A Modern Day BS Man/Liz Encounter

[c.d.]

Ok. Let's assume for the sake of argument that Schwartz was tight with the IWEC. What can we conclude from that? I'd say not a damn thing. Tight with the IWEC or never heard of the IWEC he either saw what he said he did or he didn't.

c.d.

[Tom_Wescott]

Especially since there seems to be evidence piling up that Schwartz was tight with the IWEC.

What evidence is piling up? Your 1905 reference most likely does not refer to Israel, or at least there's no reason at this point to suppose it does. Outside of that, there's only the circumstancial evidence I laid out years ago. Nobody has added anything else to the case for us to say Schwartz was tight with the IWEC, so let's all try not to make mountains out of molehills.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

P.S. I know it looks like I'm picking on you today, Maria. LOL. But that's not the case. You're just the most recent poster on the threads I visit, so you're catching it at the moment. Damn your luck!

[mariab]

Hi Viper,
it looks like you were lucky to have had to deal with some good doctors, which is not always a given.
It's not without reason that most people find Schwartz' testimony suspicious. Especially since there seems to be evidence piling up that Schwartz was tight with the IWEC. What's an interesting coincidence is that Pipeman's physical description matches a thug who pushed his way big time into the Stride investigation, both as a leading member of the WVC and as an informant to The Evening News, as well as a private detective with his own agency. Apart from this, it seems like the WVC was interested in cooperating with the IWEC. It also appears that foreign agencies (like the Russian Okhrana) who were interested in sabotaging the London anarchist movement were recruiting local detective agencies for local help with their agenda. Do you see now why it's imperative to research all this as deeply as possible, including the possibility of someone with BS's physical description having engaged in similar assaults prior to September 30, 1888? The night of the double event features an undeniable politicized subtext. It's our job to try to figure out how much of this is coincidence. And thankfully, there are tons of ways to research this.

[lynn cates]

BS

Hello Viper.

" . . . the version by Schwartz, Wess, or whomever is really behind it is perfect! No immigration riot concerns, and this guy is so new, he won't know what to lie about, see!! He needs help with English! Schwartz was a gift; he may have been reciting his mothers chocolate cake recipe, but it was a BS man gift. It all may be 100% correct, but makes me nervous."

Precisely!

Cheers.
LC

[sleekviper]

Hi Maria. It is nice to still have the eye, since I suppose they could have removed it with the fragments of skull.
Pollyanna principle is what one needs for this case. For BS man I have to ask myself would it have been stated if he emerged from the dark yard, grabbed Stride, and she fell to the street? I think no, and that the version by Schwartz, Wess, or whomever is really behind it is perfect! No immigration riot concerns, and this guy is so new, he won't know what to lie about, see!! He needs help with English! Schwartz was a gift; he may have been reciting his mothers chocolate cake recipe, but it was a BS man gift. It all may be 100% correct, but makes me nervous.

[mariab]

Ouch! I'm so sorry to hear that, Sleekviper. And it's totally neat that you haven't lost any vision capabilities.
The problem with BS is that there is already evidence piling up that Schwartz might have been pretty tight with the IWEC. How reliable a witness does that make him? On the other side, it's probably a Polyanna idea, but it won't kill me if I attempted to research similar incidents at the Old Bailey and the Malborough courts, trying to see if there are any physical descriptions matching BS.
I don't think that the fact that a live interpreter (possibly William Wess?) translated Schwartz's testimony is what's causing the bulk of the problem. What preoccupies me is if Schwartz partly lied or totally lied: as in, did Pipeman carry a knife and run after Schwartz vs. did Pipeman and BS EVER existed?

[sleekviper]

Wow Maria, that was an unlucky chain of events. Yes, the left orbital wall and floor were destroyed, just fragments remained, why they assumed I would be blind in the eye.
BS man would be the last point I would use in any of this case. The witness does not speak or understand English, and if there is only one individual able to translate, then it is just as likely the words of the interpretor, as it is the witness. Even if it were word for word, doubt still remains since there is little way to challenge anything that has been said. One would need to know that the person linking two languages is completely unbiased in all respects to the situation at hand, and I can not see that as the case here.

[mariab]

Caz wrote:
Originally Posted by mariab
(And I didn't even utter “stationary“. Because I didn't know it was a typo either.)
Nor did Tom, Maria. I would have put it down to an amusing typo, like the ones we all make, all the time. But Tom put me right on that. He thought it was actually spelled that way, and I remember you defending him, saying it could be.
Yes, I know. Caz, I was totally honest, and I SWEAR that in the States most people spell it with an “a“, most shops too. I remember I was in Francis Bay, South Africa this summer and we went for a snack after surfing and in the town's main square I see this “stationery shop“ spelled with an “e“ and I immediately thought of you. Very sympathetically too. I even think I mentioned it in some post. That's when I started figuring out that I had already developped an emotional connection to Ripperology, hardly one month after joining casebook. I was laughing at the “stationery shop“ and my friends were like “What's up?“ and it was too complicated and too much of an insider joke to exlain.
For the Birchwood saga I just wanted to say that I completely agree with the fact that you were all offended by her behaviour. That's what I meant by “ugly“. Her behaviour, not yours.

Caz wrote:
I got my one and only black eye playing bridge with my first husband. Does that beat a piano?
I hope he didn't give you a black eye because you won over him at bridge?! :-)
The story with the piano is that my mom keeps my piano in a bedroom next to a built-in closet which for some reason spots a ridiculously long key. As usual it was hot in Athens, Greece, I was keeping minimal lights on in the room, I was taking some stuff from my travel bag on the floor and almost got said long key in the eye, which I avoided, but while avoiding it I almost got my nose smashed against the corner of my piano, I managed to avoid that too, and instead of breaking my nose, I got a shiner and a black eye. What's funny is that later that evening I went to the movies in the old part of town and managed to roll down some poorly lit stone stairs. Nothing but some minor bleeding scratches, but I tore the knees of my pants, so I come home at night spotting the shiner, black eye, and additionally bleeding torn white pants and ask my mom if she thinks she can manage mending my pants so I can still use them, and she goes (in a serious tone but sarcastically) “Maybe we should consider calling an exorcist, if you keep doing this kind of stuff to yourself?“.

[caz]

I got my one and only black eye playing bridge with my first husband. Does that beat a piano?

British people just don't like Americans, but want to be like us, so they tend to get a little confused sometimes. LOL.

That's right Tom. You just keep soothing yourself to sleep with this truth and you will never need to feel bruised again if a Brit doesn't accept that you solved the Stride murder. It will only be because 'we lot' don't like 'you lot' but wish we could be like you.

And my real name is Tomasina Wescott and you really should stop wanting to date your big sister.

(And I didn't even utter “stationary“. Because I didn't know it was a typo either.)

Nor did Tom, Maria. I would have put it down to an amusing typo, like the ones we all make, all the time. But Tom put me right on that. He thought it was actually spelled that way, and I remember you defending him, saying it could be.

I truly, genuinely had no idea that anyone would think of Americans as a downtrodden minority on these boards. I have always thought we shared the same qualities, the same weaknesses and strengths and, like Tom says, most of us get along famously for most of the time with most of the posters here, no matter where we were born. I don't get this 'nationality' thing, chips on shoulders, attempts to cause divisions, scratching other people's old itches, stirring up perceived grudges. I don't give a damn whether someone is British, American, Greek or anything else, as long as they can string two words together and entertain or inform me. Tom has always done that, bless him. And God bless America.

I notice you also decided to resurrect the old 'Birchwood' spectre, calling it an ugly episode. If you had the faintest whiff of what went on behind the scenes, you'd know that the public face was pretty by comparison. For this reason I would be extremely grateful if you'd just drop this one for good. Good had nothing to do with what happened away from the boards.

Thank you.

Now if we could get back to BS Man and Liz?

Love,

Caz
X

[mariab]

Great that you haven't lost any dexterity. I really hope for you that the headaches go away eventially, along with the nightmares, as effects of post traumatic stress.
What I found really scary is when you said that there was “no eye socket“ anymore. Ouch. Perhaps you mean a very bad black eye? It's really great that you haven't lost any vision either. (I've had a couple black eyes myself, but nothing serious. And I bet I'm one of very few to claim that they got a black eye from their own piano. It's a very stupid story.)

[sleekviper]

Thanks, it has been fine. No loss of dexterity so except for headaches, no lingering effects. Nightmares can be rather vivid, but I am sure they will end in time. With all this titanium, I now get to be Supa man.

[mariab]

Wow, I'm really-really sorry, Sleekviper. Car crashes are the worst, and they happen much more often than plane crashes.

[sleekviper]

no, totally serious.

[mariab]

What? Are you pulling my leg about the accident?
I really gotta chill (if not sleep) for half an hour, before I need to get up.

[sleekviper]

LOL! Well that is a good thing.