Sickert Was Ripper

[dougie]

Hi Dougie

I guess most people know I've been out'ed as a Kosminskite

However I do hope that knowone would ever accuse me of not having an open mind on the Ripper case. Certainly from a professional view point I always strive towards balanced opinion.

All I was hinting at was I would find Jk Stephen more likely in Druits circle. not Sickert's

And I have not as yet crossed Druit off my suspect list as a posibility..

Though I admit it is a very short list

But I will be waiting along with you to hear what he has to say

Pirate

Pirate,
No I wasnt trying to suggest you were biased,quite the opposite....but what I nmeant was as I wasnt a confirmed druittist or maybrickist or whatever ,its easier for me to believe..errm .... anything? ...
And of course as you said Stephen would more likely be "in " with druitt rather than sickert,I didnt think of that.hmmm.....Of course I guess theres no way of knowing at this date whether Druitt "penetrated Stephens inner circle or not"
be good

[Jeff Leahy]

Inner circle? Are you hinting at a gay liason?

Oh err Misses

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWq1ig4sVnA

[mac-the-kipper]

I am led to believe that till receipts have been found that proves Sickert used the Mayfair branch of Woolworths to purchase his cheap notebooks and Gel ballpoint pens.

[dougie]

Inner circle? Are you hinting at a gay liason?

Oh err Misses

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWq1ig4sVnA

yes,it was a play on words.... i believe thats where the "connection" might be....if there is one.
regards

[Jeff Leahy]

BBC RADIO 4 program 11.30

Good Morning Sickert Suckers.

Just a quick post for those of you that follow the 'Sickert' trail.

BBC Radio 4 have a program on Sickerts painting this morning at 11.30.

These programs are usually available on podcast later so I will try and find a link if it is...

Happy listening

Pirate

[Mike Covell]

Just follow this link to listen live,

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/

Or follow this one if you missed it,

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/progs/listenagain.shtml

[Jeff Leahy]

Cheers Mike

[Jeff Leahy]

Well worth checking this out. Especially if your into Oscar Wilde..

Sickert comes over as OK..that damn Cornwall Woman

[Sara]

I have read Pat Cromwell's book "Portrait of a Killer..." and her theories are not so impossible to believe. Also after having read Stephen Frye's dissertation, I am more convinced than ever that Walter Sickert could possibly be the killer. There are just too many coincidences i.e. watermarks of paper used, the use of the name Mr. Nemo and the drawings on the letters sent to the police that could not have been done by anyone without artistic talent. That Walter Sickert would join in the sending of hoax letters to Scotland Yard about horrific murders is also too much of a coincidence, not to mention the homicidal themes in some of his art, some of which by coincidence resemble the murdered victims in different poses and locations.

Firstly, all educated people of the period were expected to be able to draw, male or female. Secondly, it's not unusual for artists to be inspired by horrific contemporary events (cf Gericault's Wreck of the Medusa, or some of Goya's art during the Napoleonic Wars).

However in the matter of Sickert's paintings inspired by the JtR murder/s Cormwell's research was very faulty. She rests a lot of her case on the 'fact' he could only have known what the body looked like in situ if he had done the murder - but it was subsequently discovered that Sickert had had early access to the victim photographs, via a French source; I remember reading this in a long article refuting the book a year or two ago. Iirc, a limited-circulation book had been published by some French police officer and Sickert had somehow come by a copy, and refers to it in letters or some such. I think the article was in one of the UK Sunday broadsheets, possibly in the magazine section. Does anyone have it? - I can only remember the gist.

I'm sorry I don't remember the details very clearly, as there was much else in that vein; I never read Cornwell's book as I found the whole idea of Sickert as Jack insultingly preposterous, and I was so angry when I read that Cornwell destroyed at least one of his paintings in her mad search for 'evidence' that I could never bring myself to read the damn thing, esp given the torrent of articles etc, in refutation of her ravings (many of which I did read!). Francis Bacon was a great fan of Sickert btw, and bought a few of his paintings over the years - maybe he committed a few murders on his nocturnal wanderings around London too LOL

As many have remarked, the sending of letters proves nothing, except possibly a morbid sense of humour and/or a propensity (common in artistic circles) to poke the tiger of authority

[toots54]

Not Likely

I just finished reading PC's book for the second time and I was as unimpressed as the first time. PC makes the statement that serial killers don't just quit, so where are the other victims??? Sickert lived many, many years after the murders with nothing to indicate that the murders continued. In addition, most of Sickert's paintings were not dark or suspicious in nature. Go to the Tate museum web site and check them out for yourself.
PC made many statements in the book without the evidence to back them up. At first you are given the impression that WS was unable to have sex due to a deformity and that this probably drove him insane. Yet, at the end of the book she backsteps about his childless state; adding the ifs and ands, so to speak. As far as I was concerned, the only compelling evidence to suggest that the killer may have been an artist was the letters written with a paintbrush and the different mediums and types of paper involved. Yet, during that time, watermarked stationary was very common. Most people wrote letters and kept stationary handy for correspondence.

I, like most people who bought the book, was very disappointed that her evidence was so shaky, especially the DNA evidence. Her statements that she solved the case are very, very off base. She just added another suspect to the board. He apparently was not a "normal" nor a nice man, but that does not mean that he was a murderer.

[miss marple]

HI Toots54,
So Sickert was not a normal or nice man because ,miz cornwell says so. Do try and find out about Sickert the real man instead of mouthing off her ignorant opinions. The opposite is true, Sickert had masses of loyal friends and pupils, he was an interesting, sophisticated,entertaining man with energy and drive who loved life and he was successful with women. He was a true citizen of the world who had many broad ranging interests apart from art, He was a very good writer and critic. and a ranconteur He loved the theatre, acting, good food, cooking, jokes, popular culture, photography and of course was fascinated by crime. He was fascinated by the Ripper case and the case of The Titchbourne Claiment. He loved telling a story about a former landlady who claimed to have had The Ripper in her house.
Were he alive today, I 'm sure he would be a vigorous contributor to the case book. Miss Marple

[Tomtit]

William Ewart Gladstone is just as likely to have done in the East End whores. Or Sir Arthur Sullivan. Or any other notable Victorian you care to name.

And Sir Arthur is just as likely to be the father of Mary Kelly's child.
Loads of speculation running in that direction but it's all just that--speculation.

[Jeff Leahy]

HI Toots54,
So Sickert was not a normal or nice man because ,miz cornwell says so. Do try and find out about Sickert the real man instead of mouthing off her ignorant opinions. The opposite is true, Sickert had masses of loyal friends and pupils, he was an interesting, sophisticated,entertaining man with energy and drive who loved life and he was successful with women. He was a true citizen of the world who had many broad ranging interests apart from art, He was a very good writer and critic. and a ranconteur He loved the theatre, acting, good food, cooking, jokes, popular culture, photography and of course was fascinated by crime. He was fascinated by the Ripper case and the case of The Titchbourne Claiment. He loved telling a story about a former landlady who claimed to have had The Ripper in her house.
Were he alive today, I 'm sure he would be a vigorous contributor to the case book. Miss Marple

Yes , Yes, Sickert was a master of spin, not only a great artist but a great writer, indeed a prolific writer....

I'm sure he'd enjoy his noteriety as a Ripper suspect, but no one truely beleives that Sickert was JtR? surely..

But as a creator of Hoax letters? perhaps more believable?

Pirate

[Sickert]

I agree

denn034, I totally agree it has to be Walter Sickert. After all he was a master of disguise.

[Limehouse]

denn034, I totally agree it has to be Walter Sickert. After all he was a master of disguise.

Yea - such a master of disguise he chopped a couple of inches off his legs on the night of each murder.