Elderly prostitute - young client?

[K-453]

Wouldn’t it be a bit strange anyway, when a man of, say, 30 years shows interest in a prostitute in her 40s? Wouldn’t he rather be expected to look for one who is younger than he is?

In the FBI paper of 1988 it is also said: “… the clothing he wears at the time of the assaults is not his everyday dress. He wants to project to unsuspecting females (prostitutes) that he has money …”

Provided, this is true - someone “rich” and a prostitute who is a homeless alcoholic?

Well, okay, she probably won’t start asking annoying questions …

[Addy]

Hi,

They wouldn't ask questions just because they weren homeless alcoholics. And several writers have stated, that all sorts of men came to Whitechapel to find a cheap and willing woman. The man Hutchinson saw with Mary Kelly also wore "expensive" clothing, including cufflinks and a horseshoe tiepin. He didn't think him suspicious because of his clothes and Mary Kelly obviously didn't either. So I would guess they saw them around more often than we tend to think.

Greetings,

Addy

[Errata]

Wouldn’t it be a bit strange anyway, when a man of, say, 30 years shows interest in a prostitute in her 40s? Wouldn’t he rather be expected to look for one who is younger than he is?

Actually it's not at all a matter of taste. It's a matter of economics. Young prostitutes and attractive prostitutes command higher prices, and therefore did not typically ply their trade in Whitechapel. Even if a young prostitute would never qualify as a courtesan or one of the Great Horizontals, she could rely on the theater and music hall crowds. But no 30 year old man in Whitechapel would be able to afford the services of a 19 year old girl.

Since the prostitutes in Whitechapel were older or unattractive or gin soaked, they would sell themselves for pennies. So the desperately poor men would use these women, regardless of taste or preference.

Mary Kelly is a pretty good example of the evolution. As a younger woman she was quite attractive, and could attract at least a solidly middle class clientele. As she aged, and her alcoholism worsened, she lost a good deal of her appeal, and ended up in Whitechapel. Although she was still a handsome enough woman that there was some surprise that she was not working in a better neighborhood. I imagine in her case that the decline was due more to behavioral issues rather than aging alone.

[Sister Hyde]

Wouldn’t it be a bit strange anyway, when a man of, say, 30 years shows interest in a prostitute in her 40s? Wouldn’t he rather be expected to look for one who is younger than he is?

In the FBI paper of 1988 it is also said: “… the clothing he wears at the time of the assaults is not his everyday dress. He wants to project to unsuspecting females (prostitutes) that he has money …”

Provided, this is true - someone “rich” and a prostitute who is a homeless alcoholic?

Well, okay, she probably won’t start asking annoying questions …

What about Emma Smith then? 45, raped and beaten up by 4 youth?

[Sister Hyde]

Not that I regard Smith as a canonical victim, but it shows it's not so strange, even without considering conditions of prostitution in Whitechapel.

[Phil H]

I tend to agree that age would not be a factor.

Nichols - drunk and practically incapable according to Emily Holland, and probably desperate for 4d from whatever source.

Chapman - tramping the streets, ill and desperate for the price of a bed - she'd have gone with anyone.

Eddowes - either still hung-over and in need of some cash before going home; or (this is an outside chance only) thought she knew the killer and arranged to meet him. So the question doesn't arise.

Kelly - younger anyway, BUT was she a JtR victim? Most of the usually cited suspects are older rather than younger, but George Hutchinson thought he was in with at least a chance.

Stride - probably on a date. If Schwartz is to be believed, BS man does not seem to have been young. If Kidney killed her the issue doesn't arise.

On Emma Smith - youngsters often mug older people (even today) I assume because they are easy targets, less likely to resist.

Phil

[Rubyretro]

The road immediately behind the one in which I live in Avignon has a number of prostitutes who sit on the doorsteps waiting for business (they don't live there, but have 'working' premises).

All of these prostitutes are around the 60 mark and grand-mothers.

They have varying degrees of 'attractiveness' ; some are absolutely rough looking -hatchett faced old women in tatty leggings with muffin tops- whilst
two have better figures than many young girls, with long stocking clad legs,
high heels, fur coats and faces full of botox and collagen.

As I come and go from my house, I see all their furtive clients trying to sneak
along the street and sidle indoors with a prostitute before I can spot them !
Believe me, these men are all ages and from all walks of life, and some of them are young and attractive looking and fashionably dressed (the sort of men who could surely find a girlfriend without having to pay for sex).

It shouldn't surprise me, however. I was once given a lift by an aquaintance
who confessed his obsession for prostitutes. Being the curious type, I was
interested to question him, and he was happy to talk about it. Despite being
a journalist, with a good job, and a beautiful and intelligent long-term girlfriend
it was the very act of 'paying' for sex that was 'the hook' for him, and
degrading himself. Whether the prostitutes were physically attractive or not, and what age they were, wasn't important.

So I don't think that we can tell anything about Jack's age or status by the
age and lack of attractiveness in his victims -they were the ones who were available to him.

[caz]

When Jack was after sex with a prostitute, he may have been a bit more choosy than when he was just itching to use his knife on one.

And when it was the latter, he didn't intend to pay for the privilege.

My conclusion? He was male, fit enough to overpower a sickly blancmange, and between the ages of 16 and 60.

Simples.

Love,

Caz
X

[K-453]

I thought about this a bit more.

What about street kids? There must have been hundreds of homeless, or at least not much cared for, children and youths of all ages. But in the Ripper case they seem to be completely absent.

[Rubyretro]

I thought about this a bit more.

What about street kids? There must have been hundreds of homeless, or at least not much cared for, children and youths of all ages. But in the Ripper case they seem to be completely absent.

In what way would you have expected children to have been involved in this
'story' ?

[K-453]

At least as witnesses and curious bystanders ....


I just happened to find this post on a different thread:

I found an interesting bit of information in a book called Found Naked and Dead, The facts behind the Thames-side murders, by Brian McConnell. According to Mr. McConnell the Criminal Law Amendment Act of 1885 was used to protect the young and prevent procuration. The act carried some pretty stiff fines and sentences. Worse were in store for defiling a girl from between 13 and 16: for that penal servitude from five years to life imprisonment was the stern penalty. A direct quote from Mr. McConnell "Before long the people were asking were had all the young girls gone? Cleared off the streets,cleared out of the pubs,cleared out of the brothels, by the frightened keepers."
If this is true, then it looks like Jack the Ripper had little choice in his type of victim, at least as far as age was concerned.

http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=4807&page=4

Quite answers my question.

[K-453]

At least as witnesses and curious bystanders ....


I just happened to find this post on a different thread:

I found an interesting bit of information in a book called Found Naked and Dead, The facts behind the Thames-side murders, by Brian McConnell. According to Mr. McConnell the Criminal Law Amendment Act of 1885 was used to protect the young and prevent procuration. The act carried some pretty stiff fines and sentences. Worse were in store for defiling a girl from between 13 and 16: for that penal servitude from five years to life imprisonment was the stern penalty. A direct quote from Mr. McConnell "Before long the people were asking were had all the young girls gone? Cleared off the streets,cleared out of the pubs,cleared out of the brothels, by the frightened keepers."
If this is true, then it looks like Jack the Ripper had little choice in his type of victim, at least as far as age was concerned.

http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=4807&page=4

Quite answers my question.

[Supe]

Wouldn’t it be a bit strange anyway, when a man of, say, 30 years shows interest in a prostitute in her 40s? Wouldn’t he rather be expected to look for one who is younger than he is?

Wayne Rooney might have something to say on the subject.

Don.

[caz]

Wouldn’t it be a bit strange anyway, when a man of, say, 30 years shows interest in a prostitute in her 40s? Wouldn’t he rather be expected to look for one who is younger than he is?

Again, it all depends if he is looking for a portion of sex or a slice of mutilation. Harold Shipman showed interest in old men and women when he wanted to play God and do them in. I have no idea what his sexual tastes were, but it can be a whole different ball game, depending on the availability and vulnerability of a certain victim type to the individual serial offender.

Horses for courses, if you will.

Love,

Caz
X

[sdreid]

If you're such a loser that you have to pay someone to have sex with you, how choosy are you going to be?