The cross/lechmere theory - a newbie's thoughts

[Geddy2112]

A guilty Lechmere, let's call him Guiltmere, killed Nichols and headed west, he noticed a constable/person walking out of Court Street and moving west (the red dots)

Who was this PC walking the red dots? I'm asking as it seems not to match PC Neil's beat. If you are going to produce a theory at least stick with what we know are facts.

Did you answer me if your real name is 'Iain' or not?

[Geddy2112]

Again, Lechmere for me is NOT a great suspect, the old theory has some bugs, this is an exercise to test different scenarios, I do believe that this man should be explored further, the way Fisherman and Co. prestented the case against the carman is not convincing, for me at least, and I welcome any suggestion where a guilty Lechmere might have a chance to get rid of the bloody knife before talking to Mizen.

Why should an innocent man be explored further? He was checked and cleared at the time. He did not act suspiciously. He did what any normal innocent person would do.
How can we suggest 'how a guilty Lechmere..' would do anything when he was not guilty. It's a pointless exercise and involves making stuff up and when trying to convince the world someone is the most notorious serial killer in history that is a very unsafe thing to do.

There is a very good reason why Christer and Ed have not come up with anything new for the last ten years or so to strengthen their case and you know why that is? yes, because there is nothing.

[Geddy2112]

Because he was spotted near a recently killed woman, we don't know if he was the killer, or as you wish to think he was the finder.

A little true story for you...

Once upon a time a teenage Geddy was doing his job, paper round. He stuck to his route because it was the fastest. He did the same route at the same time five days a week and often got waves from people on that route or the odd hello. People would easily have recognised him because he was at the same place at the same time most days of the week.
Half way through his route he would drop some papers in the OAPs bungalows and one in particular he would stop for say a minute to chat to the old lady who always without fail met him at the garden gate. Bless her she never got much company so he always said hello.
Geddy often had a friend help him. They would walk together for most of the route alternating the posting of the papers from one side of the street to the other, she did the 'odds' he did the 'evens.' Now where the OAP bungalows were the street widened with a little grassy area in between. So Geddy did the bungalows, his friend the other side of the green.
One day in early November Geddy was doing the bungalows and noticed the lady was not at her gate. He was quite concerned so walked down the path to the side door of the bungalow, the door was ajar so he pushed the door open to discover a 'freshly killed woman' lying on the floor. He stepped back out of the door way in shock and horror. At the same time his friend saw him at the door way where the freshly killed woman was and ran across the green to see what had happened. In effect Geddy's friend had spotted him near a freshly killed woman.
They both ran as fast as they could to alert a neighbour and got them to call for the Police. Geddy was questioned that evening by the Police in his 'work' clothes (School uniform) and again the next day in his school uniform at great length. He had his finger prints taken for elimination purposes and all was well. Not once was Geddy suspected of any wrong doing and neither was his friend. Before anyone states 'ah they were just kids' indeed they were but the actual murderer was only 11 at the time.

[The Baron]

Back to the alternative scenario:

Lechmere/Cross Theory, Batch 2.0, Servicepack 1.0


A guilty Lechmere, let's call him Guiltmere, killed Nichols and headed west, he noticed a constable/person walking out of Court Street and moving west (the red dots)


Guiltmere hesitated, got confused, turned back, walked, and threw the knife somewhere here (the yellow area)


He heared footsteps, waited, and encountered Paul.







The Baron

[Newbie]

They searched the entirety of the greater Eastern railroad yard looking for evidence .... strange, since PC 81 was supposedly stationed there.

Pretty certain they searched. If not, the owner's representative would have chirped up if he found a bloody knife in the straw.

[The Baron]

"The gateway was closed. It was about nine or ten feet high, and led to some stables"


Did the Police search behind the gateway and the stables?


The Baron

[The Baron]

What I would like to know is this:

Is there any drain or a place that a guilty Lechmere might be able to throw the knife to, from Buck's Row to Court street ?


Can you forget for a moment that the Lechmere/Cross theory is rubbish, and try to think with me?



The Baron

[Paddy Goose]

I don't want you to believe me...

Good.

[The Baron]

That's easy to prove. Charles Cross was just leaving home then. He wasn't in Buck's Row.

It's your word against Charles Cross and I believe him, not you. He was there, you weren't.

I don't want you to believe me, believe Cross, you wont regret it.

This is the fundamental error again, trying to prove someone innocent by using his own words for it.

And if you bothered to read carefully she said around 3:30


The Baron

[Paddy Goose]

That's easy to prove. Charles Cross was just leaving home then. He wasn't in Buck's Row.

It's your word against Charles Cross and I believe him, not you. He was there, you weren't.

[The Baron]

Mrs Lilley heard two people in Bucks Row around 3:30am

That was Lechmere and Nichols, prove it is not.



The Baron

[The Baron]

Emma Green:
heard no unusual sound during the night

Walter Purkess
had heard no sound, neither had his wife

Henry Tomkins
Nobody passed except the policeman

John Neil
There was not a soul about

Alfred Malshaw
had also heard no cries or noise

Robert Baul
Before he reached Buck's-row he had seen no one running away

John Thail
nothing attracted his attention until 3.45 a.m


The Baron

[Fiver]

All the more reason why we should analyse the situation and the persons involved further.

I remember Neil saying there was not a soul about, Mizen, Thail, Neil, no one saw anybody around that night, Nichols was not seen with anyone either, in Whitechapel street Neil just saw women going back home, it was a very narrow space for the Killer, and yet we have a person who was seen standing near the victim alone in the dark.

This is incorrect. PC Thain saw a couple men "down Brady-Street shortly before I was called by Neale." Mulshaw was told of the murder by an unknown man. Mrs Lilley heard two people in Bucks Row around 3:30am. An unknown man passed by shortly after the body was found. Sergeant Henry Kirby, Walter Purkiss, Patrick Mulshawy, James Green, and the watchman at Essex Wharf were all nearby with no known alibi.

[The Baron]

Cross being seen discovering a body

The Baron

[Lewis C]

Because he was spotted near a recently killed woman, we don't know if he was the killer, or as you wish to think he was the finder.



The Baron

As has recently been explained, maybe in this thread, Cross being seen discovering a body makes him less suspicious than those that discovered a body without being seen doing it, because with Cross, there's independent verification for what he did. The man who saw him, Robert Paul, didn't think he was suspicious.