The Cry of Oh Murder! - Why No Response?

[Limehouse]

You know what? When I first starting reading some JtR books, and then reading here and seeing the "Oh Murder" I wondered why someone would say that instead of just screaming like a mental patient. It does sound weird. I just shrugged it off to "Well maybe it was the time period or something" but it does sound odd no? I think in that situation I would have just screamed like all get out. Of course if someone slit your throat pretty fast, you wouldn't have time. That would suck.

It's like the old saying "First ya say it, then you do it."

On reading my first Ripper books over 30 years ago my response to this "Oh! Murder!" claim was exactly as you both describe! I've always thought it sounded staged and I agree with Sam that it was probably made up by Mrs Prater. Judith Walkowitz, in her book "City of Dreadful Delight" describes how some people, espcially women, 'wrote themselves into the Ripper tale' by telling embellished stories about late-night encounters etc.

I would have yelled my socks off. You'd have heard me in Clapham.

[paul emmett]

I can't remember -- did any of the witnesses who claimed to have heard the cry give an explantion as to why they did not respond?

Prater said it was not uncommon to hear cries of "murder." I find this ironic because it has always been the "Oh" that made me suspicious.

Does the TIMES have any "Oh, Murder"'s?

[Robert]

Christmas Day 1883

[Robert]

I don't know why that's so small. This will give the idea, anyway.

[paul emmett]

Double Bubble. Good one, Robert.

Doesn't Desdemona say, "Oh . . . murdered"?

[perrymason]

That is good provenance for your statement Robert, but I dont think the phrase was always used in that context, as we do not have as many attempted or completed murders to fill the claims by some witnesses that the phrase was heard often by.

If indeed it was recognized as a call for help, then why are Prater and Lewis forgiven their inaction? Or why weren't they chastised for it more appropriately?

I think its safe to say the phrase was not automatically considered indicative of someone needing assistance, just one of the many rows and arguments heard all night long down streets in the East End.

Best regards all.

[Robert]

Paul, I don't know about Desdemona, but I do know that in "Romeo and Juliet" after Juliet's supposed death there is all kinds of stuff from the nurse and the parents like "Alack the day, oh dark day, oh darkest, darkest day, oh dreaded day" etc etc.

Michael, I don't deny that the cry may well have been uttered hysterically during domestic bust-ups, drunken fights etc. My point is that it was also used for the real thing, and so those who say that someone in Mary's position would never have come out with such an apparently melodramatic utterance are mistaken.

Robert

[Robert]

This relates to the murder of a policeman. Nov 29th 1876

[perrymason]

Michael, I don't deny that the cry may well have been uttered hysterically during domestic bust-ups, drunken fights etc. My point is that it was also used for the real thing, and so those who say that someone in Mary's position would never have come out with such an apparently melodramatic utterance are mistaken.

Robert

Hi Robert,

Are you, or were you Teaboy by the way?

I don't see that as being a problem, however I would question someone using it if in real dire need, if it was not always considered deadly serious. And if serious, certainly not "faint-ishly"....

My best regards Robert.

[Robert]

Hi Michael

Yes, I was Teaboy. After the crash I couldn't regain my "rank" and so am now on the promotion ladder like everyone else.

Michael, I've just given two examples - a fatal stabbing and a fatal shooting. How dire do I need to get?

Robert

[Robert]

NOV 21st 1865

Again, that should be bigger, but you get the idea.

[paul emmett]

Hi, Robert.

I was the first to say nice example, but I have to admit that it still sounds staged to me. Like my Desdemona who says "O fouly fouly murdered" AFTER she has been suffocated, or your R&J, it sounds melodramatic, part of a play. But I could see it as part of a sentence after one has been wounded; whereas, if MJK is saying it, it's certianly not after her throat is slit. It's her last chance before death. And if it's me, I'm still going with, AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!

[perrymason]

Hi Robert, Im not denying it was used literally at times, only the effectiveness of calling out a phrase that was also used benignly at times. There are witnesses I don't need remind you of that claimed cries of "murder" or "oh-murder" were frequently heard and disregarded as potential trouble it was better to stay out of. So my question is was Marys, if it indeed it was her calling out, use of "oh-murder" in a faintish voice indicative of a literal call for help to you? When you have the benefit of knowing already that no noise at all follows? It didn't seem to inspire the women who heard it to action...and they might have known the difference, when used emphatically and urgently. My best regards Robert.

[c.d.]

I am a little afraid to ask this but...what exactly is a Teaboy?

c.d.

[Robert]

CD, over here a teaboy is the boy/man who makes the tea in an office, factory etc. The lowest rank you can get, really, which was one reason why I chose it. In the previous version of Casebook, I was the first one to reach the top police rank, so I thought I'd start at the bottom and stay there.

Michael, I think she quite possibly called "murder" while the sheet was over her face.

Robert