Bowyerīs inquest testimony

[Pierre]

I wish to ask you a question Pierre.

Mary Kelly was 5ft 7inches tall, in MJK1 her legs are not outstretched, they are actually pulled up.

How long would you say she is in that picture from head to toe? I would suggest no more than 5foot 2 inches. do you disagree?

The room according to your calculations is 2.85 m wide, that is 9ft 3inches.
Allowing 4 inches for the brick wall that gives 8 foot 11 inches for the room
your diagram shows the bed filling the entire width of the room.

Are you suggesting that there is a further 3foot 8 or 9 inches at the bottom of the bed we cannot see?

If the bed fills the entire width of the room, does it not barricade not only the main door, but also the door in the wall?

OK. I use centimeters.

The bed is 3,17 centimeters if it was 2 meters.

The width of the bed could be, like this, donīt know, about 1,30.

The door between 26 and 13 opens into 26.

[Elamarna]

I wish to ask you a question Pierre.

Mary Kelly was 5ft 7inches tall, in MJK1 her legs are not outstretched, they are actually pulled up.

How long would you say she is in that picture from head to toe? I would suggest no more than 5foot 2 inches. do you disagree?

The room according to your calculations is 2.85 m wide, that is 9ft 3inches.
Allowing 4 inches for the brick wall that gives 8 foot 11 inches for the room
your diagram shows the bed filling the entire width of the room.

Are you suggesting that there is a further 3foot 8 or 9 inches at the bottom of the bed we cannot see?

If the bed fills the entire width of the room, does it not barricade not only the main door, but also the door in the wall?

[Elamarna]

Hey Steve, you join me on the "naughty list". Congratulations!

Clearly you are being far too effective and Pierre doesn't like it.

David,

I have been out for the evening and come back to this abuse.

I have not lied, if he does not withdraw the accusation should i report him to admin?
does anyone here have an opinion on this, or should i just ignore him?

David, i am a bad boy.

[Elamarna]

One thing, Steve. I donīt care if you "change your mind". I have no interest whatsoever in changing your mind. The only thing that means anything to me is science. What some individuals are thinking means nothing to me.

I enjoyed discussing with you since I thought you were a bit serious. But now I see you are not. So I guess thereīs nothing left to be said to you.

I wonīt out you on the ignore list. I donīt like using that function. I just had to do it in Davidīs case since he is stalking me on the forum. Yes, that is the correct expression. His only interest is to destroy anything I write.

After almost every post I write I see the name David Orsam.

sorry, I find nothing you say scientific.
I am not the person who is not serious my friend

out me on the ignore list? out me as if its some sort of disgrace.

i will l continue to post questions you don't want to answer.
actually makes no difference as you refuse to answer any direct question.

[Elamarna]

No, he wonīt listen. Oh, how terrible, considering you have told him time and time again.

Well, it is you Steve and your friend David against Pierre, I guess.

But what can you do with Pierre, since he does not understand a word you say? And oh, he makes false pictures here as well, yes, Pierre must be a real trickster, who is just trying to fool and manipulate you. A troll, isnīt he?

Pierre,
to quote yourself in the third person is not considered the normal thing to do.
you do know that i hope?

[Elamarna]

Donīt tell me to find things Steve. Instead, forget about the 1.5 hours. If you are not a pitbull, which I believe you arenīt.

No way, you quoted 1.5 hours as the time taken by the killer, you then said you would dig out the source for this?

so i will not forget it.
don't quote data you cannot backup. that is not scientific as you well know.

[Elamarna]

From what figures exactly?

"you are saying the bed is 9ft long."

- are you quoting me? You are lying. I have not used those words. Why are you lying Steve? Just for the fun of it? Or what is your problem?

You have told us the room is 2.85 meters wide.

your new diagram shows the bed taking up the whole width. that gives a width for room of 9foot 3 inches, allowing for the bricks on the side wall that is a bed of nearly 9 foot.

I am not lying that length of bed is based on your own figures.

please withdraw you accusation of lying.

[JadenCollins]

No, he wonīt listen. Oh, how terrible, considering you have told him time and time again.

Well, it is you Steve and your friend David against Pierre, I guess.

But what can you do with Pierre, since he does not understand a word you say? And oh, he makes false pictures here as well, yes, Pierre must be a real trickster, who is just trying to fool and manipulate you. A troll, isnīt he?

are you really talking in the third person?
I mean only wackos do...

[David Orsam]

The Failure of Pierre's New Approach

Some things clearly are sinking in. Pierre has realised that his claim that the divisional surgeon, Dr Phillips, perjured himself at the inquest is unsustainable. Hence he has come up with an ingenious new approach whereby he wants to say that Dr Phillips' evidence is both true and entirely consistent with his theory.

I think it is worth a brief explanation of why this cannot be the case.

Pierre's entire theory rests on the police entering Kelly's room in exactly the same way as the killer, i.e. through the "door" in the wall.

The reason this is crucial to Pierre's theory is that the room as the police found it must be exactly as the killer left it - with the table and bed barricading the door - to enable the photographer to take MJK3 which Pierre, for reasons best known to himself, believes shows a table and a bed barricading a door.

Had entry been made to the room via the front door, in Pierre's theory, this would inevitably have involved pushing the door open with force which would have moved the table and bed away from their "barricading" position. Thus, in those circumstances, MJK3 could not have been taken.

Unfortunately for Pierre, Dr Phillips' evidence is wholly inconsistent with his theory.

According to Phillips:

"On the door being opened it knocked against a table."

The doctor can't be talking about the "door" in the partition because in Pierre's theory there is no table anywhere near it. He also can't be talking about a door that is barricaded by the table because otherwise the door could not have been opened without moving the table (and bed) from its original barricading position, thus making MJK3 impossible.

It is also not possible for the police to have entered via the "door" in the partition, taken the photograph and then moved the furniture to allow Dr Phillips in. We know this from the evidence of Inspector Beck:

'I was there, the doctor was the first to enter the room".

So when Dr Phillips said the door was "opened" which then knocked into a table he cannot possibly be talking about a room that was barricaded by a table and a bed.

The fact that the doctor said that the bed was against the partition has already been discussed and it seems that the only way Pierre can get around this is to enlarge the bed, or shrink the dimensions of the room, to enable the bed to both barricade the door and sit against the partition.

His entire position is an impossibility. The doctor's evidence is only consistent with the information we see in MJK1, not with Pierre's Jack the Barricader theory.

Pierre's new approach - which we should perhaps describe as the New New Discourse - fails entirely.

[David Orsam]

Number 4

1, 2, 3 messages by David. Messages I canīt read. But you know I see your name David. And that is enough for you, obviously.

Bye David.

Fear not Pierre, everyone else can read them. And that is enough for me, obviously.

[Robert St Devil]

Well Pierre, you have told us repeatedly that the dimensions of Mary Kelly's room are 2.85 metres by 5.39 metres. That is 9.35 feet by 17.68 feet.

rd?

David Orsan.
It's definitely a long room - maybe 10' x 12 to 14'. This is the method i used for the length of the room:

[SCALE] the no. 13 millers court photo. I use MS Paint with the ruler enabled. Measure the height of the door. I used 6 ft. On that scale, measure across the length of the room. The window is about 3' to 3.5' wide. I think the room is around 10'(?) by the edge of the second window.

[Pierre]

Calculating

1, 2, 3 messages by David. Messages I canīt read. But you know I see your name David. And that is enough for you, obviously.

Bye David.

[David Orsam]

So I guess thereīs nothing left to be said to you.

Hey Steve, you join me on the "naughty list". Congratulations!

Clearly you are being far too effective and Pierre doesn't like it.

[David Orsam]

No, he wonīt listen. Oh, how terrible, considering you have told him time and time again.

The questions you have asked have been answered time and time again in this forum - yet you still continue asking them - so, yes, it is terrible that you won't listen.

[Pierre]

David

he won't listen. we have all answers his questions time and time again, but he keeps asking them, I assume he thinks we are going to change our minds without any new evidence!

I made the mistake of arguing over the word removed which didn’t help, but for him to suggest his plan shows the bed near the wall is the largest stretch of imagination I have seen on here in a very long time .

One thing, Steve. I donīt care if you "change your mind". I have no interest whatsoever in changing your mind. The only thing that means anything to me is science. What some individuals are thinking means nothing to me.

I enjoyed discussing with you since I thought you were a bit serious. But now I see you are not. So I guess thereīs nothing left to be said to you.

I wonīt out you on the ignore list. I donīt like using that function. I just had to do it in Davidīs case since he is stalking me on the forum. Yes, that is the correct expression. His only interest is to destroy anything I write.

After almost every post I write I see the name David Orsam.