Bury the hatchett?

[GregBaron]

Repeat ad infinitum..

I was joking. There is nothing on the table but heaps of flesh. Had there been a weapon found in the room it certainly would have been discussed at the inquest and in police reports.

So the whole theory rests on guesses of a medical expert?

It's funny, if something is repeated enough it becomes true, that's how religions start..

This theory has seeped into ripper consciousness...


Greg

[Bridewell]

Hatchet or no hatchet, I think it possible that more than one instrument was used to mutilate MJK. Wouldn't a single knife lose its edge quite quickly?

Regards, Bridewell.

[lynn cates]

concealment

Hello Colin. That's quite possible, but again, you would need to conceal it.

Cheers.
LC

[Bridewell]

Hi Lynn,

You can hide a multitude of things in a coat with a poacher's pocket.

Just occurred to me: You can hide much more in winter clothes than you can in summer ones. Did the murders escalate because of the killer's increased savagery or because of the increased opportunity for savagery?

Regards, Bridewell.

[lynn cates]

neither column A nor column B

Hello Colin. Indeed. But perhaps, neither?

Cheers.
LC

[Steven Russell]

Accordind to the latest A-Z (p260), the Black Museum hatchet has been found to belong to another crime altogether.

Best wishes,
Steve.

[Scott Nelson]

With respect to Greg and others who have pondered the hatchet...it was discussed about 12 years ago on these boards. When the second interior photo of Kelly was published, taken from behind the bed, there appeared to be a hatchet visible on the table, as on the first photo. Quite a few posters, including me, bought into the hatchet-on-the-table idea until the common sense of no less than a Stewart Evans prevailed, convincingly pointing out that had there been a weapon found in the room, it would surely have been mentioned in police reports. The stuff on the table is bits of her, with the exception of a possible bolster pillow on the end against the wall (visible in the second photo).

Someone who has purchased one of the archived CDs from the 2001-02 posts may be able to assist here --look specifically to the posts of one Dr. Thomas Ind (OB/GYN). Dr. Ind posted an image of the second photo (the one taken on the far side of the bed) showing Kelly's left leg raised and an apparent split along her upper femur. This observation was first made by Ripperana publisher, Nick Warren in a brief commentary in his magazine. Dr. Ind (on a casebook thread) showed his interpretation of the outline of the possible femur split. But the photo contrast is too poor to determine if the dark linear area along the leg is a bone split (showing bone marrow?) or simply a fold in her garment or the crease in a bedsheet that may have been pulled up before the photo was taken. Worth revisiting for purposes of illustration.

[Abby Normal]

With respect to Greg and others who have pondered the hatchet...it was discussed about 12 years ago on these boards. When the second interior photo of Kelly was published, taken from behind the bed, there appeared to be a hatchet visible on the table, as on the first photo. Quite a few posters, including me, bought into the hatchet-on-the-table idea until the common sense of no less than a Stewart Evans prevailed, convincingly pointing out that had there been a weapon found in the room, it would surely have been mentioned in police reports. The stuff on the table is bits of her, with the exception of a possible bolster pillow on the end against the wall (visible in the second photo).

Someone who has purchased one of the archived CDs from the 2001-02 posts may be able to assist here --look specifically to the posts of one Dr. Thomas Ind (OB/GYN). Dr. Ind posted an image of the second photo (the one taken on the far side of the bed) showing Kelly's left leg raised and an apparent split along her upper femur. This observation was first made by Ripperana publisher, Nick Warren in a brief commentary in his magazine. Dr. Ind (on a casebook thread) showed his interpretation of the outline of the possible femur split. But the photo contrast is too poor to determine if the dark linear area along the leg is a bone split (showing bone marrow?) or simply a fold in her garment or the crease in a bedsheet that may have been pulled up before the photo was taken. Worth revisiting for purposes of illustration.

except that the supposed "hatchet"or cleaver on the table is nothing more than the sunlight through a crack-something even a 2nd grader could see.

In the words of the immortal charlie brown-"Good grief"

[GregBaron]

Mind sees things...

Thanks Scott and others for the info. I don't buy much into the meat cleaver theory so it's good to see its origins.

I do wonder what butchers might have carried on their persons.

except that the supposed "hatchet"or cleaver on the table is nothing more than the sunlight through a crack-something even a 2nd grader could see.

This may be true Abby but as you know the human mind can often see what it wants to see. While some see Jesus in the clouds I usually see Red Skelton or Buddy Hackett..........sometimes John Belushi or Lucille Ball.......

What I like is how the meat cleaver has moved into the lore and is now stated as Gospel by some...........

Greg

[c.d.]

I would think that for someone like Jack, swinging an axe or hatchet into a victim would be much more of a thrill than using a knife. If so, why only use it infrequently?

c.d.

[lynn cates]

butcher's attire

Hello Greg.

"I do wonder what butchers might have carried on their persons."

Well, I have heard of one who went about with a butcher's apron and butcher's knives well ground down. He was a bit occupied, though, with strangling a woman.

If only he had been a sexual serial killer.

Cheers.
LC

[Rixa]

I was just reading the paper linked to in this post and it had these details about Warren and the hatchet:

In the October, 1996 edition of 'Ripperana' its editor, N P Warren, drew attention to the close range photograph of Mary's remains and concluded that her left thigh bone had been split longitudinally from the hip downwards, an injury which could not have been caused by a knife but something like a hatchet.

(I'm, however, almost certain that the photo is not even showing a bone, regardless of how many more than me Warren has seen)

[Cogidubnus]

It's very hard to make out, Rixa, even on the enhanced colour versions of the photos, but I share your doubts...

Dave

[Rob Clack]

And here is a photo of the hatchet in question.



Discuss...

[kevin eeley]

just a note,
when i was in my first flat,
i had a hatchet,
the only wood around in a city is crappy fruit wood trays,
from the markets, to ship apples ect. even more likely back then.
surely a hatchett would be the best tool for smashing these up ?
just a thought kevin.