Also worth noting in the Tabram case is the evidence that 2 distinctly different knives were used, the larger only once. Logically if one man had both, he could have saved himself lots of time and energy by using the large blade first. It appears though it was the final blow, the assuredly fatal one. This could be the work of 2 men.
As Sam noted the area covered by these stabs seems to remain for the most part in the mid-upper body range, and no cuts to speak of. There is little doubt that the killer of Polly, then Annie, had a fetish if you will for female reproductive organs and anatomy, located in the pelvic area. Its part of his MO here, his Signature or whatever else you want to call it, its him telling us what he wants to do. How he gets to that point is also consistent in the 2 cases I mentioned. Don't underestimate comfort zone, risk taker for sure, but perhaps not consciously. Might not have been in control.
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McKenzie - Ripper or not?
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Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
The elephant in the room is that the overwhelming majority of her 39 stab wounds were in her upper body, and there was not one cut to speak of. Very different from the Ripper murders; almost the opposite, in fact.
Yes, the killer probably realised what hard work and time consuming 39 stabs were.
Plus, due to paucity of detailed evidence, we don't know exactly where Tabram's or Nichols' "nether region" stab was, so we have no way of saying how similar they were to each other, or Alice McKenzie's.
But, still a stab to the privates, which is probably all the killer was aware of.
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Originally posted by Jon Guy View Post
How many other stab wounds were in that area of the body?
Plus, due to paucity of detailed evidence, we don't know exactly where Tabram's or Nichols' "nether region" stab was, so we have no way of saying how similar they were to each other, or Alice McKenzie's.
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The Ripper was back. First he murdered Elizabeth Jackson around June '89. Went back to his old stomping ground and slew Alice McKenzie a month later. That didn't quite go to plan. Next time he did the murder/mutilation elsewhere but made sure to dump the victim in Whitechapel (Pinchin St Torso), September '89.
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Originally posted by Michael W Richards View Post
One might also think that heightened alertness would have made any near misses more pronounced Sam.
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Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
This might tell us more about the after-effects of a murder than the murders themselves. Namely, that in the first couple of weeks after a successful kill, people - the police, the general populace and potential victims - became more alert, making it harder for the killer to "score". After three or four weeks, perhaps people's guards were slipping, making it easier for a killer to succeed.
(Some might say that Nichols-to-Chapman doesn't fit that pattern, but who would have foreseen that there'd be a series of "ripping" murders after Buck's Row?)
To Abby...Queen Vicky speculated about people on cattle boats...who arrived at the end of the month and departed at the beginning of the next.
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Originally posted by Jon Guy View Post
Someone on a monthly salary cheque would have money to go out at the end or begining of a monthLast edited by Sam Flynn; 07-24-2019, 05:32 PM.
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Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View Post. I'm also unsure why you don't consider that the killer was interrupted, this seems the most likely reason to me for reduced mutilations.
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The C5 did not all occur at a weekend. I don't think the weekend as we think of it had really been invented. Most people worked five and a half day weeks, only finishing at lunchtime on Saturdays. So the killer striking twice on a Thursday night, once on a Friday night, and twice on (the same) Saturday night doesn't indicate to me that he waited until he'd finished his week's work - three out of the four attack nights had working days before and after.
Of course, he may not have worked at all, or only casually, or cyclically, or not cared if he was dog-tired the next day, or took stimulants, or was an insomniac, etc etc. Maybe he was Tyler Durden?
Nichols - 31st August - Friday.
Chapman - 8th September - Saturday.
Stride/Eddowes - 30th September - Sunday.
Kelly - 9th November - Friday.
As we don’t know the killers personal circumstances all that I’m saying is that these days might have been significant. What if he worked for himself and only came to Central London at the weekend? There might have been another reason that he only killed at the weekend. Of course these days might have been completely irrelevant too.
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Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post
hi Michael
yes-its a point ive brought up before too-the murders only seem to happen in beginning or end of month. and like my previous question (re the days of the week he worked)--is there any profession that would not be condusive to going out hunting in the middle of the month-like being away on travel for example during the middle of the month?
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Originally posted by Michael W Richards View PostIm not one for application of Numerology to solve these, Moon phases, nor do I see any strong arguments for specific days of the week/weekend, but I admit Im curious as to why none of the Canonical murders take place after the 9th of the month.
(Some might say that Nichols-to-Chapman doesn't fit that pattern, but who would have foreseen that there'd be a series of "ripping" murders after Buck's Row?)Last edited by Sam Flynn; 07-24-2019, 03:49 PM.
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Originally posted by Michael W Richards View PostIm not one for application of Numerology to solve these, Moon phases, nor do I see any strong arguments for specific days of the week/weekend, but I admit Im curious as to why none of the Canonical murders take place after the 9th of the month. There is a large gap in September and Oct between murders, it seems that its either the beginning of the month...or end of the month. In September in particular that strikes me as interesting, because from Polly to Annie is only 10 days...and then this long break until months end. It suddenly resumes the week Kate gets back and the week Liz breaks up with Kidney.
yes-its a point ive brought up before too-the murders only seem to happen in beginning or end of month. and like my previous question (re the days of the week he worked)--is there any profession that would not be condusive to going out hunting in the middle of the month-like being away on travel for example during the middle of the month?
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Originally posted by Sam Flynn View PostI wouldn't have thought so, Abs. Anyone in regular employment would be lucky to get a weekend off, never mind three days.
probably. but my first job out of college was schlepping Gallo products (booze). Id visit my clients-liquor stores and restuarants- during the week, take there orders and submit them to the warehouse, and the customers would then get there product delivered by our drivers the next day. Since we were closed on Saturdays, and no deliveries would be made, there was no visiting customers on Friday.so basically, we worked Mon-Thursday.
I was just wondering if there could be any type deal like that going on then.
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