Chapman time of death poll

[lynn cates]

In the gloaming, . . .

Hello Greg. Thanks.

"I promise I won't ask about dusk and the gloaming..."

Very well, "O my darling" (heh-heh).

Cheers.
LC

[GregBaron]

We're only one clue away...

If you remember the man seen by Mrs Kennedy..

"There was a man - a young man, respectably dressed, and with a dark moustache,..."............."On Wednesday evening, about eight o'clock, me and my sister were in the neighbourhood of Bethnal Green road when we were accosted by a very suspicious man about forty years of age".............."Mrs. Kennedy asserts that the man whom she saw on Friday morning with the woman at the corner of Dorset street resembles very closely the individual who caused such alarm on the night in question,..."

So for Mrs Kennedy to describe "40" as "young" might compel us to ask, how old was Mrs Kennedy?

Sarah Lewis, who saw the same people on Friday morning described the man as follows:

"....he was short, pale faced, with a black small moustache, about 40 years of age..."

Thimbleby described the 'hurrying' man as about 30, but with the same awkward gait as the man Kennedy saw.

Regards, Jon S.

Good stuff Wickerman, I guess this supports the notion that age is relative...

Don't think so. At 4.51 would would see faint traces of light in the eastern sky. As time progressed, it would become lighter and lighter. Finally, around 5.25, one could see the sun upon looking east--provided there were no clouds, buildings, etc. to obstruct its view.

Thanks Lynn, I feel better now...I promise I won't ask about dusk and the gloaming...

"He looked to be over 40" but "she did not see the man's face except to notice that he was dark".

I'm not sure about useless you all but it's curious she can guess an age without seeing the face, must be from clothes or voice I guess...

Richardson was there about 45 minutes before. So, no cadaver.

I got your point now Lynn and I agree...

I think you put it well. If he is a cunning serial killer, he was there long before John was. If, however, he was a delusional lad, trapped in a different world all his own, . . .

Yes Lynn, this question is sort of the case within the case, cunning or clueless........?




Greg

[lynn cates]

gait

Hello Jon. And it was PRECISELY the awkward gait which was deemed the chief characteristic of Leather Apron. (Compare Mrs. Fiddymont's lad.)

Cheers.
LC

[Wickerman]

Thanks Wickerman. I think Mrs. Long said 'over 40' so certainly not a young man, especially in the 19th century.

If you remember the man seen by Mrs Kennedy..

"There was a man - a young man, respectably dressed, and with a dark moustache,..."............."On Wednesday evening, about eight o'clock, me and my sister were in the neighbourhood of Bethnal Green road when we were accosted by a very suspicious man about forty years of age".............."Mrs. Kennedy asserts that the man whom she saw on Friday morning with the woman at the corner of Dorset street resembles very closely the individual who caused such alarm on the night in question,..."

So for Mrs Kennedy to describe "40" as "young" might compel us to ask, how old was Mrs Kennedy?

Sarah Lewis, who saw the same people on Friday morning described the man as follows:

"....he was short, pale faced, with a black small moustache, about 40 years of age..."

Thimbleby described the 'hurrying' man as about 30, but with the same awkward gait as the man Kennedy saw.

Regards, Jon S.

[Bridewell]

Long is useless, as by her own admission she didn't take much notice.

Where does she say she 'didn't take much notice'?

Regards, Bridewell.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Prior to 4:30am.

Rigour may be open to a margin error, but the doctor could draw upon experience.

Long is useless, as by her own admission she didn't take much notice.

Jack's other known victims were night time affairs.

[lynn cates]

Hanbury

Hello Colin. Thanks.

If I recall properly, Hanbury was located in a general east-west orientation. The event was about equinox (within 3 weeks), so I suppose the sun was fairly eastward positioned as it arose. Hence, the fence would have provided any shadows thrown upon Annie that morning.

Cheers.
LC

[Bridewell]

Thanks--this helps me make a point.

Glad to have been of assistance.

Regards, Bridewell.

[Bridewell]

Hello Colin. Thanks.

Indeed. One needs the light--not to mention an object to cast the shadow. What objects were there?

Cheers.
LC

Where Chapman was found? A fence. A building. Steps.

Regards, Bridewell.

[lynn cates]

I object

Hello Colin. Thanks.

Indeed. One needs the light--not to mention an object to cast the shadow. What objects were there?

Cheers.
LC

[Bridewell]

"How shadowy was it . . . ?"

It was daylight.

Hi Lynn,

Isn't it daylight which casts the shadows? You can't have shadows without a light source, can you?

Regards, Bridewell.

[lynn cates]

illogical

Hello Colin.

"the more logical time to kill would be during the hours of darkness. Having said that, the killer didn't choose logical places, so what reason is there to suppose that he chose logical times?"

Thanks--this helps me make a point.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

2 scenarios

Hello Greg. Thanks. Not a problem.

I think you put it well. If he is a cunning serial killer, he was there long before John was. If, however, he was a delusional lad, trapped in a different world all his own, . . .

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

back yard

Hello Raven.

"we really have little idea of how risky it really was for JtR to kill Chapman there at the canonical time."

People were prone to pop out the back door at any time. Moreover, the area had several windows looking down towards it.

"How shadowy was it . . . ?"

It was daylight.

"what could he have used for cover . . . ?"

The leather apron under the tap?

"could he have perhaps left the yard over a fence or something . . . ?"

If he were remarkably agile--and didn't break the fence.

"was there a place he could hide until he could slip out unnoticed?"

No.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

answers, part 2

Hello Greg. Thanks.

"That's all well and good Lynn, but it seems that Mr. Woods' times should be reversed then, doesn't it?

Dawn: 04.51 A.M.
Sunrise: 05.25 A.M."

Don't think so. At 4.51 would would see faint traces of light in the eastern sky. As time progressed, it would become lighter and lighter. Finally, around 5.25, one could see the sun upon looking east--provided there were no clouds, buildings, etc. to obstruct its view.

"I can live with this and yes I did read your JI article....a lovely one it was..."

Thank you.

"This also confuses me Lynn, if you believe the murder occurred at 5:30 and going by our times and dawn/sunrise discussion, there would certainly be some light at that time. So in this light and looking down a couple of feet to one's left, nothing would be visible?"

Richardson was there about 45 minutes before. So, no cadaver.

Cheers.
LC