Ep. 38- Killers on the Loose: Eliminating the Suspects

[Monty]

Speaking as a cricketer

I have known teamates who have played having had no sleep due to working nights, its not unheard of. Judging Blackheaths scorecard, Druitt batted early and only made 2. Thus giving him the rest of the innings to catch some rest. Though he bowled around 13 overs during Christphersons innings, that really isnt a shedload. 6 n 7 split Id say, an they were all out for a mere 93. It was hardly a strenuos game.

[Ben]

Possibly, Fish, although I'd be extremely surprised if that sort of adrenalized high could be sustained for several hours after the escape before giving way to the sort of fatigue that Ally mentioned, certainly not for the entire morning's duration.

Regards,
Ben

[Fisherman]

Ben writes:

"Whether the thrill of the murder and the realisation that he had escaped undetected again was still as forceful as by 10.00 or 11.00 is more doubtful."

That it is, Ben. Sooner or later the effect must of course have worn off. But I see no reason why it could not be speculated that it may have kept him at a constant "high" at the very least throughout the morning. It may even have prevented him from being able to go to sleep for some considerable time.

When that time ran out, however, is of course impossible to say. But I thought the phenomenon in itself deserved mentioning in this debate!

All the best,
Fisherman

PS. Ally got a line in before me, and I think it is a good one - once he came down from that cloud, he may well have slept very deeply and for a long time. This all, however, means that we are making the presumption of a certain character on the Rippers behalf. There are also other possibilities; he may have gone to sleep immediately afterwards and slept like a child, just as he may have spent a very troubled night, floating in and out of haunted dreams.
I still feel that opting for the alternative of him getting a boost out of it all seems the better guess to me.

[Ally]

I would imagine that while the killer would have experience a huge adrenaline rush in the immediate, during the killing and escaping, I would imagine that the adrenaline rush would have given way to exhaustion from both the excess of out all night looking for a victim and the more specific fatigue that follows such a "rush".

[Ben]

When it is stated that Druitt may have been exhausted after a night of killing and eviscerating, I think we must ponder the possibility that the effect of it could well have been quite the opposite of exhaustion

I think it's highly probable that such a sensation occured in the immediate aftermath of the murder, Fish, yes. Good point. Whether the thrill of the murder and the realisation that he had escaped undetected again was still as forceful as by 10.00 or 11.00 is more doubtful.

All the best,
Ben

[Fisherman]

Just thought IŽd butt in for a second to offer a wiew that has been overlooked here. When it is stated that Druitt may have been exhausted after a night of killing and eviscerating, I think we must ponder the possibility that the effect of it could well have been quite the opposite of exhaustion. I think that a fair guess is that whoever killed Chapman got a real boost out of it. He was probably exhilarated afterwards, not exhausted.
For all we know, if Druitt did kill Chapman (and no, I do not think that he did...), that may have been pure speed to him.

The best, all!
Fisherman

[Ben]

But they are not linked to the issue of how "tight" the timing was - to the issue of how much spare time there would have been to do what had to be done

Indeed they're not, Chris, although they do impact on the issue of suspect plausibility.

[Chris]

Not specifically, but of course both are inextricably linked to the issue of timing.

But they are not linked to the issue of how "tight" the timing was - to the issue of how much spare time there would have been to do what had to be done (unless you are arguing Druitt must have had time for a few hours' snooze after returning to Blackheath!).

[Ben]

Hi Chris,

You mean it would have been difficult for Druitt to do all that he would have had to do between the time of the murder and the time of the cricket match?

Yes.

You are not talking about the psychology of playing cricket so soon after committing a murder, or the fact that he would have been tired after being up all night?

Not specifically, but of course both are inextricably linked to the issue of timing.

[Chris]

But "not very plausible" because the amount of time Druitt would have had to spare would have been so short - not because of the psychological factor or because of other considerations that make Druitt an unlikely suspect?

But I'm asking specifically about what you mean when you say the timing was "very tight". You mean it would have been difficult for Druitt to do all that he would have had to do between the time of the murder and the time of the cricket match?

You are not talking about the psychology of playing cricket so soon after committing a murder, or the fact that he would have been tired after being up all night?

[Ben]

Hi Andy,

Uhm..again, we must pay attention not merely to the fact that Druitt played cricket on Sept 8 but also how well or poorly he played. Did you even look at that?

Well, he couldn't realistically have expected anything better if he'd been out seeking prostitutes into the small hours, killing them, making good his escape etc etc. Which leads me to conclude that he was unlikely to have had the mental or physical wherewithal to bother with cricket, especially if it wasn't part of his paid work routine. Players can deliver a poor performace without having engaged in butchery the night before, even established professional players, which Druitt wasn't.

I simply fail to see where this is unlikely merely because we have no record of it.

We have no record of him being anywhere near London for the whole of August. We only have him recorded as being in Dorset at the time, and the same is true of 1st September. It doesn't prove anything, and of course we could argue that it just accidentally happened that way, and it was just an odd quirk of coincidence that the only records of his presence for that month just happened to originate from Dorset and not London where he lived, but I don't consider that likely. If he was engaged in the law courts in August when you say they were active, why is it that no records of this have survived, but the odd cricket match have survived the historical records to expose his whereabouts in Dorset?

Your reasoning seems to be that traveling a distance of 25 miles (Bournemouth to Salisbury) to play a game is completely likely but traveling an additional 70 miles (London to Salisbury = 95 miles), an additional two hours at most on a train to a destination at which he has a relative living

When I used to holiday in rural Devon, we'd often make the trip to Torquay which was also about 20 or so miles away from where we were staying because there was more to do there. That's not weird at all. In fact, limited travel of that nature is precisely what people do get up to on their summer break. That didn't mean I frequently went all the way back home on several occasions.

The prevailing opinion, however, remains that she is probably not a Ripper victim.

No, it's not the prevailing opinion.

The majority of contemporary police officials were inclined to include, rather than exclude her (Anderson, Abberline, Reid etc), and the same is true of the majority criminologists who have studied the case. As for "ripperologists" I've seen no evidence that Tabram-excluders are in the majority, far from it. I'm personally very wary of any theory that is too strongly dependent on the exclusion (or inclusion) of certain victims.

Regards,
Ben

[aspallek]

Uhm..again, we must pay attention not merely to the fact that Druitt played cricket on Sept 8 but also how well or poorly he played. Did you even look at that? Druitt's performance is consistent with one who had been out all night. Oh, and in my younger days I would sometimes spend the night partying and drinking and then play softball -- or work at a physically demanding job (or both!) -- the next day. Though I confess that I was a bit younger than 31 then.

You keep mentioning Druitt's "popping back and forth" between London and Dorset as being unlikely. In fact, it would require only one such round trip in a three week period. I simply fail to see where this is unlikely merely because we have no record of it. Particularly so when we consider Druitt's law practice.

And your argument regarding Salisbury is to me similarly insipid. If that is Montague who appeared on Aug 22 in Salisbury, and I stress that there is really no reason to believe it is, I see no particular unlikelihood to his making the trip from London to Salisbury, particularly if the Blackheath club was on hiatus. Your reasoning seems to be that traveling a distance of 25 miles (Bournemouth to Salisbury) to play a game is completely likely but traveling an additional 70 miles (London to Salisbury = 95 miles), an additional two hours at most on a train to a destination at which he has a relative living, to play a game is completely unlikely. I just don't see the logic here.

Regarding Tabram, I've made that the caveat all along. The prevailing opinion, however, remains that she is probably not a Ripper victim.

[Ben]

Not very plausible for a whole host of reasons, to be honest, Chris - those ones included. As I mentioned on the podcast, none of this gives him an abili, and I expressed the (possibly) forlorn hope that one may be uncovered in the fullness of time.

[Chris]

Again, not impossible, just not very plausible.

But "not very plausible" because the amount of time Druitt would have had to spare would have been so short - not because of the psychological factor or because of other considerations that make Druitt an unlikely suspect?

[Ben]

You are claiming that there was "little time to spare" in the sense that it would have been difficult for Druitt to do all that he would have had to do between the time of the murder and the time of the cricket match?

Yep, Chris, that's a good deal nearer the mark.

Again, not impossible, just not very plausible.