Idiots Folly

[protohistorian]

Corey, that is like saying, cats are pets, cats have fur and cats meow. Dogs are pets, dogs have fur, therefore dogs meow? It is doubtful that given the length of time covered in the torso's that a singular unsub is involved. They are not a singular mass of similar events that need to be tied to anything. They are a grouping comprised of single entities that have have a similar characteristic. The only reason they are considered a group is that people not not thinking about the dimension of time have asserted it to be so. Dave

[corey123]

Hello Dave,

Ok let me re-phrase myself. To try and find supportive evidence linking the murder of Elizabeth Jackson to the ripper crimes, it would be foolish to ignore the rest of the torso series, for they would be relevent to your theory.

Hello Errata,

It is obvious that when one disposes of a body in a river they are trying to do away with the evidence, even more when they rap it in a cloth. I am of the opinion that the jump from leaving the victims where they died to disposing the corpse is too great to try and connect so quick.

However, you are right, if Kelly's killer did try to disjoint them it would help a great deal in connecting the crimes, but I don't think the killer did attempt it.

I agree that the killer of Kelly had a morbid sense of humor but on the other hand, the distribution of Jackson's limbs, to me at least, suggests the killer was trying to complicate things.

Anyhow, I guess, like mosty in ripperology, it comes down to interpretation.

Yours truly

[Errata]

Hello Dave and Errata,

just like to say I believe you do understand what I ment by her being all there right? The organ theft is irrelevent and isn't a good example(at least in my opinion) of the province of Jacksons candidacy. Of coarse, you can say that this was the next step in the sequence but how can you explain the earlier torso murders? Was Jackson just not apart of that spree whenost of the evidence points towards her being apart of
it. How do you explain the fact that Kelly's killer tried nothing to hide or dispose of the body? Also, like I stated before I believe he he wanted to dismember, he would have, and if he did, it would be noted, which it isn't.

Anyhow, these are only my opinions.

Well, if Kelly's killer did make attempts at disjointing her, then that would pretty significant. And there are sort of many reasons why he might fail.

The fact is that Jackson's murderer didn't make much of an attempt hide or dispose of the body. He did not leave it where he killed her, but he didn't hide the pieces either. They were evidently wrapped and sent down the Thames a piece at a time. Except the upper torso was in Battersea park, and a thigh was chucked into some noble's garden. Even her fetus was sent down the river in a jar, a scene right out of a Rob Zombie remake of The Ten Commandments. This is a guy with a sense of humor.

Kelly's head was propped up by a nice comfy pillow of her own organs. Also the work of someone with a sense of humor.

Both were redheads, both were the victims of insane overkill, both were prostitutes. I think it's possible.

Although I gotta say there is some cosmic force with a sick sense of humor out there to assign a guy named Braxton Hicks as the head of her inquest.

[protohistorian]

Not at all my friend. Firstly, there is no proving anything in this case. Secondly, all one must demonstrate is that she fits the Macnaghten criteria and or the behavior of the unsub better. We are far too removed to establish a subject as broad as victim grouping as fact. The best a Ripper scholar gets is an informed opinion. Dave

[corey123]

Hello Dave,

well simply to prove that Jackson was apart of the ripper crimes you would have to also prove she wasn't apart of the torso crimes. Unless you believe they were all committed by the same fellow.

[protohistorian]

...and why is that? Dave

[corey123]

Hello Dave,


I believe that if one trys to connect Jackson to the magnaughten unsub, theu must consider the other torso murders, for it is relevent in regard to the chance of her candidacy.

[protohistorian]

Corey, saying the Mannaghten unsub killed Jackson in no relates to the other torsos. It relates to Jackson. Dave

[corey123]

Hello Dave and Errata,

just like to say I believe you do understand what I ment by her being all there right? The organ theft is irrelevent and isn't a good example(at least in my opinion) of the province of Jacksons candidacy. Of coarse, you can say that this was the next step in the sequence but how can you explain the earlier torso murders? Was Jackson just not apart of that spree whenost of the evidence points towards her being apart of
it. How do you explain the fact that Kelly's killer tried nothing to hide or dispose of the body? Also, like I stated before I believe he he wanted to dismember, he would have, and if he did, it would be noted, which it isn't.

Anyhow, these are only my opinions.

[Errata]

Hello Errata,

No not weird. I think that if Kelly had been murdered by the Torso killer, she would have been desposed of accordingly. The opposite result for the opposite senerio, that Jackson was killer by the Ripper, she would have been all there.

See, I was under the impression that she wasnt all there. That a great deal of the contents of her abdominal and chest cavity were missing. Where the Scotland Yard torso was relatively intact.

There is also a peculiar mark on Kelly's leg that can be seen in the photos, and there has been some discussion that an attempt was made to disjoint her. So it may be that he leaves the body where it lies, unless he can in fact dismember it, at which point he likes to play games with the bits. Cause dragging an intact corpse through the street is a bit of a giveaway.

[protohistorian]

Corey, this ignores the possibility of change within the killer. It is also completely false as Chapman, Eddowes, and Kelly were not all there. The majority of the Macnaghten sequence victims were not all there. Dave

[corey123]

Hello Errata,

No not weird. I think that if Kelly had been murdered by the Torso killer, she would have been desposed of accordingly. The opposite result for the opposite senerio, that Jackson was killer by the Ripper, she would have been all there.

[Errata]

Hello Errata,

The same hand that killed Kelly? What brought you to that conclusion?

Just out of curiosity.

This is gonna sound weird, but a similar sense of humor to both killings. Especially in regards to the distribution of parts.

[corey123]

Hello Nat's,

Yes that must be it!

[Natalie Severn]

Quite---its called a "bad hair day" !