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I don't know if this has been brought up before, but what did a carman look like when walking to work?
These are the witness reported descriptions of people on the streets the morning of Polly's murder:
PC Neil:
The Daily Telegraph: The first to arrive on the scene after I had discovered the body were two men who work at a slaughterhouse opposite.
The Daily News: There was a slaughterhouse near, in Winthorpe (sic) street, and two men who had been working there all night, and whom he knew well, came into Buck's row while the body was being put on the ambulance. They made no observation. With the exception of a man who had passed down Buck's row while the doctor was present, they were the first of the general public to arrive.
PC Thain:
The Times: On his return with the doctor, Neil and two workmen were standing by the body. He did not know the workmen.
The Daily Telegraph: There were one or two working men going down Brady-street shortly before I was called by Neale[Neill]
PC Mizen:
The Times: a man passing said "You are wanted in Baker's-row."....When Cross spoke to witness he was accompanied by another man, and both of them afterwards went down Hanbury-street
The Daily Telegraph: when a carman who passed in company with another man
The Daily News: when a carman passing by in company with another man said, "You are wanted in Buck's row by a policeman; a woman is lying there."
The Morning Advertiser: when someone who was passing said, "You're wanted down there" (pointing to Buck's row). The man appeared to be a carman...... The Coroner - There was another man in company with Cross? The Witness - Yes. I think he was also a carman.
The Echo: when a man, who looked like a carman, said, "You are wanted in Buck's-row." Witness now knew the man to be named Cross, and he was a carman.
The Star: A man passing said to him, "You're wanted round in Buck's-row." That man was Carman Cross (who came into the Court-room in a coarse sacking apron), and he had come from Buck's-row..... Cross, when he spoke to witness about the affair, was accompanied by another man.
Cross:
The Times: He appeared to be a carman, and was a stranger to the witness.
The Daily News: He appeared to be a carman, but the witness had never seen him before.
The Echo: The other man then said, "I believe she is dead." I don't know who this man was; he was a stranger, but appeared to me to be a carman.
The Star: The other man left witness at the corner of Hanbury-street, and went down Corbett's-court. He was a stranger to witness, but appeared to be a carman.
Paul didn't mention that Cross looked like, or was, a carman in either his newspaper statement or witness statement.
So the question being, of these reported witness statements, did they actually say "he looked like a carman", or was this the reporter or editor making the connection? Or was it because they had read Paul's statement in the newspaper where he was described as a carman? Notice in The Times account, Mizen didn't mention a carman, but in the Morning Advertiser account the Coroner asks the question about the other man and Mizen replies "he looked like a carman"???
Cross seems to say Paul looked like a carman, but how would a carman walking to work look different from any other workingman? eg a butcher?, a baker? a candle stickmaker?
Cheers
Bill
I found the attached image of a Victorian/Edwardian carman. Was that the sort of "coarse sacking apron" that Cross wore to the inquest?
These are the witness reported descriptions of people on the streets the morning of Polly's murder:
PC Neil:
The Daily Telegraph: The first to arrive on the scene after I had discovered the body were two men who work at a slaughterhouse opposite.
The Daily News: There was a slaughterhouse near, in Winthorpe (sic) street, and two men who had been working there all night, and whom he knew well, came into Buck's row while the body was being put on the ambulance. They made no observation. With the exception of a man who had passed down Buck's row while the doctor was present, they were the first of the general public to arrive.
PC Thain:
The Times: On his return with the doctor, Neil and two workmen were standing by the body. He did not know the workmen.
The Daily Telegraph: There were one or two working men going down Brady-street shortly before I was called by Neale[Neill]
PC Mizen:
The Times: a man passing said "You are wanted in Baker's-row."....When Cross spoke to witness he was accompanied by another man, and both of them afterwards went down Hanbury-street
The Daily Telegraph: when a carman who passed in company with another man
The Daily News: when a carman passing by in company with another man said, "You are wanted in Buck's row by a policeman; a woman is lying there."
The Morning Advertiser: when someone who was passing said, "You're wanted down there" (pointing to Buck's row). The man appeared to be a carman...... The Coroner - There was another man in company with Cross? The Witness - Yes. I think he was also a carman.
The Echo: when a man, who looked like a carman, said, "You are wanted in Buck's-row." Witness now knew the man to be named Cross, and he was a carman.
The Star: A man passing said to him, "You're wanted round in Buck's-row." That man was Carman Cross (who came into the Court-room in a coarse sacking apron), and he had come from Buck's-row..... Cross, when he spoke to witness about the affair, was accompanied by another man.
Cross:
The Times: He appeared to be a carman, and was a stranger to the witness.
The Daily News: He appeared to be a carman, but the witness had never seen him before.
The Echo: The other man then said, "I believe she is dead." I don't know who this man was; he was a stranger, but appeared to me to be a carman.
The Star: The other man left witness at the corner of Hanbury-street, and went down Corbett's-court. He was a stranger to witness, but appeared to be a carman.
Paul didn't mention that Cross looked like, or was, a carman in either his newspaper statement or witness statement.
So the question being, of these reported witness statements, did they actually say "he looked like a carman", or was this the reporter or editor making the connection? Or was it because they had read Paul's statement in the newspaper where he was described as a carman? Notice in The Times account, Mizen didn't mention a carman, but in the Morning Advertiser account the Coroner asks the question about the other man and Mizen replies "he looked like a carman"???
Cross seems to say Paul looked like a carman, but how would a carman walking to work look different from any other workingman? eg a butcher?, a baker? a candle stickmaker?
Cheers
Bill
I found the attached image of a Victorian/Edwardian carman. Was that the sort of "coarse sacking apron" that Cross wore to the inquest?
Attached Files
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