Torso Killer discussion from Millwood Thread

[Abby Normal]

I would estimate about 60' or so from the water. I see Sam has gone for 80', but basically it's the width of the Embankment road, so have a look for yourself;

Thanks JR and Sam
and yet again, with the river seemingly at hand (again) for torsoman he just happens to throw it in Frankensteins garden.

[Abby Normal]

One more question-how far was the Shelley estate from the Albert bridge.

[Fisherman]

Thanks JR and Sam
and yet again, with the river seemingly at hand (again) for torsoman he just happens to throw it in Frankensteins garden.

And it is not as if he never made it to the river - we know that he did! And so he must have had the choice to throw the leg into the Thames together with the rest. Instead, he plucked it out of the bag he carried it in, went over to the Shelley estate and flung it over the high fence...?

Why not throw the whole bag of parts into the water and be done with it? In one second flat? That's what dismembers generally do, and that is why these murders are so often referred to as trunk murders.

[Joshua Rogan]

One more question-how far was the Shelley estate from the Albert bridge.

It's about half a mile from the Shelley house, along the Embankment, across Albert Bridge to the (probable) Battersea Park dump site.

[Sam Flynn]

Thanks JR and Sam
and yet again, with the river seemingly at hand (again) for torsoman he just happens to throw it in Frankensteins garden.

Well, regardless of who once lived there, the shrubbery would have been a good place to quickly jettison an incriminating body part.

[Darryl Kenyon]

And it is not as if he never made it to the river - we know that he did! And so he must have had the choice to throw the leg into the Thames together with the rest. Instead, he plucked it out of the bag he carried it in, went over to the Shelley estate and flung it over the high fence...?

Why not throw the whole bag of parts into the water and be done with it? In one second flat? That's what dismembers generally do, and that is why these murders are so often referred to as trunk murders.

Hi Fish how do we know he carried all the body parts out together in one go?

[Sam Flynn]

Hi Fish how do we know he carried all the body parts out together in one go?

Exactly. He could have disposed of the evidence piecemeal (pardon pun) over a few visits. This would have been less risky than if he lugged an entire disassembled body with him and dropped several pieces of corpse into the Thames all at once or in quick succession. He'd have been more conspicuous visually and audibly if he'd chosen to take the latter course of action.

[Abby Normal]

It's about half a mile from the Shelley house, along the Embankment, across Albert Bridge to the (probable) Battersea Park dump site.

thanks Jr
that seems kind of far to hold on to a leg, especially if all the other parts have gotten rid of, no?

[Abby Normal]

Exactly. He could have disposed of the evidence piecemeal (pardon pun) over a few visits. This would have been less risky than if he lugged an entire disassembled body with him and dropped several pieces of corpse into the Thames all at once or in quick succession. He'd have been more conspicuous visually and audibly if he'd chosen to take the latter course of action.

not so sure about that-why make several trips when you can get rid of it all at one go? seems to risky to make several trips

[Sam Flynn]

not so sure about that-why make several trips when you can get rid of it all at one go? seems to risky to make several trips

Not if you live locally and know the likely quietest times of the morning, and you're able to stroll to the river whenever it suits you. Besides, an entire chopped-up body is bulky and harder to conceal, and would make more and/or louder splashing sounds if disposed of in one trip.

[bolo]

Hi Abby, Sam, all (long time no see!),

Not if you live locally and know the likely quietest times of the morning, and you're able to stroll to the river whenever it suits you. Besides, an entire chopped-up body is bulky and harder to conceal, and would make more and/or louder splashing sounds if disposed of in one trip.

agreed. What's more, an entire body, whole or in parts, also weighs a lot, one would probably need a cart or other means of transportation for it which may attract unwanted attention, specially during the night or early morning.

Cheers,

Boris

[rjpalmer]

Exactly. He could have disposed of the evidence piecemeal (pardon pun) over a few visits. This would have been less risky than if he lugged an entire disassembled body with him and dropped several pieces of corpse into the Thames all at once or in quick succession. He'd have been more conspicuous visually and audibly if he'd chosen to take the latter course of action.

It's possible, of course, but personally I don't see it as a credible scenario. One piece is on the Chelsea side of the river in shrubbery. One piece is on the Battersea side in the shrubbery. Most of the rest of it is in the Thames. That's quite a stretch of real-estate. There is a home base, somewhere. Why would the culprit risk lugging incriminating evidence all the way across the bridge when he could have simply tossed it over the edge? Whether he was in Battersea or in Chelsea, your scenario has him walking all the way over the bridge, holding on to the remains the whole while, only to inexplicably keep trudging on to dump it a considerable distance away on dry land. If he was carefully going back and forth to dispose of the body, it seems likely it would ALL have ended up in the river.

No, I think this was just one mad dash, and the work of a scared amateur. The 90-100 pounds of remains were hardly carried in his knapsack. He had a vehicle of some sort, and that is why the remains are scattered from Chelsea all the way to Battersea park, with the bridge being the common denominator. It was meant to go in the river, but it was a ****-up due to incidental traffic and fear of detection.

The bridge is high. I doubt anyone would hear a splash at 6 a.m. even if they were walking across the top of it. He has a vehicle and an accomplice in the back of it, tossing it over the edge as they drive by. They ran out of time and ended up in Battersea Park. All in my humble opinion.

But, of course, both scenarios are conjecture.

[Abby Normal]

Not if you live locally and know the likely quietest times of the morning, and you're able to stroll to the river whenever it suits you. Besides, an entire chopped-up body is bulky and harder to conceal, and would make more and/or louder splashing sounds if disposed of in one trip.

but sam at least two portions of the victim were parts of a torso, so not sure how easy it would be to walk/carry it and dump-plus it would be much more conspicuous (certainly more than having it concealed in a cart). Im assuming of course, that torso man used a cart, which seems most likely in any case.

[Abby Normal]

Hi Abby, Sam, all (long time no see!),



agreed. What's more, an entire body, whole or in parts, also weighs a lot, one would probably need a cart or other means of transportation for it which may attract unwanted attention, specially during the night or early morning.

Cheers,

Boris

Hi Bolo!!!
well if he had a cart, no reason to take several trips, which would be much more risky.

[Abby Normal]

It's possible, of course, but personally I don't see it as a credible scenario. One piece is on the Chelsea side of the river in shrubbery. One piece is on the Battersea side in the shrubbery. Most of the rest of it is in the Thames. That's quite a stretch of real-estate. There is a home base, somewhere. Why would the culprit risk lugging incriminating evidence all the way across the bridge when he could have simply tossed it over the edge? Whether he was in Battersea or in Chelsea, your scenario has him walking all the way over the bridge, holding on to the remains the whole while, only to inexplicably keep trudging on to dump it a considerable distance away on dry land. If he was carefully going back and forth to dispose of the body, it seems likely it would ALL have ended up in the river.

No, I think this was just one mad dash, and the work of a scared amateur. The 90-100 pounds of remains were hardly carried in his knapsack. He had a vehicle of some sort, and that is why the remains are scattered from Chelsea all the way to Battersea park, with the bridge being the common denominator. It was meant to go in the river, but it was a ****-up due to incidental traffic and fear of detection.

The bridge is high. I doubt anyone would hear a splash at 6 a.m. even if they were walking across the top of it. He has a vehicle and an accomplice in the back of it, tossing it over the edge as they drive by. They ran out of time and ended up in Battersea Park. All in my humble opinion.

But, of course, both scenarios are conjecture.

HI RJ
I agree he probably used a cart, but it would have taken mere seconds to throw it all out at once, especially if there was an accomplice in back tossing it out. so theyre going along and toss a part on land first? then some over the bridge in the river, cross the bridge and then another part on land? as you say that is quite of real estate to cover for a couple of people hurridly trying to get rid of body parts when it would have taken mere seconds to toss all of it quickly.

sorry if you have already posted it but whats the order of dumpage in your mind-shelley estate first ? then over and off the bridge? and finally the major section of the Torso in Battersea park (this is the part that could have possibly been thrown off the bridge but still was found 200 yards from the river)?