Can't get past Maxwell

[mpriestnall]

In support of the previous exposition of Varqm

It seems to me that MJ Kelly who, according to some people, presumably was threatened, in great fear for her life and in continuous flight, did not escape very fast nor very far.

Further than St Patrick's Cemetery.

[mpriestnall]

Hi mpriestnall

Maybe I misunderstood, but I thought you said the police arrested JtR after the double event, but let him go and that met bosses thought the real murder victim (which in your scenario is not MJK) was collateral damage. That does sound like the police know what is going on and at the very least are not preventing it.

I guess I will have to wait until you capture it all on paper and I can evaluate the evidence - but it does sound unlikely on first reading.

Hi etenguy,

To clarify, yes this IS pretty much my take:
"police arrested JtR after the double event, but let him go and that met bosses thought the real murder victim (which in your scenario is not MJK) was collateral damage. That does sound like the police know what is going on and at the very least are not preventing it".

Of course, only a small subset of the police would have facilitated the release of JTR, knowing he was JTR and given a free pass. Obviously that would have been the top bosses. I'm in agreement with Bruce Robinson in having suspicious about Warren, Anderson, Swanson and Dr Phillips.

Robinson's book is very much a curates egg for me. He could have junked his suspect and still be left with a good book providing a very insightful take on a establishment cover up. For example I am very much in agreement with his take on Packer. I agree with him that the police deliberately ignored him, and later set out to discredit him, because they knew he could identify JTR. It seems Watkins also saw JTR as per the PC Langdon story linked to recently. Imagine how much concern that would be to Warren etc if the Packer and Watkins descriptions were compared and tallied. Also with the description of the arrested and released JTR. There is an arrest that particularly interests me.

I recently found a press report here on CB published immediately after the double-event. It's clearly a planted story that very much supports the idea that JTR was known to the police, presumably after being arrested and released.

At Miller's Court, as I said in the earlier post re waiting for the bloodhounds, their seems to be some contrived delay by the police in entering no 13. I think this is perhaps would be driven by Dr Phillips. I think the delay was for people in the know about JTR, AMan, the latter's link to MJK, to give time to determine the true identity of the victim and hence the true fate of MJK.

Martyn

[etenguy]

I didn't make the suggestion that the police was helping JTR/AMan locate Kelly. I have no idea or thoughts on that. I suppose JTR/AMan could have found that info from a fellow blackmailer or just by asking around. I don't think how or who located Kelly is of any real importance.

Hi mpriestnall

Maybe I misunderstood, but I thought you said the police arrested JtR after the double event, but let him go and that met bosses thought the real murder victim (which in your scenario is not MJK) was collateral damage. That does sound like the police know what is going on and at the very least are not preventing it.

I guess I will have to wait until you capture it all on paper and I can evaluate the evidence - but it does sound unlikely on first reading.

[mpriestnall]

Hi mpriestnall
One thing I would suggest you cover is why the police did not take a more reasonable approach to relocating MJK, which they could easily have done.

I didn't make the suggestion that the police was helping JTR/AMan locate Kelly. I have no idea or thoughts on that. I suppose JTR/AMan could have found that info from a fellow blackmailer or just by asking around. I don't think how or who located Kelly is of any real importance.

[mpriestnall]

Hi mpriestnall

I am not sure I follow your reasoning, but you seem to be saying the police were involved in finding the ripper and then letting him go as long as he killed a certain person at a certain place in order that MJK could be relocated - by the police presumably.

I've seen your subsequent posts, so know you intend to put your theory in a book with any supporting evidence. One thing I would suggest you cover is why the police did not take a more reasonable approach to relocating MJK, which they could easily have done.

Hi mpriestnall

I am not sure I follow your reasoning, but you seem to be saying the police were involved in finding the ripper and then letting him go as long as he killed a certain person at a certain place in order that MJK could be relocated - by the police presumably.

I've seen your subsequent posts, so know you intend to put your theory in a book with any supporting evidence. One thing I would suggest you cover is why the police did not take a more reasonable approach to relocating MJK, which they could easily have done.

To clarify my take on the case. Kelly plus one or more of canonical victims were probably blackmailing AMan. JTR was related to AMan.
JTR killed Nichols and Chapman. Immediately after the murder of Stride and Eddowes, the police arrested Jack. Then the top met bosses knew from then onwards the id of JTR, and through him would become aware of Aman and the scandal that Kelly etc was blackmailing him for. Due JTR/AMan connections, especially Aman, the police bosses (presumably Warren, Anderson, Swanson) arranged for JTR release and then started protecting them.

(I generally support Bruce Robinson's take on Packer, Sergeant White, the inquests etc).

IOW The motive for these murders were personal. The corrupt Met bosses/establishment only concern in this case was the protection of JTR/AMan.

For some reason it suited JTR/AMan to relocate Kelly rather than murder her. Maybe they feared that Kelly has informed Barnett about the murders. This is just one possible reason. I have others but I don't want to digress too much.

Anyway, JTR/AMan's "protectors" would have sufficient knowledge by the 9th of Nov. to realize how Kelly related to AMan and of Kelly's and co's. blackmail attempt.The wait for non-existent bloodhounds, opening the door, for Arnold etc was used by the police bosses/Dr Phillips to make an appreciation as to who the victim was and who is was not ie not Kelly. At that point the "protectors" started the cover up of non-Kelly victim's murder. Eg. Ignoring Hutchinson (who gave an accurate description of AMan), getting Barnett on side to learn the fake background for Kelly (To hide her connection to AMan)., the one day inquest, the warning to Maxwell about her evidence by the coroner etc.

[mpriestnall]

I'm sure I'm not the only one that finds the below totally unreasonable, perhaps I am the only one honest enough to say what I think:

And worse, this victim was seen by the Jack, AMan, and the Met bosses, for want of better term, as "collateral damage", for I believe this murder was used to camouflage the relocation of MJK.

You are only one who dismiss my views out of hand, without backing it up. I assume this is because you cannot and have nothing useful to add.

See etenguy's responses for examples for how adults post on CB.

[etenguy]

And a reminder of how brutal the establishment behaved. I believe that Jack was arrested post the double event, identified by the police and released. I believe therefore the murder of the Miller's Court was preventable. And worse, this victim was seen by the Jack, AMan, and the Met bosses, for want of better term, as "collateral damage", for I believe this murder was used to camouflage the relocation of MJK.

Hi mpriestnall

I am not sure I follow your reasoning, but you seem to be saying the police were involved in finding the ripper and then letting him go as long as he killed a certain person at a certain place in order that MJK could be relocated - by the police presumably.

I've seen your subsequent posts, so know you intend to put your theory in a book with any supporting evidence. One thing I would suggest you cover is why the police did not take a more reasonable approach to relocating MJK, which they could easily have done.

[Aethelwulf]

Sorry, John, it's my fault for not expressing myself clearly. I wasn't referring to you being ignorant but to the Wulfster.

I'm sure I'm not the only one that finds the below totally unreasonable, perhaps I am the only one honest enough to say what I think:

And worse, this victim was seen by the Jack, AMan, and the Met bosses, for want of better term, as "collateral damage", for I believe this murder was used to camouflage the relocation of MJK.

[mpriestnall]

I am not deriding your position I'm just taking my position as you aren't showing any evidence. Just so you know.

Sorry, John, it's my fault for not expressing myself clearly. I wasn't referring to you being ignorant but to the Wulfster.

[John Wheat]

That's a reasonable position to take if I'm not providing the evidence to back up anything I assert.

I don't expect or want it to be any other way.

I've always expressed my honestly held views. If some just want to dismiss and deride them out of hand that's their choice.

They are just showing their ignorance which is their problem, not mine.

I am not deriding your position I'm just taking my position as you aren't showing any evidence. Just so you know.

[mpriestnall]

Fair point. I must state that I don't believe you have a solution to the case though.

That's a reasonable position to take if I'm not providing the evidence to back up anything I assert.

I don't expect or want it to be any other way.

I've always expressed my honestly held views. If some just want to dismiss and deride them out of hand that's their choice.

They are just showing their ignorance which is their problem, not mine.

[John Wheat]

If I have solution to this case, do you expect me to share it with you and everyone else here on casebook or do you think it might better for me to present it all in a book, as per my stated intention?

Fair point. I must state that I don't believe you have a solution to the case though.

[mpriestnall]

Well you should have some evidence of this then.

If I have solution to this case, do you expect me to share it with you and everyone else here on casebook or do you think it might better for me to present it all in a book, as per my stated intention?

[John Wheat]

I didn't pull this view out of thin air.

Well you should have some evidence of this then.

[mpriestnall]

Have you got any evidence of any of this?

I didn't pull this view out of thin air.