Those Damned Cachous

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

Before going any further with this thread it would be worth us getting to the bottom of this pile of old claptrap.

Stride Inquest—

Dr Blackwell: The left hand, lying on the ground, was partially closed, and contained a small packet of cachous wrapped in tissue paper.

Dr Phillips: The left arm was extended from elbow, and a packet of cachous was in the hand. Similar ones were in the gutter.

Dr Phillips [recalled]: Some of the cachous were scattered about the yard.

Dr Blackwell [recalled]: I removed the cachous from the left hand of the deceased, which was nearly open. The packet was lodged between the thumb and the first finger, and was partially hidden from view. It was I who spilt them in removing them from the hand.

Dr. Phillips: I took them from the hand and gave them [the cachous] to Dr. Blackwell.

Regards,

Simon

[Mr.Hyde]

Hi Malcolm X,
Quick off poster.
Had a few problems with an ex Vietnam veteran/bikie/drug dealer 22 years ago.
Living in my old settlers cabin at the time.Believe me I know about bolts,locks and those old type windows.Locked my self out once.
CFS/ME been really nasty lately-don't ask!

Point with the cachous-maybe a good buy,however did she buy them?They are expensive.JTR may have handed the packet to her.

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Simon, thanks for posting that, but most of us are already familiar with the inquest evidence. Was there a particular point you wanted to draw our attention to?

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Simon Wood]

Hi Tom,

I would have thought the point was self-evident.

Read it again. The two doctors contradicted each other.

Regards,

Simon

[Tom_Wescott]

Oh, that. Yeah, that's been discussed. I talked about that in one of my essays. Personally, I think the contradiction arises from Blackwell covering from the incompetencies of Edward Johnston, who should NOT have been touching the body prior to Blackwell's arrival.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Simon Wood]

Hi Tom,

I haven't read your essay [title please], so may I ask why, if Blackwell is covering for Johnston, Phillips is contradicting him. They can't both have taken the cachous from Stride's hand.

Regards,

Simon

[DVV]

Hi Simon,
if memory serves, you're the author of the famous "cachous me when you can", right ?
Nobody can, I swear.

Amitiés Simon,
David

[Tom_Wescott]

Simon,

Dr. Phillips is merely saying that there were cachous scattered in the gutter along with a few still in Stride's hand. Phillips wrongly assumed this action had occured during her murder and worked it into his hypothesis of what happened. He said he retrieved the cachous from the gutter and handed them to Dr. Blackwell, which probably did happen.

After Phillips' testimony, Blackwell was compelled to say that he accidentally knocked the cachous from Stride's hand, causing some to fall into the gutter. But when he found her, the cachous were undisturbed.

The contradiction comes in Blackwell saying he 'spilled some in trying to remove them from the hand.' Clearly, when they started spilling, he opted not to remove them from the hand. Later, Phillips did and handed them to Blackwell.

Regarding Johnston and my suspicions. He stated he did not move the body at all, but other witnesses said otherwise, so I wonder if it wasn't HE who spilled the cachous. Not a big deal, but I wonder.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Tom,

One problem that I have with your scenario is that it would take time. A prudent person would have to assume that there was a good possibility that Schwartz had run off to find a policeman who was now on his way to the scene of the crime. Another reason why I don't see the BS man as her killer.

Perhaps time was an issue, and this is why Stride wasn't mutilated? The Ripper could have robbed and killed Stride within 90 seconds of Schwartz fleeing.

Keep in mind what Albert Cadosch witnessed in Hanbury street. Two people whispering, one replying in a soft 'no'. Then a thud. Schwartz witnessed two people talking, then Stride falls down (thud) and utters a soft 'no, no, no'. It's like they witnessed the same thing, but on different nights. So can we be so sure that BS Man behaved differently than the Ripper?

I haven't read your essay [title please],

Hi Simon and thanks for your interest. I can't offhand recall the title of my essay. It was something about Grapes and subtitled 'The Berner Stree Mystery part 1'. It was a lengthy essay about a lot of different stuff regarding the Stride murder and was published in Ripper Notes #25. There was also a Part 2. I'm planning on having both published here on the Casebook.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[c.d.]

Hi Tom,

With regard to the testimony of Doctors Phillips and Blackwell, is Blackwell saying that the cachous were scattered in the yard because he spilt them in trying to extract them or is Phillips saying that he saw them scattered about (before the body was examined by Blackwell) ? A bit confusing.

c.d.

[Malcolm X]

Perhaps time was an issue, and this is why Stride wasn't mutilated? The Ripper could have robbed and killed Stride within 90 seconds of Schwartz fleeing.


Tom Wescott

this doesn't match the body being discovered at 1am, blood still flowing on the ground/ body still warm etc, Stride had only just died...BS was at 12.45, that's too early.

none of the witnesses/the passer by, saw Stride after 12.45, so where was she, because i believe she was still alive at 12.55 am.... my guess is and we've talked about this a lot recently, that she was inside the club.

[Supe]

Tom,

Article was titled "Jack and the Grapestalk: Berner Street Mystery-part 1"

Don.

[Sam Flynn]

The contradiction comes in Blackwell saying he 'spilled some in trying to remove them from the hand.' Clearly, when they started spilling, he opted not to remove them from the hand. Later, Phillips did and handed them to Blackwell.

A very plausible explanation, Tom - in fact, it's my reading of the situation also.

[c.d.]

Hi Sam,

Do you have an explanation as to how the cachous remained in her hand?

c.d.

[Simon Wood]

Hi CD,

Would they be the same six or seven cachous Abraham Heshburg saw in Stride's hand fifteen minutes before she was found dead by Louis Diemschutz?

Regards,

Simon