Elizabeth Prater

[paul emmett]

Thanks, Stephen. Excellent it is. I did feel the same as you about "almost", but clearly there's a lot said here for both sides.

[Stephen Thomas]

I was looking at THE STAR from Nov 10, and found a reporter quoting Prater. "She lived in 13, my room is 20 which is almost over hers."

Hi Paul

The important word here is 'almost' which is totally unambiguous as opposed to the word 'just' . 'Just over' could imply 'directly over' but 'almost over' can only mean 'not directly over' An excellent round up by Sam Flynn of statements by and regarding Prater can be found in Post#77 of this thread.

[paul emmett]

I was looking at THE STAR from Nov 10, and found a reporter quoting Prater. "She lived in 13, my room is 20 which is almost over hers." If this has been presented, sorry. If it hasn't, it certianly doesn't help anything.

[Stephen Thomas]

Here's a decent reproduction of the shed picture above, followed by the 1929 pre-demolition photo showing McCarthy's shop on the left and #26 on the right. The shed doors have been replaced by brickwork but the two front doors are the same and the drainpipe is still there.

[Stephen Thomas]

My understanding is that "sheds" like this one, or essentially storage rooms, were on street frontage to allow for horse and cart to offload goods easily, rather than having to lug them around back. With 26 Dorset though, it appears that only the shed had a Dorset Street facing door.

Hi Michael

Well there was a front door which can be seen here to the left of the gates of the shed which may have been used to enter the shed when the gates were locked. One report says that all the residents of #26 had to enter the house via the door in the passageway next to Kelly's so I suppose that would explain the necessity of building the wooden partition and the 'new' staircase to the upper floors, for which there would have been no need otherwise.

My understanding is that "sheds" like this one, or essentially storage rooms, were on street frontage to allow for horse and cart to offload goods easily, rather than having to lug them around back. With 26 Dorset though, it appears that only the shed had a Dorset Street facing door.

Was that normal?

Best regards all.

[Stewart P Evans]

A Shed

Yes, all the incidental detail is wrong, but I was nevertheless intrigued by the use of the terms outhouse and shed. I've always thought that the gated room at the front of 26 Dorset Street—being an integral part of the building—would have been referred to as a storeroom.
Regards,
Simon

The use of the term 'shed' has always been a bit confusing, as Simon indicates. However, reference to a standard 1887 dictionary shows that the word may have been used a bit differently in those days. Here is the 1887 dictionary defiinition -

[Tom_Wescott]

You'd think he would know that, what with his name being AP* and all.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott




* Associated Press

[Sam Flynn]

Kelly's murder in 'Dorset Court' reported in:

Croydon Advertiser.
Echo.
East and Westham Gazette.
Evening News.

It was a Press Association report, repeated verbatim in each of those papers, AP.

[Cap'n Jack]

Kelly's murder in 'Dorset Court' reported in:

Croydon Advertiser.
Echo.
East and Westham Gazette.
Evening News.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Stephen,

Yes, all the incidental detail is wrong, but I was nevertheless intrigued by the use of the terms outhouse and shed. I've always thought that the gated room at the front of 26 Dorset Street—being an integral part of the building—would have been referred to as a storeroom.

Just my two bob's worth. I think this one will run and run.

Regards,

Simon

[Stephen Thomas]

"The Press Association says: At half past ten this morning, the dead body of a woman with her head almost severed from her body was found in an untenanted outhouse or shed in Dorset court, Dorset street, Commercial street, Spitalfields."

Hello Simon

I see what you're getting at here (Prater living over a shed) but this report is just hopelessly wrong. Mary Kelly's room was not untenanted nor an outhouse nor a shed and nor was it in Dorset Court.

My best wishes to you

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

Maybe this will help solve the riddle of the location of Elizabeth Prater's room.

Evening News, November 9th 1888—

"The Press Association says: At half past ten this morning, the dead body of a woman with her head almost severed from her body was found in an untenanted outhouse or shed in Dorset court, Dorset street, Commercial street, Spitalfields."

Regards,

Simon

[Cap'n Jack]

I just don't see Miller's Court like everyone else.
I see it like this:

[Cap'n Jack]

This is from a later Old Bailey trial:

'By the COURT. The lodging-house is almost facing the shop—it would be difficult to say accurately at that time of night whether they were coming towards us or going from us.'

This refers to Crossingham's Lodging House, and McCarthy's shop.
My understanding is that Kelly's room was partioned from the store room to the shop, thereby Prater would have been living above the shop, facing Crossingham's.
Nicht wahr, Sam?