.
    I'm very familiar with the area around the the three Menlove Gardens as I take my dog most days to Calderstone's Park, literally a stone's throw away. Not that it has much bearing but my sister's brother-in-law Steve actually lives in Menlove Gardens West and has done for a good number of years now.
    Like many others I find the choice of the name R.M Qualtrough most intriguing. I won't pretend to have read this entire thread so I don't know if anyone has remarked about the following.... In his fruitless search for the fictitious 25 Menlove Gardens East, William Wallace stated that he knocked at the door of 25 Menlove Gardens West and spoke with the occupant, a Mrs Katie Mather. There's probably nothing to it but her husband's name was Richard. Given that there are 676 different permutations of two-letter initials the odds of an R.M. living at this particular address are pretty high indeed. Significant or not, who can say ?
    Last edited by Sherlock Houses; 08-23-2019, 12:34 PM.

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Just posting some more in my private little echo chamber...

    Has anyone ever considered the possibility that William had a ride from Parry to the third tram on the kill night? And possibly even to the chess club on the night prior?

    I read Gordon's statement again, not only does he give a false alibi, but he also states he picked up Lily from some place where she was giving a lesson, and for whatever reason says he doesn't even know the area from where he picked her up. From a day or two days ago. So yeah I am afraid it indeed takes a huuuuuge leap of faith to believe that was an accident.

    Something else to consider is that Lily Lloyd claimed he told her he was just at Park Lane after he got back LATER that night. The mother said he was going to LARK Lane?...Might have been vice versa. But of note, one of them was near the chess club. So could we potentially believe he had picked up Wallace and dropped him off, skipping the tram ride and allowing him to beat the clock after William himself placed a call (although I still don't think it was him, a Liverpudlian accent is very difficult to fake in a way that sounds natural)? This would negate the danger of lying about the tram route because nobody on any tram could have seen him if he'd taken a car.

    Another potentially more sinister reason would be if he had gone down there to check William arrived at the cafè. if he was going to do this for sinister reasons, would he have admitted where he was off to to Lily's mother and Lily? If he'd made a prank call you could argue there's a chance he might.

    Now... Secondarily, William was ALSO not seen on the first two trams on the night of the killing despite his striking figure. Again, if he'd had a ride to the third tram stop, this is going to extend his window of time to act and allow him to beat the clock.

    Is there a serious issue with that? I shall see... I have also got in contact with Merseyside police and other sources. ALL authors completely omit a bunch of statements for god knows what reason. I want them ALL. Even statements from extreme periphery people like Albert, William's coworker who Julia had told about the freak out over her being late home.

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    I found some disturbing new information. It turns out that William didn't fraudulently add the diary entries on, there's several witness accounts he really did freak about her being late home and went to the police station even. This is a mark against a crank call although that does fit the other facts, makes it far more coincidental.

    It's a bit odd, feels almost like advanced planning to seem innocent after he bumps her off (so people will be like: No way he did it, look how freaked he was over her coming home late!), or ofc legit innocence... But then the timing is odd that he's freaked over her potentially being dead a month before she's murdered.

    What I did find peculiar is apparently one of William's supervisors "Albert" apparently visited the home in the period between that and her death (roughly a month) and Julia allegedly had randomly relayed to him how panick-stricken William had been by her late return weeks earlier... Peculiar thing for her to randomly bring up? I've never heard of any "Albert" before.
    Last edited by WallaceWackedHer; 08-04-2019, 06:19 PM.

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Are we ready to rule out a singular burglary motive? Someone coming in the front door?

    The fact this hasn't been solved for so long tells me that SOMETHING about it is being overcomplicated. It's not like Jack the Ripper, there are only a few permutations that are even possible here. We have to allow some room for errors, omissions, fortune etc. because clearly something obvious is being missed.

    I have difficulty taking Gordon out of the box, and I have difficulty entirely exonerating the Johnstons. I also have difficulty having Parry KNOWINGLY involve himself in a murder plot because if he knew he was gonna be fingered for murder I don't think it's a plausible mistake that he wouldn't have an alibi prepped unless he was a bit slow and was promised he'dnever even be questioned. I also don't think it's plausible he BS'd by accident.

    Did the Holme family even corroborate their story? With 3 people in there including a woman - discovering a very brutally beaten body no less - in TOTAL SILENCE does not add up at all. It's impossible to believe the entire discovery and John running for the cops was not corroborated by other neighbors.

    I lean more on the call being a practical joke by Gordon Parry which William exploited since it gave him essentially a free shot to kill Julia and get away with it. He knows Beattie will say it's not his voice.

    The issue really is one similar to Lizzie Borden, where there's a maid downstairs and she doesn't notice jack ****. Except here it's more important to have assistance because the time is so tight. Even if it's just a "cleanup crew" or someone incinerating all his **** in the kitchen fire. I assume William took a briefcase out with him seeing as it was a business trip. Was that ever recovered?

    We have William sighted seemingly returning home at 8 20 was it? With someone matching John's description parting ways with him. IIRC the police didn't arrive until after 9. That's a damn lot of time for someone to sort stuff out. It seems like there's no time because there are "innocents" there to make the discovery with him. In dead silence. Apparently John ran in shouting if she's fallen down the stairs. There's just so much uncorroborated testimony that SHOULD be corroborated by the other neighbors.

    If all these people are innocent it makes you wonder WHY did all these people have to act so damn suspicious? Including William himself. William, the Johnstons, Parry and even arguably Amy all act unusual. Was Amy really in the practice of dropping by to visit Julia? If all the innocents could just not incriminate themselves that would've been nice.

    Her body positioning also doesn't really add up. Where she was hit and the direction of the force, someone had to be sitting on the couch with her, walking over to "fix the curtains" or even have been behind the curtains. If Julia didn't know she had company it makes no sense someone entered the room after her because she would've heard the door open or have seen someone walking across the room - such was her position. Someone has to go literally round the back of the room to inflict the wounds. Very strange. And if she KNEW she had company again they probably came in the back door with William or snuck in when he took Julia down the entry since neighbors hear nothing. Julia either way did not know she was in danger we can say that much safely, so she either trusted her visitor or didn't know she had one.
    Last edited by WallaceWackedHer; 07-30-2019, 11:09 AM.

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Originally posted by Herlock Sholmes View Post
    Wallace was an intelligent man. If guilty then he planned this; he’d thought about. A massive part of that thinking and planning of course would have been concerning his alibi and how the police would have viewed him. If he’d had the Johnston’s on board I find it inconceivable that he’d have missed out on a very obvious way of almost certainly clearing his name. As we know, the police worked out what time Wallace would have had to have left the house to have reached his first stop (7.50) If Julia had been seen at 7.30 for example Wallace would have been in the clear. It was so simple. All that he’d have had to have done is to have gotten Mrs Johnston to have said that she’d not only seen Julia in the backyard at 7.30 (or even 7pm or 7.10) but that she’d had a brief chat with her over the wall. And that she’d mentioned to Mrs Johnston that William had gone out on business.

    I cant see a situation where Wallace would have had the Johnston’s on board and not used them in such a simple way to have pretty much put him in the clear?
    I don't think everyone would necessarily be okay with admitting they were the last to see her alive. I definitely wouldn't be comfortable saying I'd spoken to her at 7 but that's just me. She did speak to her at 4.30 apparently.

    I'd think saying the kitchen fireplace was still on etc. would be enough without drawing suspicion. Their stories already changed to say John told William to go in alone rather than vice versa as they all initially claimed, so I don't know what to make of all that.

    I think we can place Gordon in the box with relative safety though... And I feel like unless Alan Close is lying William couldn't have killed her himself and gotten away in time - at least he couldn't have expected that would work, it'd take a lot of luck. I'm not sure Close was ever even part of a plan, which would mean William's damn lucky Alan turned up so late.

    The most peculiar aspect really is the direction she was hit from. Why is Julia lighting the fireplace from that angle? She'd surely have seen someone enter the room if she was over on that side. Was it her usual practice to shut the door behind her? Then she'd hear it. Unless the person was already in the room.

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  • Herlock Sholmes
    replied
    Wallace was an intelligent man. If guilty then he planned this; he’d thought about. A massive part of that thinking and planning of course would have been concerning his alibi and how the police would have viewed him. If he’d had the Johnston’s on board I find it inconceivable that he’d have missed out on a very obvious way of almost certainly clearing his name. As we know, the police worked out what time Wallace would have had to have left the house to have reached his first stop (7.50) If Julia had been seen at 7.30 for example Wallace would have been in the clear. It was so simple. All that he’d have had to have done is to have gotten Mrs Johnston to have said that she’d not only seen Julia in the backyard at 7.30 (or even 7pm or 7.10) but that she’d had a brief chat with her over the wall. And that she’d mentioned to Mrs Johnston that William had gone out on business.

    I cant see a situation where Wallace would have had the Johnston’s on board and not used them in such a simple way to have pretty much put him in the clear?

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    I think the P.D. James problem is a chicken or the egg type deal. She suggests Gordon coincidentally called just after William had decided to kill his wife.

    I suggest William only decided to kill his wife (/have her killed) AFTER realizing he was pranked and now has the perfect alibi and ne'er-do-well to pin it on. Until then he had probably simply mused over the possibility here and there. He may not even have realized it until he got home or whatever.

    I reckon the Johnstons and Wallaces were tighter than we're led to believe. And maybe William had more cash in vases than he'd let on which he could entice John with. He retracted the "followed me down the entry" line immediately, perhaps fearing it hit a little close to home, or perhaps the Johnstons felt it was too dangerous for them and made him change his story? With the back doors shut it leaves only the front door and thus only people William states Julia would allow in - a list the Johnstons were "fortunate" enough to avoid. They were also fortunate enough to never be suspected by him despite John claiming he didn't know Julia's name, their outright lies about having never been into the home more than three times in 10 years etc. and never into a room other than the parlor even though they'd housesat, and the fact they appeared at the back door with such impeccable timing...

    All three of their testimonies contain lies, retractions, and contradictions. In addition, Mr. Johnston remarked that "whoever killed Mrs. Wallace must have been a giant with terrific strength" (the opposite of himself).

    The timing of the sighting by Lily Hall allows for the right amount of time for the smaller man she saw (John Johnston) to dispose of the murder weapon somewhere nearby then return to the home, or go straight to the doctor without returning to Wolverton Street.

    William and the Johnstons probably figure they've no chance of getting caught. The Johnstons claim to hear "thuds" at something like 8:20, claim the kitchen fire was still on, claim Julia's hand was warm until just before the police arrived. She also is the only one to see him sob (despite stonewalling police), and specifically states William knocked on the back door GENTLY.. And for John Johnston he figures William will cover for him and drop some random local toerag in it instead.

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  • WallaceWackedHer
    replied
    Yes hopefully I'll be home today.

    I think something at least along those kinda lines is "final answer" tier for me.

    If it was a crank call, it wasn't an elaborate plan at that point... I mean look at the laughable staging. The call is literally the only part that MAKES it seem elaborate, if that part isn't real then it's a pretty standard murder albeit exploitative, and a bit evil to be so willing to let someone he knows is innocent hang just so he can off his wife.

    William was rich enough to hire a cleaning lady it would seem. I reckon he offered John money, the Gordon Parry safety net, and then maybe mentioned Julia was thinking of going to the police to turn Johnston in. William and John were probably friends lol (and certainly at the very least Florence and Julia were). There's evidence of the two families exchanging postcards etc... He probably knew it was John right from the first break-in. And of course these break-ins stopped as soon as the Johnstons moved.

    John saw William in the entry because he (John) was on his way to get rid of the murder weapon. He might not even have gone back to the house after lol. But maybe he did for timing reasons (like so they could fix a time when William "got home").

    John also had a friend who lived in Menlove Gardens. How many years was William an insurance agent in Liverpool? He autocorrected East to West probably because he'd heard of it so many times, was familiar with it through his visits to Green Lane/Mr Crewe/Calderstones, or had previously been there during his many years he was an insurance agent. John also had a friend who lived in Menlove Gardens so William may have heard of it through him too. And what about Gordon etc? William was supervisor for at the very least Parry and Marsden. What area did their routes include? The Gardens had been around for 5 years prior, it would very likely have been mentioned at the agency when it was first being built, at which time William was already an employee... Besides did William not talk to his fellow employees at all? He didn't know of any of their routes or whatever? Never heard them mention the Gardens? It defies belief almost lol.

    He was also previously a Liberal Registration Agent, and his own father worked as an insurance agent, with himself and Julia visiting Calderstones park regularly.

    I wouldn't like to say with certainty that the police ignored checking the route. Maybe it just turned up nothing like the first tram on the murder night. I haven't seen the files and I've heard from some that it's incomplete.

    Anyway I am certain the William, Gordon, John trifecta holds the answer within. It's obviously better for William/John if Gordon did crank call the place. I can imagine Gordon freaking out and having his car hosed down when he heard Julia had been murdered while her husband was away at the Gardens looking for a fake address, knowing he was unwittingly implicated... Remember: DNA testing doesn't exist in 1931. If there's ANY blood in Gordon's car he's potentially going down for murder.

    If Gordon had never prank called it's possible nothing would've happened to Julia. It was just a golden opportunity.

    Btw I think William gave Julia a time to set it up. Tbh he even said 7:30 so it'd be warm for his return.
    Last edited by WallaceWackedHer; 07-26-2019, 01:05 PM.

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