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Hats Off To Eddowes

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  • Hats Off To Eddowes

    Hi All,

    At Golden Lane mortuary, why did John Kelly search inside Eddowes' hat for money and pawn tickets?

    Regards,

    Simon

  • #2
    Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
    Hi All,

    At Golden Lane mortuary, why did John Kelly search inside Eddowes' hat for money and pawn tickets?

    Regards,

    Simon
    How do we know that he did?

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Curious,

      It is a reported fact.

      Regards,

      Simon

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
        Hi Curious,

        It is a reported fact.

        Regards,

        Simon
        Thanks, I figured it must be, but where? How do I learn more about it?

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi Curious,

          Daily Telegraph cutting, HO144/221/A49301C

          Regards,

          Simon

          Comment


          • #6
            rifling

            Hello Simon. Thanks for posting this. I have often wondered whether there were something on Kate's body that was sought, hence the rifling her effects.

            This may lend a bit of force to the argument.

            Cheers.
            LC

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
              Hi All,

              At Golden Lane mortuary, why did John Kelly search inside Eddowes' hat for money and pawn tickets?

              Regards,

              Simon
              Hi, Simon,
              Well, I feel dumber than dirt, but I can't find the article to read.

              I'm not sure why you are asking this question, what you are looking for -- perhaps just to get some different opinions?

              Off the top of my head, and knowing nothing more than what you have written here: because he knew that was her hiding place.

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi Curious,

                HO144/221/A49301C [sorry for the quality; it's from microfilm] -

                Click image for larger version

Name:	EDDOWES ARTICLE.JPG
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ID:	663312

                By the time John Kelly got a grip and turned up at the mortuary it was widely known that two pawn tickets had been found in a mustard tin beside Eddowes' body.

                So why would he rummage through her hat, "a place of concealment"? He knew she hadn't any money. If she had, she'd still be alive.

                Regards,

                Simon
                Last edited by Simon Wood; 02-01-2012, 06:45 AM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  So why would he rummage through her hat, "a place of concealment"? He knew she hadn't any money. If she had, she'd still be alive.
                  If he thought that she had borrowed money from her daughter, or if he knew in his heart that she prostituted herself, he may have looked on the off chance that her killer had overlooked money in this hiding place.
                  http://youtu.be/GcBr3rosvNQ

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    It must be a slow day in the Wood household.

                    Monty




                    Author of Capturing Jack the Ripper.

                    http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/1445621622

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
                      Hi Curious,

                      HO144/221/A49301C [sorry for the quality; it's from microfilm] -

                      [ATTACH]13247[/ATTACH]

                      By the time John Kelly got a grip and turned up at the mortuary it was widely known that two pawn tickets had been found in a mustard tin beside Eddowes' body.

                      So why would he rummage through her hat, "a place of concealment"? He knew she hadn't any money. If she had, she'd still be alive.
                      He was looking for the note from his Fenian leader about where he should kill next. She was always the messenger, and the orders has always been in her hat before.

                      Mike
                      huh?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        It's a bit of an obscure "fact" which is made in a press cutting, therefore it should be taken with a large handful of salt IMO......people could be quite cold hearted in the face of death in those tough old days, maybe he simply wanted to re-claim whatever he could, especially after what happened to his boots. It's hard to say what he was thinking.

                        Cheers,
                        Adam.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Adam Went View Post
                          It's a bit of an obscure "fact" which is made in a press cutting, therefore it should be taken with a large handful of salt IMO......people could be quite cold hearted in the face of death in those tough old days, maybe he simply wanted to re-claim whatever he could, especially after what happened to his boots. It's hard to say what he was thinking.

                          Cheers,
                          Adam.
                          Mighty Adam,

                          First bit of sense youve made today.

                          Absolutely, when you actually read whats being said, the report in itself is not as sinister as Simon suggests.

                          Kelly was merely looking at known places of concealment which made hold a clue, vital clue possibly.

                          Monty




                          Author of Capturing Jack the Ripper.

                          http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/1445621622

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hi Simon

                            Just out of interest, pawn tickets and bonnets were connected in the Diary

                            To save me looking it up again I'll just copy and paste the relevant post I made here if you don't mind

                            As follows...

                            I thought the diary mentioned that the clue was in the bonnet - which was what was left behind

                            The case (cigarette case) is mentioned, as is the knife, but "redeem it " seems to refer to a pawn shop - and if the writer redeemed it, then that would be a good clue

                            Perhaps the writer has a pawn ticket in relation to some type of case(?)

                            Here's the part in full...

                            bastard
                            Abberline
                            bonnet
                            hides all
                            clue
                            clever
                            will tell you more

                            Mr Abberline is a funny little man (line deleted)

                            Oh Mr Abberline, he is a clever little man
                            he keeps back all that he can
                            For do I not know better, Indeed I do
                            did I not leave him a very good clue
                            Nothing is mentioned, of this I am sure
                            ask clever Abberline, could tell you more

                            Sir Jim trip over
                            fear
                            have it near
                            redeem it near
                            case
                            post haste

                            He believes I will trip over
                            but have no fear
                            I cannot redeem it here (line deleted)
                            For I could not possibly redeem it here
                            Of this certain fact I could send him poste haste
                            if he requests that be the case

                            If the clue was the case itself, how does "redeem it near" refer to it?
                            One line says ...
                            "Of this certain fact I could send him poste haste"
                            As if the writer has something that he can send by post, which connects him with the crime, possibly with the case, and there is a clue in the bonnet

                            I would speculate that a pawn ticket relating to either the bonnet or the case was found and taken away - from the spilled tin of tickets

                            However, if you redeem a ticket, you receive the item back - is the ticket a left-over reference? ie Eddowes retained the ticket (?)

                            Was half of a ticket left in the bonnet lining and Maybrick has the other, matching half?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              money

                              Hello Neil. But what causes my eyebrows to rise is the notion that she might have money there. She was supposed to be destitute and completely without money. That is why there is the story about contacting the daughter.

                              Now one might think that John was counting on her having reached the daughter and scrounging money from her. But John also claims he knew she had been in gaol. Did he seriously imagine that she had been liberated at 1.00 AM, walked all the way to her daughter's, and then was given money?

                              Cheers.
                              LC

                              Comment

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