Louis Diemschutz

[Robert]

I don't know whether this has come up before.

Times June 22nd 1889

[Debra A]

Hi Robert,
Thanks for this.
do you know what the 'in favour of relief' bit means in relation to Louis?

also, does anyone know what a 'Kaylor watchers benefit society' might be? it's headquarters were at the Berner St club.

Debs

[Sam Flynn]

Here's a related earlier Times article, dated 4th May 1889:

[m_w_r]

Clearly Diemschutz and Kozebrodski had got themselves into a spot of bother, and the petitioners referred to in the Times of 22 June 1889 were seeking Diemschutz's "relief" from his imprisonment.

Diemschutz's name, in the meantime, must have caused Victorian sub-editors all kinds of anxiety, although this example must be the least flattering alternative spelling of those seen on this thread so far.

From the Times, 26 April 1889.



Mark

[Robert]

Hi Debs, Gareth and Mark

Yes, we've had that variation of the name and I can hear Gareth sharpening his umlauts as I type.

I can only assume that "relief" meant "go easy on him."

I'm nonplussed by Kaylor. I tried the 1881 occupation box on Ancestry, but no occupation to do with Kaylor, no occupation such as "Taylor/Tailor watcher."

One man even listed his occupation as "watcher of the dead" - but no Kaylors.

[Debra A]

Thanks Sam and Mark, makes more sense now!
I think the 'schitz' spelling comes up a lot though.

[Natalie Severn]

Here is a report from JtR Scotland Yard Investigates by Stewart Evans and Donald Rumbelow.It can be found under notes on The London Terror page 290.

".....many marches and demonstrations started from the[Berner Street] club.Interestingly,in March 1889 when Monro was commissioner,there was a fight outside the club involving between 200 and 300 people,one of whom was Diemschutz,who had found Stride"s body.According to one report ,the police forced their way into the club,"broke windows,tore down pictures and posters and fell with their fists and their batons upon a few of the comrades who happened to be there" Diemshutz"s wife was thrown down "and kicked ,others they beat until the blood streamed,three were dragged to the station, again beaten and THEN CHARGED WITH ASSAULTING THE POLICE[!!!] The houses were searched twice and a loft door broken open."

I believe this is the incident which the reports refer to and are talking about.
Natalie

[Debra A]

I'm nonplussed by Kaylor. I tried the 1881 occupation box on Ancestry, but no occupation to do with Kaylor, no occupation such as "Taylor/Tailor watcher."

One man even listed his occupation as "watcher of the dead" - but no Kaylors.

Ah...you're so clever Robert...I never thought of the deaf stenographer Taylor angle!
cheers

[Cap'n Jack]

Debs, next to the Board School was a playground, administered by the 'National Health Society', and the address may well come up as the IWEC.
They were mostly 'tailors' in the club, were they not?
As I think Robert suggests.

[Natalie Severn]

Debs regarding your pm to me I have some info up North I will post to you / RC when I go next week.
Natalie

[m_w_r]

I'm struck by Diemschutz and Kozebrodski's youth - 27 and 19 respectively, as given in the Times report of the assault hearing. Perhaps I ought to do more, closer, reading, but the image I had of the IWMC being frequented mainly by old men, bit of folk music, pipe, chat, bit of a drink maybe, we'll have a bit of a discussion about politics later on, bit more folk music ... I'll need to revise that.


Mark

[Debra A]

I never could get the tailor, taylor spelling right AP!

Thanks Nats, very much appreciated.

[Tom_Wescott]

There was a petition and letters were written to get Diemschutz out of prison. One of these letters appears in a Fishman book.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Natalie Severn]

Thanks Tom.Maybe thats what they are referring to in the articles.
Natalie

[Sam Flynn]

Yes, we've had that variation of the name and I can hear Gareth sharpening his umlauts as I type.

Well, Rob - in the spirit of co-operation and bonhomie, I am happy to inform all and sundry that my objection to "having the $hitz" has to be heavily revised. Following some research I've done on the Yad Vashem Holocaust memorial site, and elsewhere, our favourite name appears to crop up most in respect of Russian Jews, and is usually transliterated from the Cyrillic "ДЫМШИЦ" as "Dymschitz" or "Dim$hitz". Here are some examples:



In its Germanic form, I daresay that "ДЫМШИЦ" might well be rendered as "Diemschütz", but I'm here to tell you that, if Louis came from Russia - and chances are that he did - then Dan and Tom (and some others) were quite probably right. Even if they didn't know why at the time

A really useful spin-off from finding the Cyrillic spelling of the name is that you can do a Google image search to see some members of the Dym$chitz/Dim$hitz clan. I wonder if any of them were directly related to Louis?