The Diary

[Natalie Severn]

Dear all,
Didn't the forgers of the Hitler diaries "artificially age" the documents by placing them in a low-heat oven for some time?

.....................

Best wishes,

Steve.

P.S. Apologies if this has already been thrashed out.

Steve,
A man named John Omlor did indeed "thrash" it--- and Caz----"out" for the most part of a thousand days --- occasionally joined by Chris Phillips.John disappeared --- suddenly and mysteriously .Chris still posts but under a different name!
Best of luck old chap!
Norma

[Steven Russell]

Dear all,
Didn't the forgers of the Hitler diaries "artificially age" the documents by placing them in a low-heat oven for some time? I'm not sure if this is true but it is a fact that heat tends to speed up most chemical and physical processes.

If the diary had been subjected to such treatment, might that not compromise the results of e.g. ion migration tests and therefore provide a false estimate of when pen was put to paper?

I sincerely doubt if the laboratories and scientists involved would be so naive as to neglect this possibility but I would like to hear others' opinions.

Best wishes,

Steve.

P.S. Apologies if this has already been thrashed out.

[Archaic]

Alas, Sir Soothy, I cannot suspend my disbelief in the accursed diary for two consecutive nano-seconds....

But on a happier note, maybe it's not too late to get Windmill-Tilting added to the roster of events at the 2012 London Olympics?

Surely Windmill Tilting is nobler than Baton Twirling and Synchronized Swimming.

We'll all be rooting for you, brave Sir Soothy!

All you need is a sturdy lance, a shining shield and a pair of coconuts.

Your pal,
Archaic

[Soothsayer]

I hope it's enough that I believe in YOU, Soothy.
Your pal,
Archaic

The sun is out, and that Most Revered and Beloved of Ripperettes (don't tell the rest I said that, incidentally - I need the subscriptions) speaks such a wonderfully ironic truth ... for it is the journal you should believe in - it is Soothsayer himself, that Knight of Light, that Teller of the Untold, that Master of Clevernesses, and Sprinkler of Wit and Wonder, who himself is little but the breeze stroking your cheek on a warm, May morning.

At least, that's what my mates tell me ...

None more so than you, Archaic!

[Kaz]

Multiple personalities is not a sign of schizophrenia.
If the diary indicates 'multiple personalities' .. I personally do not see that,
but then again I have not studied it, you could say that Maybrick had
dissociative identity disorder or a multiple personality disorder.

I did

[caz]

Its not as though time hasnt provided greater and more sophisticated techniques to support or disprove its authenticity.....

Hi Saucy Jason,

Well you'd think so, wouldn't you? But actually, nobody seems to know of any technique sophisticated enough yet to date when pen met paper, and even if the diary could be dated back to the 19th century it would not even begin to show that Maybrick was the penman or the ripper. What time and the internet should have provided, perhaps, was proof that Maybrick was somewhere else (like Sickert) when the murders were being committed.

Love,

Caz
X

[caz]

Though I would say...what an error on the part of the forger.....to go to all that trouble and underestimate or ignore the possibility that the handwriting would have been checked.

That's always assuming the motive was money. Until the author can be identified we can only guess what the motive may have been, and to be fair, we don't know that they had access to any of Maybrick's handwriting when they decided to create the diary, or would have tried to copy it if they had.

The author's original object needn't even have been to pass this off as the genuine confession of the real James Maybrick to the Whitechapel Murders. If it was intended to be more of a funny little literary hoax (a satirical prequel to the infamous Maybrick Trial fiasco, perhaps, to paint "Sir Jim" even blacker than his black widow) and designed to be taken as such, like some of the pieces in Punch, it would resolve many of the 'problems' associated with the presumption that it was created in a serious attempt to deceive the unwary.

Love,

Caz
X

[Victoria]

.....Or James Maybrick was schizophrenic. The Writing in the diary shows signs of different letter formations and features indicating multiple personalities.....

Multiple personalities is not a sign of schizophrenia.
If the diary indicates 'multiple personalities' .. I personally do not see that,
but then again I have not studied it, you could say that Maybrick had
dissociative identity disorder or a multiple personality disorder.

[Jason]

it seems to me that no matter what argument you give for the diary being genuine, someone will always come up with an argument against why it isnt....it does beg the question of whether some people secretly, or perhaps they dont know it, really dont ever want the mystery to stop ? lets face it, its hardly likely we could ever get a 100% consensus of opinion on one or t'other suspect.....until the diary is proven one way or other to be real or fake, then this suspect will always prove to be a popular candidate. Its not as though time hasnt provided greater and more sophisticated techniques to support or disprove its authenticity.....

from Rhyl ( could be hell )

saucy jason

[Kaz]

Yeah Caz.....surely....that has to put an end to the matter.

Though I would say...what an error on the part of the forger.....to go to all that trouble and underestimate or ignore the possibility that the handwriting would have been checked.

Or perhaps he had plenty of time on his hands and thought it was worth a try.....or perhaps he thought he could have made some money out of it before it was proven to be a forgery.....or perhaps he felt he would have had some supporters regardless of handwriting and other inconsistencies and could still make some money out of it......

.....Or James Maybrick was schizophrenic. The Writing in the diary shows signs of different letter formations and features indicating multiple personalities.....

[Archaic]

Archaic, my old friend, and Fellow Crusader of The Truth - the sword is no less sharp, nor the swishing less swooshy. You can rest at ease on that score, soldier.

It's a land war this time, Archie. No starboard, no storms, no spray, no salt, no slippery, scurvied sailors on the seven seas. Rebuilding the army, Archie - the army! That'll fox 'em. Stocking up on the cannonicals. Storing up the shot. Burnishing the bows of burning gold, and running off a final stock check on the arrows of desire.

We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day!

I added the exclamation mark. I can't help feeling Will should have wielded a few more. Futureproof his work against that cheap emotional signalling the people of the modern nations seem to need. None of those illiterate souls will join us in our Great Quest, Archibald, old girl. No chariot of ours will be on 'fr'!

It's a different battle, Archers, but the same old war - we just need to Keep the Faith, for the faith will out.

Incidentally, does anyone know where the petrol caps are on those chariots of 'fr'?

Oh, Sir Soothy!

Any swashbuckling swain with a swooshy (swishy?) Sword of Truth that can quote Shakespeare makes me go weakish in the knees...

I'm a pretty good shot with a bow and arrow... You almost have me wishing I could believe in that infernal diary!

I hope it's enough that I believe in YOU, Soothy.

Keep the Sword bright.

Your pal,
Archaic

[Fleetwood Mac]

I can never work out why the handwriting is just not enough for some people.

Love,

Caz
X

Yeah Caz.....surely....that has to put an end to the matter.

Though I would say...what an error on the part of the forger.....to go to all that trouble and underestimate or ignore the possibility that the handwriting would have been checked.

Or perhaps he had plenty of time on his hands and thought it was worth a try.....or perhaps he thought he could have made some money out of it before it was proven to be a forgery.....or perhaps he felt he would have had some supporters regardless of handwriting and other inconsistencies and could still make some money out of it......

[Jason]

i can honestly say that having almost completed my second reading of the diary that there is still that tingling thing in my mind which makes me think that no one could make that stuff up.....it just doesnt ring true that someone could sit there, especially in an age when the internet and research were known to but a few, and make that diary as contentious as it is almost 20 years on. If it is a fake then whoever wrote it deserves the Pulitzer Prize !!

[caz]

There`s nothing about the murders in the bleedin Diary, Caz !!

What's that got to do with the price of fish, Jon?

I thought it was worth pointing out, before anyone else got myth-led, that the non-existent letters in blood on Kelly's wall don't exist in the diary either. You may as well point and laugh at the pile of doughnuts the crocodile was not eating, as yet more evidence that the diary author didn't know the crime scene from a kid's fancy dress party. It's kind of pointless, isn't it?

I can never work out why the handwriting is just not enough for some people.

Love,

Caz
X

[Soothsayer]

Hi, Soothy old pal! Still keeping the sword bright?

Archaic, my old friend, and Fellow Crusader of The Truth - the sword is no less sharp, nor the swishing less swooshy. You can rest at ease on that score, soldier.

It's a land war this time, Archie. No starboard, no storms, no spray, no salt, no slippery, scurvied sailors on the seven seas. Rebuilding the army, Archie - the army! That'll fox 'em. Stocking up on the cannonicals. Storing up the shot. Burnishing the bows of burning gold, and running off a final stock check on the arrows of desire.

We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day!

I added the exclamation mark. I can't help feeling Will should have wielded a few more. Futureproof his work against that cheap emotional signalling the people of the modern nations seem to need. None of those illiterate souls will join us in our Great Quest, Archibald, old girl. No chariot of ours will be on 'fr'!

It's a different battle, Archers, but the same old war - we just need to Keep the Faith, for the faith will out.

Incidentally, does anyone know where the petrol caps are on those chariots of 'fr'?