Originally posted by Phil Carter
View Post
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
PC did not pass Dorset St. in his beat
Collapse
X
-
-
Originally posted by David Orsam View PostBeing interested is one thing, being informed of "every detail" is another. It wasn't the Home Secretary's job to solve the murders.
I'd say more than just an interest actually. Political pressure from above is involved. He is being attacked constantly in the press too.
Yup. Squeaky bum time.
PhilLast edited by Phil Carter; 08-01-2017, 04:28 PM.
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Phil Carter View PostRegarding what the Hone Secretary wanted, given the enormity of the atrocity and the escalation of the murders, I would have thought it quite obvious the Home Secretary was very much interested.l
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Phil Carter View PostHello David
The Irish Times 13th November confirms my comments.
Re Warren having removed himself from official duty from his office.
Does the Irish Times have anything to say on how Charles Warren signed off on Police Orders regarding Income Tax on 21 November 1888? Also how a letter came to be written to the Home Secretary on 20 November 1888 in which it was stated that "the Commissioner of Police of the Metropolis has to transmit, for the information of the Secretary of State, the accompanying return showing the numbers of officers of each rank who will probably be employed at the cost of the special vote between the 1st March 1889 and the 25th February 1890"?
The letter was signed by Colonel Pearson "for the Commissioner".
Of course, to the extent that Warren was not around during November, Col Pearson would have deputised for him in the usual way.
Leave a comment:
-
Hello Jon,
Thank you for the reply.
I didn't say PC 63L was involved in Mitre Square.
I meant that like Mitre Square, there was a beat policeman near that did not enter Dorset Street.
Regarding reports written.
Do you happen to know if D.S.Swanson wrote a report about the Dorset Street murder? (My memory fails me..sorry)
Phil
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by David Orsam View PostWell don't forget Phil that Warren remained in his office for the rest of November.
And is there any evidence that the Home Secretary wanted "every detail" of the Kelly murder presented to him?
The Irish Times 13th November confirms my comments.
Re Warren having removed himself from official duty from his office.
Regarding what the Hone Secretary wanted, given the enormity of the atrocity and the escalation of the murders, I would have thought it quite obvious the Home Secretary was very much interested. I do believe he had a visitor from Whitechapel the next evening after the murder..Doctor Phillips? This is an indication of the severity of the issue.
Phil
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View PostHmm....if that were the case, it's a wonder that Jack managed to find any victims!
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Phil Carter View PostHello Jon,
The most obvious thing here is that the policeman was not IN Dorset Street..but passed by at the Commercial Road End.
Except that the IPN credits the constable with saying that he heard nothing. Well, of course he would hear nothing if he was way off in Commercial street. That claim only makes sense if the constable was patrolling Dorset street, so we are really no wiser as to what beat 63 L was on that night.
The IPN should have provided a paragraph concerning constable 63 L, if only to put that "I heard nothing" into some kind of context.
I am not aware of the geographical details of the Dorset Street beat.. but can it not be that said policeman mentioned in the press story by Hutchinson was infact on a different beat ( a la Mitre Square) ?
Therefore without confirmation of the actual beat that included Dorset Street..we cannot say whether Hutchinson's policeman was PC 63L Rouse.
As regards Abberline.. we may not have to be privy to his sources..but it is highly likely..given other reports having such details passed on up the chain that it would be the norm to do so.
Where is all the detail from the inquest? Abberline doesn't provide any, yet he begins his report with that subject.
Files contain the detail, reports merely give updates for anything new, and a summary for anything ongoing.
We must remember that the Dorset Street murder was the worst of atrocities. An even greater culmination of degredation through murder. Under the circumstances I feel that no report with Abberline's name under it would leave any detail out. The Home Secretary would be wanting rvery detail presented. Whomever did so. And the first step was Abberline's report to his superiors. They would demand a comprehensive overview of the whole evening. Because one of them had to pass it on to the Home Secretary. And remember..Warren was not around anymore..so who would pass the info on upwards. Assistant Commissioner Robert Anderson. Yes..those details would have been noted I feel.
Phil
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Sam Flynn View PostQuite possibly so, but perhaps not every time.
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Sam Flynn View PostI wouldn't necessarily assume that the police would have been that thorough, though. I'm not implying any dereliction of duty on his part, by the way, it's just that it would have been impractical for him to cover every base.
Plus Maurice Lewis cut short his gambling when someone spotted a PC in Dorset St.
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Darryl Kenyon View PostAccording to Mary Cox, MJK was singing from around 11:45 pm to One am. We don't know if going into Millers Court was part of the beat bobbies route but i feel that going up the passage and shining his lantern into the court was a probability
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Phil Carter View PostThe Home Secretary would be wanting rvery detail presented. Whomever did so. And the first step was Abberline's report to his superiors. They would demand a comprehensive overview of the whole evening. Because one of them had to pass it on to the Home Secretary. And remember..Warren was not around anymore..so who would pass the info on upwards. Assistant Commissioner Robert Anderson. Yes..those details would have been noted I feel.
And is there any evidence that the Home Secretary wanted "every detail" of the Kelly murder presented to him?
Leave a comment:
-
Originally posted by Wickerman View Post...From Hutchinson's point of view, he didn't see a man, so he saw nobody, regardless how many women or children he saw...Society was totally the domain of the male.
Leave a comment:
-
According to Mary Cox, MJK was singing from around 11:45 pm to One am. We don't know if going into Millers Court was part of the beat bobbies route but i feel that going up the passage and shining his lantern into the court was a probability. If what Mary Cox is saying is true, and there is no reason to think otherwise, and the bobby took say thirty minutes to patrol his beat, wouldn't he also have heard Mary sing thus confirming she was still alive at say 12:45. Yet nothing, strange.
Leave a comment:
Leave a comment: