6d. Did Liz spend it, or die for it?

[RivkahChaya]

What do we know of Kidney's past? was he ever a butcher or slaughterer? did he ever live or work on a farm? did he ever hunt? Sometimes hunters become good at cutting animals' throats, if they aren't good at killing with one shot-- they'll fall the animal, but have to cut its throat to actually kill it.

It just seems that if he'd never done such a thing before, it wouldn't be something he'd pull off without a hesitation wound, defensive wounds, or her screaming. But if he even had experience butchering farm animals, then maybe it came more naturally than stabbing someone in the gut, or chest, which is what I'd expect an inexperienced killer to do (not that I'm a huge expert, but if my life depended on slitting someone's throat on the first try, I think I'd be a goner).

[Cogidubnus]

I can't argue with any of those ideas in theory, except that, hadn't Stride been staying at the doss house for a while?

I mean, I suppose Kidney might have been indifferent to her leaving, until he learned she was working for someone else, which while it may not have been exactly true, may have been what worked its way through the grapevine to him.

How did Kidney know she'd be where she was unless he followed her there, though? Even then, I'm not opposed to hearing out a theory where he just tried to talk her back into the fold, and they ended up arguing, but how often does that sort of fight end in a cut throat? Had Kidney ever killed anyone before? again, I'm not opposed to hearing arguments that he was a hitman, or some such thing, but it seems like spontaneous domestic arguments that turn murderous, between people who have never had fights that escalated that far before, usually end in death by stabbing, not a single throat cut.

That brings us back to the idea that he planned the murder, and I find that a little unconvincing. Of course, if he'd been fomenting the idea on and off that'd he'd be better rid of her, and then, there's a killer in the midst of Whitechapel, giving him a chance to put the blame on someone else, it looks more promising. If I were writing a novel, I might even have Kidney be the person who sent the "double event" postcard, when he finds out there has been another murder by the real Ripper, very close in time to his copycat, and he's worried the police won't believe one person could manage to do both in a short amount of time.

Hi Rivkah

Yes, at the inquest Kidney claimed (per The Times 4th October 1888) not to have seen Stride since "last Tuesday week". Elizabeth Tanner, (the lodging house deputy), however, claimed to have seen her at the lodging house only on Thursday and Friday mights...so there may well be a little further doubt over Kidney's veracity...

Speculatively, Kidney might've spotted Liz by chance and followed her...he may've been tipped off she accompanied somebody specific...or he may've been given chapter and verse by a confidante. Who can tell at this distance?

Like yourself, if it were so, I wouldn't claim this as a planned or premeditated murder...more an attack of rage followed by an impulse crime...and let not the cut throat stand in the way of this...it sometimes seems to me that half the bloody population (especially casual waterside labourers) regularly carried large clasp knives or other bladed instruments...

As I say, I try hard to keep an open mind, but the case representing Michael Kidney as "BS Man" isn't an altogether unreasonable one.

All the best

Dave

[RivkahChaya]

So if she's found a new protector, would she be emboldened to try again? In the light of which the flower could seriously be either her own purchase (to make herself more attractive), or an impulse gift from the mysterious suitor...who knows?

I can't argue with any of those ideas in theory, except that, hadn't Stride been staying at the doss house for a while?

I mean, I suppose Kidney might have been indifferent to her leaving, until he learned she was working for someone else, which while it may not have been exactly true, may have been what worked its way through the grapevine to him.

How did Kidney know she'd be where she was unless he followed her there, though? Even then, I'm not opposed to hearing out a theory where he just tried to talk her back into the fold, and they ended up arguing, but how often does that sort of fight end in a cut throat? Had Kidney ever killed anyone before? again, I'm not opposed to hearing arguments that he was a hitman, or some such thing, but it seems like spontaneous domestic arguments that turn murderous, between people who have never had fights that escalated that far before, usually end in death by stabbing, not a single throat cut.

That brings us back to the idea that he planned the murder, and I find that a little unconvincing. Of course, if he'd been fomenting the idea on and off that'd he'd be better rid of her, and then, there's a killer in the midst of Whitechapel, giving him a chance to put the blame on someone else, it looks more promising. If I were writing a novel, I might even have Kidney be the person who sent the "double event" postcard, when he finds out there has been another murder by the real Ripper, very close in time to his copycat, and he's worried the police won't believe one person could manage to do both in a short amount of time.

[Wickerman]

Hi Wick
Thanks-Nice!I like the seaman idea. It would also explain the sailors cap.
Im wondering if it could also explain Ada wilsons sun burnt man and Blotchys appearance.

Dont sailors get alot of sun?

Typically, yes, if they sail where it is hot. If 'Jack' sailed the Mediterranean, he'd be gone for longer, wouldn't he?
I'm surprised we don't read more about this seemingly important line of inquiry.

"It appears that the cattle boats bringing live freight to London are in the habit of coming into the Thames on Thursdays or Fridays, and leave again for the Continent on Sundays or Mondays. It has already been a matter of comment that the recent revolting crimes have been committed at the week's end, and an opinion has been formed among some of the detectives that the murderer is a drover or butcher employed on one of these boats - of which there are many - and that he periodically appears and disappears with one of the steamers. This theory is held to be of much importance by those involved in the investigation, who believe that the murderer does not reside either in the locality or even in this country at all. It is thought that he may be either a person employed upon one of these boats, or one who is allowed to travel by them, and inquiries have for some time been directed in following up the theory."

If the police truly were investigating this avenue then why don't we read more about it. I don't recall any of the top police officials theorizing about a sailor.

[Abby Normal]

Maybe when his wife was PMSing, and then when she was actually menstruating.

No, I didn't really say that.

I could have been any stressor. I could have been when the rent was due, he didn't have the money to pay it, and was seriously stressed about it, and then again when he finally paid it, and had a confrontation with the landlord about how it couldn't be late again, and he was decompressing. Maybe his supervisor at work did periodic inspections, and because of the way the trains ran, he went back and forth, so they were twice a month, not at regular intervals, rather the second and last week of the month.

Anything, almost, could be at odd intervals. We have a small sample. When I was a teenager, and I got migraines, I got one about every five weeks, but I might get one, and get one the next week, or go two months without. If he was subject to some kind of homicidal attack that came about every two weeks, and we have a small sample, we might have a couple of one week intervals, and a couple of three week intervals.

There are all kinds of reasons for the attacks happening on weekends, but suffice to say that for nearly everyone, weekends are different from the rest of the week. We even have the word "weekend."

Hi RC
Great ideas!