Arbeter Fraint's Take

[Cogidubnus]

Which, as she was carrying 2 handkerchiefs (one, the larger, is noticed at the post-mortem to have fruit stains on it.), is likely....yes?

Dave

[mariab]

no grapes, but Warren quote?

Lynn, I'm not sure that the AF thread deserves to be highjacked into a discussion of mythical grapes despite the eventuality of Dionyssian implications. LOL.

Pertaining to the suggestion that Schwartz didn't appear at the inquest due to Warren's fear of a Jewish upheaval, could you please remind me where we have documentation of Warren writing about this? His Memoires? I seem to recall that Warren went so far as to claim he saw the Stride case as a conspiracy against the Jewish anarchists!

[lynn cates]

Disdain/de stain

Hello Dave. Under the arm? Hopefully one had bathed recently. (Heh-heh)

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

Anarchists

Hello Maria. Actually, I'm delighted to see a discussion of grapes. And where better?

The Warren musing about Jews/Socialists is in his memo of October 12--if I recall properly.

Cheers.
LC

[Fisherman]

I´m with Lynn here - it borders on circus entertainment to hold a packet of cachous in your one hand while munching away on grapes from the other, peeling the skin of them and de-seeding them in the process.

It also would be quite astounding if a bunch - no matter how small - of grapes fell out of Strides hand, the fruit being wrapped in paper as per Spooner, and stayed undetected by the police and doctors in the area. Remember that Phillips was able to pick up the cachous that Blackwell had spilt - it was no darker than that, owing to the police lamps that shone on the scene. And they would have been quite a few, I think!

Also, the yard would have been closely scrutinized both in the dark hours and the day after the deed, looking for any small clue that could be of importance. That would have ensured that the grapes, the grapeskins, the seeds, the grape paper bag - some or all of it - was found and accounted for.

So no grapes, just grape-resembling blood clots on Stride´s hand.

The best,
Fisherman

[Cogidubnus]

Lynn, I'm not sure that the AF thread deserves to be highjacked into a discussion of mythical grapes despite the eventuality of Dionyssian implications. LOL.

Yes...I'm giggling...but seeing as the AF report or the Club's membership is very likely the origin of the whole grapes scenario where the hell else should it be discussed? Next?

Dave

[mariab]

Actually, I'm delighted to see a discussion of grapes. And where better?

I really hope you're meaning this ironically Lynn, though I now know what to buy Wickerman for Xmas. (Hint: It's a fruit.)
By the by, Lynn and Cogidubnus, there are various threads here on casebook about the grapes, just type “grapes“ in the search function.

The Warren musing about Jews/Socialists is in his memo of October 12--if I recall properly.

Thank you so very much.

Yes...I'm giggling...but seeing as the AF report or the Club's membership is very likely the origin of the whole grapes scenario where the hell else should it be discussed?

It has been discussed in a couple articles, both vintage and recent.

Going back to unpacking Chicago/packing for Paris, which feels almost as all over the place as this thread.

[Wickerman]

Hello Jon. What do you make of the fact that Liz had no "grape" remains in her alimentary canal?

Cheers.
LC

Lynn.
I'm not sure how much grape "flesh" would be observable after gastric juices break it down, it is afterall 99%(?) water to begin with.
If you don't swallow the pips & spit out the bitter skins, as women might (Dave), what evidence would there be?

The police should have looked on the footpath opposite Dutfields Yard where the couple were supposed to have been standing for a while.

Regards, Jon S.

[Cogidubnus]

I´m with Lynn here - it borders on circus entertainment to hold a packet of cachous in your one hand while munching away on grapes from the other, peeling the skin of them and de-seeding them in the process.

Hello? She has pockets...if she wants to eat the grapes she can tuck the candies away pro-tem...(someone's bought the poor woman not one but two or three treats (the flower too?) and she's excited...she can't believe her luck, and keeps bringing out her treasure to look at it...seems natural to me.

It also would be quite astounding if a bunch - no matter how small - of grapes fell out of Strides hand, the fruit being wrapped in paper as per Spooner, and stayed undetected by the police and doctors in the area.

If there are only two or three grapes left, then it's unlikely the paper's still there...In all that muck would two or three trampled grapes be noticed by your average Victorian flatfoot? I suspect not...they weren't incompetent...but they were far from CSI standards...

So no grapes, just grape-resembling blood clots on Stride´s hand.

Ah yes the Ultima Bullshita anti-grape argument...I never heard of a blood clot which looked like a bunch of grapes...haemorrhoids yes...but not a blood clot!

Sorry!

Dave

[Wickerman]

Yes...I'm giggling...but seeing as the AF report or the Club's membership is very likely the origin of the whole grapes scenario where the hell else should it be discussed? Next?

Dave

And what on earth was going through Diemschitz's mind, if he suddenly thinks of grapes while trying to absorb the shock of a murder on his doorstep?

Not the normal thought to pass through anyones mind at such a time, unless that is actually what he/they saw.

Regards, Jon S.

[lynn cates]

kids

Hello Christer. Thanks. Yes, it calls to mind the small child with a biscuit in each hand, nibbling from either.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

Grape place to discuss.

Hello Maria. Indeed there are, but here we have the first hand report from AF.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

Por que no?

Hello Jon.

"The police should have looked on the footpath opposite Dutfields Yard where the couple were supposed to have been standing for a while."

Are we sure they did not?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

scenario

Hello Dave.

"She has pockets...if she wants to eat the grapes she can tuck the candies away pro-tem...(someone's bought the poor woman not one but two or three treats (the flower too?) and she's excited...she can't believe her luck, and keeps bringing out her treasure to look at it...seems natural to me."

OK. Can you construct a sequence--with or without others--in which Liz:

1. Goes into the yard.

2. Turns East and begins to walk out.

3. Pulls out both her treats.

4. Is suddenly cut?

Cheers.
LC

[Cogidubnus]

Easy

If I accept AF as the definitive evidence, do I really need to?

Nonetheless, she's drifted there with boyfriend, who says "hang on love, there's a guy I've got to see" ... left alone, she turns toward the light, gets her prezzies out and starts looking at them feeling self-satisfied...boyfriend gets her, maybe from behind...

Someone did that, or something similar...Now YOU Lynn...give me your version!

Thanks

Dave