John Richardson sitting on the step

[Rosella]

I thought that certain pubs near to large markets were and are given certain concessions so market traders and porters up very early in the morning could get a drink. I'm almost certain this still happens today. The Ten Bells was/is opposite Spitalfields market.

[RockySullivan]

You don't kill in your own back yard !!!!

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

But you might in mother's!

[Trevor Marriott]

Cool ginger pretty neat! Mrs richardson said many tenants in the building worked at spitalfields market and left very early in the morning. The cellar was john richardsons workshop alrhought I'm not sure what he worked on down there? It seems like richardson would be able to kill out there in the backyard safely knowing the activity of the tenants very well and having reason to be there

You don't kill in your own back yard !!!!

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Trevor Marriott]

Is that the rumour told to a journalist by one of the bar staff at the Ten Bells pub? A woman resembling Annie's description was seen drinking at the pub at about 5am by a member of staff, who saw a man with a small skull cap poke his head round the door and call her out, though this was never confirmed.

I don't think pubs were able to sell alcohol at 5am

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[RockySullivan]

Is that the rumour told to a journalist by one of the bar staff at the Ten Bells pub? A woman resembling Annie's description was seen drinking at the pub at about 5am by a member of staff, who saw a man with a small skull cap poke his head round the door and call her out, though this was never confirmed.

Thanks rosella! Interesting connection since Richardson was just getting to work at 5. Not suggesting anything I'm not sure exactly how close the ten bells is to the market where richardson worked

[Rosella]

Is that the rumour told to a journalist by one of the bar staff at the Ten Bells pub? A woman resembling Annie's description was seen drinking at the pub at about 5am by a member of staff, who saw a man with a small skull cap poke his head round the door and call her out, though this was never confirmed.

[RockySullivan]

Can anyone tell me about the rumor mentioned in "letters from hell" that chapman was served at a public house in spitalfields market around 5am? Sorry if this is an obvious question

[RockySullivan]

That would be awesome debs!

[Jon Guy]

The records included a description. I will see if I can transcribe them and post them later on.

Yes, please !!

[Debra A]

Thanks Ginger! I wonder what is known about richardsons military experience (?) and I assume he grew up working for his family but what other jobs might he have had? The tokens used at the market wouldn't be like the farthing (that was or wasn't) found?

I have had some of what I think are this John Richardson's military records for a while, Rocky but I've never posted them before-just mentioned that he was discharged unfit because of epilepsy.
The records included a description. I will see if I can transcribe them and post them later on.

[RockySullivan]

http://www.mernick.org.uk/thn/tokens...ket_tokens.htm is a fellow's list of market tokens. Most of these are 'box tokens', issued to a purchaser by a dealer when the purchaser used the dealer's wooden box or basket to transport his purchase, and redeemable by the dealer for the face amount when the box was returned in good shape. Note that http://www.mernick.org.uk/thn/tokens...et_tokens.html lists a 1 shilling token for a Mrs. Richardson in Spitalfields Market.

http://www.mernick.org.uk/thn/tokens...ury_tokens.htm shows photos some of the tokens, not just for markets but for other uses as well. Most are nicely-made, and resemble coins, but could not be mistaken for a farthing piece even in bad light. These are basically the exact same idea as the tokens for airport services, car washes, and video game arcades that are common today.

Cool ginger pretty neat! Mrs richardson said many tenants in the building worked at spitalfields market and left very early in the morning. The cellar was john richardsons workshop alrhought I'm not sure what he worked on down there? It seems like richardson would be able to kill out there in the backyard safely knowing the activity of the tenants very well and having reason to be there

[Ginger]

The tokens used at the market wouldn't be like the farthing (that was or wasn't) found?

http://www.mernick.org.uk/thn/tokens...ket_tokens.htm is a fellow's list of market tokens. Most of these are 'box tokens', issued to a purchaser by a dealer when the purchaser used the dealer's wooden box or basket to transport his purchase, and redeemable by the dealer for the face amount when the box was returned in good shape. Note that http://www.mernick.org.uk/thn/tokens...et_tokens.html lists a 1 shilling token for a Mrs. Richardson in Spitalfields Market.

http://www.mernick.org.uk/thn/tokens...ury_tokens.htm shows photos some of the tokens, not just for markets but for other uses as well. Most are nicely-made, and resemble coins, but could not be mistaken for a farthing piece even in bad light. These are basically the exact same idea as the tokens for airport services, car washes, and video game arcades that are common today.

[RockySullivan]

A market porter is an employee of the market itself, whose job is to unload wagons and carry and stack goods for the dealers in the market. Typically, the dealers will pay the market for porter services (or else get that included as part of their stall lease). The market usually issued the dealer with porter tokens, and for every load of goods taken from the delivery wagon to the dealer's stall, the dealer gave a token to the porter. At work's end, the porter cashed his tokens in at the market offices.

It would be by no means unusual for a porter to carry a sharp clasp knife as a work tool. During the course of the day he might have to cut ropes and strings, open boxes, etc. Personally, I wonder if Richardson didn't use his clasp knife to trim his boot, then, at the inquest, realize that he was likely to lose his good knife as evidence, and make up the tale about the butter knife.

Thanks Ginger! I wonder what is known about richardsons military experience (?) and I assume he grew up working for his family but what other jobs might he have had? The tokens used at the market wouldn't be like the farthing (that was or wasn't) found?

[Ginger]

What does a market porters job entail?

A market porter is an employee of the market itself, whose job is to unload wagons and carry and stack goods for the dealers in the market. Typically, the dealers will pay the market for porter services (or else get that included as part of their stall lease). The market usually issued the dealer with porter tokens, and for every load of goods taken from the delivery wagon to the dealer's stall, the dealer gave a token to the porter. At work's end, the porter cashed his tokens in at the market offices.

It would be by no means unusual for a porter to carry a sharp clasp knife as a work tool. During the course of the day he might have to cut ropes and strings, open boxes, etc. Personally, I wonder if Richardson didn't use his clasp knife to trim his boot, then, at the inquest, realize that he was likely to lose his good knife as evidence, and make up the tale about the butter knife.

[RockySullivan]

Any other buildings Richardson worked at? He may have stumbled upon annie and a client and after the john left Richardson killed her. The john may not have come forward to if he was married. Or Richardson may have used the yard as a killing spot and then became worried a witness saw him there. I don't buy him stopping in and cutting his shoe at that unlucky time...he may be the ripper