Possible explanation for Maxwell Discrepency?

[Wickerman]

The more I read about MJK, the more I think Maxwell's was right. I get that she's only seen her on two short occasions but you can't mistake someone for someone else unless it's dark outside.

Something doesn't add up to MJK's story, I can't really put it into words but I can't help but think that the body that was found at Miller's Court wasn't MJK, could be someone who stayed over at her place?

Have you not read, Will the Real Mary Kelly...?, Scott, 2005.

There are two candidates there, one of which was a Mary Kelly, aged 24 in 1888.
Born in Ireland, moved to Wales with family.
Had one sister and seven brothers, one of whom was named John.
Though the father was named Hubert on the census, and this Mary Kelly is still alive in the 1891 census, but then she would have to be to suit your theory.

This is the closest fit that has been found to date, but as the majority opinion holds that the body in room 13 was most likely Mary Kelly, then this find incurs little interest.
Conventional wisdom requires the correct Mary Kelly to not appear in the 1891 census, or any other census thereafter.

The caveat though is, due to the difficulty in being able to find a good (meaning dead) candidate, that conventional wisdom is beginning to accept that "Mary Kelly" was perhaps not the true name of the victim.

So where does that leave us?

Well, the body does not need to be "Mary Kelly". Conventional wisdom will be satisfied with the body actually being only Barnett's lover, regardless of what her true name was.

Which may mean the 'real' Mary Kelly, the one who's family details suit the claims made by Barnett, may not have died in Millers Court, but that the woman to whom he shared his life with adopted the identity of this Mary Kelly who had seven brothers and one sister.

That may mean the victim & the real Mary Kelly knew each other (childhood friends?), which could narrow the search down considerably.
I have wondered what happened to this 'cousin' whom, we are told, the victim claimed started her off in the 'bad life' in Cardiff, assuming of course that this cousin was a woman.

It's something to think about.

[Abby Normal]

The more I read about MJK, the more I think Maxwell's was right. I get that she's only seen her on two short occasions but you can't mistake someone for someone else unless it's dark outside.

Something doesn't add up to MJK's story, I can't really put it into words but I can't help but think that the body that was found at Miller's Court wasn't MJK, could be someone who stayed over at her place?

Hi Jaden
so Barnett, who as Marys lover, knew her and her body intimately, mistook her for someone else but Maxwell, who had no relation to mary, admitted she only spoke to her twice in only four months of 'knowing" her is not mistaken?

yeesh.

[Abby Normal]

Have you not read, Will the Real Mary Kelly...?, Scott, 2005.

There are two candidates there, one of which was a Mary Kelly, aged 24 in 1888.
Born in Ireland, moved to Wales with family.
Had one sister and seven brothers, one of whom was named John.
Though the father was named Hubert on the census, and this Mary Kelly is still alive in the 1891 census, but then she would have to be to suit your theory.

This is the closest fit that has been found to date, but as the majority opinion holds that the body in room 13 was most likely Mary Kelly, then this find incurs little interest.
Conventional wisdom requires the correct Mary Kelly to not appear in the 1891 census, or any other census thereafter.

The caveat though is, due to the difficulty in being able to find a good (meaning dead) candidate, that conventional wisdom is beginning to accept that "Mary Kelly" was perhaps not the true name of the victim.

So where does that leave us?

Well, the body does not need to be "Mary Kelly". Conventional wisdom will be satisfied with the body actually being only Barnett's lover, regardless of what her true name was.

Which may mean the 'real' Mary Kelly, the one who's family details suit the claims made by Barnett, may not have died in Millers Court, but that the woman to whom he shared his life with adopted the identity of this Mary Kelly who had seven brothers and one sister.

That may mean the victim & the real Mary Kelly knew each other, which could narrow the search down considerably.
I have wondered what happened to this 'cousin' whom, we are told, the victim claimed started her off in the 'bad life' in Cardiff, assuming of course that this cousin was a woman.

It's something to think about.

id rather not-it hurts my head. Martin Fido would be proud though!

[packers stem]

Have you not read, Will the Real Mary Kelly...?, Scott, 2005.

There are two candidates there, one of which was a Mary Kelly, aged 24 in 1888.
Born in Ireland, moved to Wales with family.
Had one sister and seven brothers, one of whom was named John.
Though the father was named Hubert on the census, and this Mary Kelly is still alive in the 1891 census, but then she would have to be to suit your theory.

This is the closest fit that has been found to date, but as the majority opinion holds that the body in room 13 was most likely Mary Kelly, then this find incurs little interest.
Conventional wisdom requires the correct Mary Kelly to not appear in the 1891 census, or any other census thereafter.

The caveat though is, due to the difficulty in being able to find a good (meaning dead) candidate, that conventional wisdom is beginning to accept that "Mary Kelly" was perhaps not the true name of the victim.

So where does that leave us?

Well, the body does not need to be "Mary Kelly". Conventional wisdom will be satisfied with the body actually being only Barnett's lover, regardless of what her true name was.

Which may mean the 'real' Mary Kelly, the one who's family details suit the claims made by Barnett, may not have died in Millers Court, but that the woman to whom he shared his life with adopted the identity of this Mary Kelly who had seven brothers and one sister.

That may mean the victim & the real Mary Kelly knew each other (childhood friends?), which could narrow the search down considerably.
I have wondered what happened to this 'cousin' whom, we are told, the victim claimed started her off in the 'bad life' in Cardiff, assuming of course that this cousin was a woman.

It's something to think about.

Hi Wickerman
I've read the book,trouble is people have been looking for a Mary Kelly. Should have dawned on people by now that it is unlikely that that was her name initially. Although if it wasn't maybe the cagey McCarthys did know it without letting on
You seem to presume a lot about the reliability of Barnett.The same Barnett who stayed in the room for three nights with no bed to sleep in,same Barnett as we've seen in another discussion appeared to let the cat out of the bag about a child.The same Barnett that was seen drinking with Kelly at 10am. The same Barnett who,in 2 hours outside no 13 didn't mention there was no need to take an axe to the door,which our other favourite Mr reliable McCarthy is equally guilty.
Many of us happen to believe that the evidence for the body in 13 millers court not being Barnett's lover is stronger than for it being her.
3 witnesses...maxwell,Lewis and whoever saw her drinking with Barnett against well Barnett who could recognise her blood soaked hair and eyes through the mutilation
Something else to think about :-)

[packers stem]

Hi Jaden
so Barnett, who as Marys lover, knew her and her body intimately, mistook her for someone else but Maxwell, who had no relation to mary, admitted she only spoke to her twice in only four months of 'knowing" her is not mistaken?

yeesh.

Hi Abby
He didn't have to have mistaken her...
She could have told him before disappearing to cover for her quite easily
And it's not just maxwell, you know that full well

[JadenCollins]

Have you not read, Will the Real Mary Kelly...?, Scott, 2005.

There are two candidates there, one of which was a Mary Kelly, aged 24 in 1888.
Born in Ireland, moved to Wales with family.
Had one sister and seven brothers, one of whom was named John.
Though the father was named Hubert on the census, and this Mary Kelly is still alive in the 1891 census, but then she would have to be to suit your theory.

This is the closest fit that has been found to date, but as the majority opinion holds that the body in room 13 was most likely Mary Kelly, then this find incurs little interest.
Conventional wisdom requires the correct Mary Kelly to not appear in the 1891 census, or any other census thereafter.

The caveat though is, due to the difficulty in being able to find a good (meaning dead) candidate, that conventional wisdom is beginning to accept that "Mary Kelly" was perhaps not the true name of the victim.

So where does that leave us?

Well, the body does not need to be "Mary Kelly". Conventional wisdom will be satisfied with the body actually being only Barnett's lover, regardless of what her true name was.

Which may mean the 'real' Mary Kelly, the one who's family details suit the claims made by Barnett, may not have died in Millers Court, but that the woman to whom he shared his life with adopted the identity of this Mary Kelly who had seven brothers and one sister.

That may mean the victim & the real Mary Kelly knew each other (childhood friends?), which could narrow the search down considerably.
I have wondered what happened to this 'cousin' whom, we are told, the victim claimed started her off in the 'bad life' in Cardiff, assuming of course that this cousin was a woman.

It's something to think about.

Well...

There's a thing, I don't know if her real name was Mary Jane Kelly, and I don't know her real life story either, that all still remains a mystery. I was only talking about "the victim" and "the person" MJK or whatever her name was. Something doesn't add up to it. I just think that she wasn't the person they found in her room that day, that's all.

[JadenCollins]

Hi Jaden
so Barnett, who as Marys lover, knew her and her body intimately, mistook her for someone else but Maxwell, who had no relation to mary, admitted she only spoke to her twice in only four months of 'knowing" her is not mistaken?

yeesh.

Hi Abby
Barnett could have had motive for saying that. He could have been in on it. He could have said that to cover it all up. Of course the police will believe him, he was lover, he knew her...

[Abby Normal]

to Jaden and packer
little green men.

Ill pass.

[JadenCollins]

to Jaden and packer
little green men.

Ill pass.

But Abby, we come in peace...
All jokes aside, you should really consider it..

[Wickerman]

Hi Wickerman
I've read the book,trouble is people have been looking for a Mary Kelly. Should have dawned on people by now that it is unlikely that that was her name initially. Although if it wasn't maybe the cagey McCarthys did know it without letting on

Hi Packers.
People can only work with the evidence they have.
What name do you suggest they look for?

You seem to presume a lot about the reliability of Barnett.The same Barnett who stayed in the room for three nights with no bed to sleep in,same Barnett as we've seen in another discussion appeared to let the cat out of the bag about a child.The same Barnett that was seen drinking with Kelly at 10am. The same Barnett who,in 2 hours outside no 13 didn't mention there was no need to take an axe to the door,which our other favourite Mr reliable McCarthy is equally guilty.

It looks like you confuse what Barnett said, with what others said about Barnett.
Like, Barnett never claimed to be drinking with Mary at 10am., that is claimed by someone else.

- People slept on chairs, or on the floor when there was no room on a bed.

- Like I said before, we do not know if Barnett arrived at Millers Court before, or after, the door had been forced.

Many of us happen to believe that the evidence for the body in 13 millers court not being Barnett's lover is stronger than for it being her.

And many do not agree.

3 witnesses...maxwell,Lewis and whoever saw her drinking with Barnett against well Barnett who could recognise her blood soaked hair and eyes through the mutilation
Something else to think about :-)

How many red-headed women of that age & build should he expect to be found on his old bed?

[Abby Normal]

But Abby, we come in peace...
All jokes aside, you should really consider it..

haha. Yeah suuuuuure you do.

No thanks.

[spyglass]

Hi all,

Has anyone considered that the whole kelly murder/murder scene was all staged?
How about Kelly, Barnet, Hutchinson, a few high up coppers, a dodgy doctor,and possibly a few other players were all involved in the deceit.
The dodgy doctor can get hold of a body with no back story so won't be missed.
Pay off Kelly, Barnet and Hutchinson ( all who just disappear gradually )
Kelly has no back story either so no one can be traced to her.
Maxwell claims she saw her, whether she did or not, this causes those involved to panic and thus causing all the conspirators to muddle up things in the investigation ( this is when Hutchinson is introduced ) turn the inquest into a confusing debacle, Barnet says "yes..that's her" and job done.
Of course some other conspirators can't help themselves by saying things like " I know more about this then you're ever know" or words to that effect.

If you were to ask me why all this...I haven't a clue.

Regards.

[packers stem]

to Jaden and packer
little green men.

Ill pass.

Or Hutchinson even rofl

[JadenCollins]

Hi all,

Has anyone considered that the whole kelly murder/murder scene was all staged?
How about Kelly, Barnet, Hutchinson, a few high up coppers, a dodgy doctor,and possibly a few other players were all involved in the deceit.
The dodgy doctor can get hold of a body with no back story so won't be missed.
Pay off Kelly, Barnet and Hutchinson ( all who just disappear gradually )
Kelly has no back story either so no one can be traced to her.
Maxwell claims she saw her, whether she did or not, this causes those involved to panic and thus causing all the conspirators to muddle up things in the investigation ( this is when Hutchinson is introduced ) turn the inquest into a confusing debacle, Barnet says "yes..that's her" and job done.
Of course some other conspirators can't help themselves by saying things like " I know more about this then you're ever know" or words to that effect.

If you were to ask me why all this...I haven't a clue.

Regards.

That's what we're trying to say. But Abby doesn't agree with us.

[packers stem]

Hi Packers.
People can only work with the evidence they have.
What name do you suggest they look for?




It looks like you confuse what Barnett said, with what others said about Barnett.
Like, Barnett never claimed to be drinking with Mary at 10am., that is claimed by someone else.

- People slept on chairs, or on the floor when there was no room on a bed.

- Like I said before, we do not know if Barnett arrived at Millers Court before, or after, the door had been forced.




And many do not agree.



How many red-headed women of that age & build should he expect to be found on his old bed?

Hi Wickerman
I think there's a really good chance that Wynne weston Davies may have found her by chance anyway.
What good reason do you have for believing Barnett above all others? There quite frankly is none
If Kelly was disappearing then Barnett could have covered for her anyway so all other arguments become irrelevant.
Anyone killed in that manner would end up with red hair