One Incontrovertible, Unequivocal, Undeniable Fact Which Refutes the Diary

[Jane Welland]

Thanks, Sooth -

I'm pleased that you approve.

However, to respond as I surely ought - SADDO??

I think any further response to that would be missing the point.

Jane x

[halomanuk]

One tries my friend..one tries...

[Soothsayer]

The lyrics are indeed lovely, but you forgot this bit...

Just before our love got lost you said
I am as constant as a northern star
And I said, constant in the darkness
Wheres that at?
If you want me Ill be in the bar

Disenchanted for the afternoon,

Jane x

P.S. That's Brucey, I believe...

Actually, constantly in the darkness, but happy in the darkness, and not playing childish games of hide and seek.

You could pass on to someone else at the bar that her troubles over my identity are most keenly answered by the light of that northern star.

PS As you believe, you are of course correct with The Boss.

[Khanada]

I'll say it again, page 184 of 'Scotland Yard Investigates'. You can argue until you're blue in the face that the 'F' is a 'P' or a Sonic the Hedgehog badge, etc.. You can cite the clouds as good examples of random things bearing messages for the needy. But if you look at the photograph from Evans and Rumbelow, you will see less of clouds and more of confusion. When you do so, and rationalise that confusion, then I'd like to hear how you explain the 'FM' away.

The S.O. and I are looking at that very page in my copy of Evans and Rumbelow right now...

How much is it worth on eBay, for a copy that doesn't show a darn thing but dingy wall and a few blood-splatters?

[Soothsayer]

The S.O. and I are looking at that very page in my copy of Evans and Rumbelow right now...

How much is it worth on eBay, for a copy that doesn't show a darn thing but dingy wall and a few blood-splatters?

Extraordinary. I should perhaps have been clearer. You're looking for the black lines which form an 'F'-like shape and the black llines right next to it - in the right order for the journal - which form an 'M'-like shape.

Does this help?

[Jessica Pisces]

With the M at the Chapman scene and the possible M on Eddowes face, an M at the Kelly scene seems plausible. It's cut off so you don't have to believe if you don't want to. The Diary doesn't fall on the photograph.
I think Poste House might make the strongest case although that's iffy too for both sides.

Unfortunately I also found "match box empty" in a poem by Josh Billings, American humourist (1818-1885).

Scratch one more incontrovertible, unequivocal, undeniable fact...!
Sorry Mr. Harris. RIP. I still like your RDS.
Josh Billings was the second greatest American humourist after Mark Twain. We all quote him. He's credited with the phrase, "The squeaky wheel gets the grease."

[Soothsayer]

With the M at the Chapman scene and the possible M on Eddowes face, an M at the Kelly scene seems plausible. It's cut off so you don't have to believe if you don't want to. The Diary doesn't fall on the photograph.
I think Poste House might make the strongest case although that's iffy too for both sides.

Scratch one more incontrovertible, unequivocal, undeniable fact...!
Sorry Mr. Harris. RIP. I still like your RDS.
Josh Billings was the second greatest American humourist after Mark Twain. We all quote him. He's credited with the phrase, "The squeaky wheel gets the grease."

Jessica,

Just to pursue a point - is that your real name?

[Jessica Pisces]

Jessica is my trade name. Ha ha. Pisces is not even my sign. But fishy stuff is my life.

I see lots of fine research done by Diary researchers go to waste like the discovery of Peter Kurten's multiple handwritings. (The Dusseldorf Ripper's handwriting spells Kurtens for the handwriting arguement!) But then again, I see Vesicas!

[Soothsayer]

Jessica is my trade name. Ha ha. Pisces is not even my sign. But fishy stuff is my life.

I see lots of fine research done by Diary researchers go to waste like the discovery of Peter Kurten's multiple handwritings. (The Dusseldorf Ripper's handwriting spells Kurtens for the handwriting arguement!) But then again, I see Vesicas!

Can you see letters on the wall of old photographs?

Where do you see the circles? (Assuming you meant vesica pisces?).

[Sam Flynn]

The use of the phrase "spreads mayhem" in the Diary is an absolute clincher as far as I'm concerned. As a compound phrase in itself, and in terms of the noun being used to mean "chaos/confusion/panic", this is a distinctly late 20th Century coinage.

Not wishing to spread mayhem on these boards, I refer anyone who's interested to Howard's JTRForums site, where this has been discussed at length.

[Graham]

The use of the phrase "spreads mayhem" in the Diary is an absolute clincher as far as I'm concerned. As a compound phrase in itself, and in terms of the noun being used to mean "chaos/confusion/panic", this is a distinctly late 20th Century coinage.

Not wishing to spread mayhem on these boards, I refer anyone who's interested to Howard's JTRForums site, where this has been discussed at length.

Sam,

according to a Big Book I have, the words 'mayhem' and 'maim' have the same root, and originally meant in a legal sense the removal of a body part from a person to render that person unsuitable for either combat or self-defence. The use of 'mayhem' according to my Big Book dates back until at least the 17th century. I'd say the author of the Diary got it about right reference the Whitechapel Killings.

Cheers,

Graham

[Stewart P Evans]

Mayhem

The sole definition of 'mayhem' from the 1887 Standard Dictionary -

[Graham]

Then does one 'create' or 'spread' or 'commit' mayhem? Does one 'create' or 'spread' or 'commit' burglary?

Graham

[Sam Flynn]

Hi Graham,

The specific meaning of "mayhem" for "panic/chaos/confusion" - which, to my mind - is how the phrase gets used in the Diary ("This May spreads mayhem throughout this fair land"), stems from a popular misinterpretation of 1950s reportage, where violent sports were reported in popular press as "licensed mayhem" (and variants thereof). In that (1950s) sense, "mayhem" evidently still retained its long-held meaning of "physical injury"... but then the public got hold of it, and over subsequent decades, the word "mayhem" came to mean what most people would think it means today.

Before this point, however, "mayhem" referred quite unambiguously to personal physical injury. To believe that the diarist meant to say that he "spread personal physical injury throughout this fair land" is stretching things too far. Nobody ever "spread personal physical injury" anywhere - still less nationwide. Anyone, if they're being honest with themselves, can see that the diarist is referring to the confusion and chaos that the Ripper case caused to spread throughout the country as a whole. That being the case, the diarist was using a distinctly modern meaning of the word.

Furthermore, the precise juxtaposition of the verb "to spread" and the noun "mayhem" (in any sense) - as a compound term - doesn't seem to have occurred in print until the early 1980s.

[Graham]

But let's for a moment assume that the Diary is an old forgery, how did the very late Victorians interpret and use the word 'mayhem'? If indeed they ever did outside a court of law?

Well, I'm off to create a little drunkenness, meself.

Cheers,

Graham