Elizabeth Stride ..who killed her ?

[halomanuk]

OK,before i go away i cant keep a Friday poll down,and this is in honour of Roy and Celesta and Jen :

Liz Stride was part of the 'double event,'or was she ?

Who killed this poor girl in your opinion ?

Vote below :

[celee]

HI,

Golden Messenger killed Liz Stride. Were have you been the last 24 hours

Your friend, Brad

[sdreid]

JtR dun it

[Ryan_Miller]

I'm gonna have to say "Michael Kidney" did it... though I agree if Golden Messenger was a choice I would have chosen it hands down!

[Tom_Wescott]

Celee, that was hilarious!

As for the choices, it presumes that BS Man was not Jack the Ripper. Same with Pipeman. Many people people believe one of the other was JTR thus they're indistinguishable in their minds. That will skew the voting.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[babybird67]

good poll Barry

thanks!

Hope you are enjoying the sunshine.

I think it was JtR...i was doubtful for a bit, but spoke to someone who had done the Ripper tour and he said how close all these murder sites were...that makes me more sure...or two murders happened extremely close geographically and in terms of time, which i doubt.

[tji]

Hi all

Gotta go with Michael Kidney, as usual.

[Celesta]

Hi Barry,

I like this one!

I'm constantly back and forth on this. I guess a few of us are. Right now, I'm leaning toward BS man. From what we think we know, he was there. Was he Jack? Was he Kidney? I can't say. At times I think he was and, other times, I think not. If we don't think BS man or Pipe dude was Jack, then would the results give us an idea of who doesn't believe they were? Probably not since not everyone will vote.

On the other hand, Babybird's remarks about the short distance between the two crime scenes, are enlightening, since I've not taken the tour, except by map.

Sheesh. That's my long-winded post for the day. Thanks, Haloman. Hope you enjoy the trip.

[Tom_Wescott]

On the other hand, Babybird's remarks about the short distance between the two crime scenes, are enlightening, since I've not taken the tour, except by map.

Have you ever read a Ripper book or Stride thread? Eddowes and Stride were killed within a 10 minute walk of each other and within 45 minutes of each other. Modern revisionism has them as unrelated. It's hip to think that, but not entirely logical, in my opinion.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Archaic]

Jack done it!

I agree with what Tom said about Liz & Kate being so close together, both in time and location. I say it was Jack.

>>I wonder if we have a modern tendency to believe that random vicious killers were 'coming out of the woodwork' in 1888, just because they seem to be doing so nowadays?

Best regards, Archaic

[The Grave Maurice]

When I first started reading about this subject, I found the "double event" to be one of its most intriguing aspects. Still do. It's going to take some awfully compelling evidence to make me believe that JtR didn't do it.

[Celesta]

Tom, I'm well aware that you're an expert on this topic and studied a lot longer than I have. My point was that I personally have never walked the route. It's one thing to read that it takes 10 minutes, and another to actually be on the ground and walk the route oneself. One person's 10 minute walk or run might stretch out to 12 or 13.7 minutes for another person. For all I know, the guy who killed Stride could have been the late 19th century version of Jesse Owens and made the trip from Berner St. to Mitre Square in 2 minutes flat.

As for it being hip to think Liz wasn't a Ripper victim, I'm not going to worry much about that. I just don't care if it's hip. It would be a big coincidence to have two such murders in such a short time and in such a small area and have two killers. Yet it's still possible.

I see your point about the poll being skewed. If one believes BS (or Kidney) was JTR then there's no way of expressing that within the poll. Perhaps that's the point though since this has been argued so much recently.

[The Grave Maurice]

The trouble, Celesta, is that it isn't possible to recreate the walk today. I've done it a few times and it has always taken me about 15 minutes. But according to my 1894 OS map, there were shortcuts in 1888 that are no longer available, never mind the traffic lights at Whitechapel High, Commercial Road, Braham St, or Aldgate High. Waiting for the lights can add considerable time to the walk, but ten minutes in 1888, at around 1:00 a.m., with a couple of extra alleys to duck down, sounds about right.

[Celesta]

Thanks, Maurice. Wasn't it you that posted about the alleys and passages and the time estimate on another thread? I remember some of the tour guides discussing it on the thread also. JTR, or whoever, could have cut off minutes from his time with these shortcuts. I followed the route on Google street view and the congestion is impressive! Modernity does complicate things. No, I agree that it's feasible that the killer could have gotten to Mitre Square quickly.

That night is so key in understanding what went on. Thanks, Maurice.

[Mascara & Paranoia]

I vote other. Kidney's as unlikely as the Ripper having killed her in my eyes. Pipe Man seems just as unlikely given that he fled the scene too (was he the one who followed the witness or am I mistaken?). So that only leaves Broad Shouldered Man and/or someone else.

It's going to take some awfully compelling evidence to make me believe that JtR didn't do it.

Apart from her being killed on the same night as 'another' victim, there's not much evidence to suggest that Stride was a Ripper victim. The throat wound and overall murder is a bit too different from the other canoncals' for my liking, and it's got nothing to do with the lack of mutilations.