Kosminski and Victim DNA Match on Shawl

[MrBarnett]

This is an interesting post, Jeff. One that caused me to stop and think about "Jack" in way that I've not done previously. It occurs to me that from my earliest exposure to the murders (my early teens), I've always, on a somewhat subconsious level - felt that the killer was someone to be pitied. I suppose that upon reading the details of the murders my young impressionable mind formed an opinion: these crimes were committed by someone whose life was a hell.

Even now, the murders strike not as the work of someone evil, but of someone who was very, very sick.

Obviously, this is something quite subjective. I'm curious if others feel the same way.

Patrick,

I know what you mean. The realisation came to me when I read Tom Westcott's Bank Holiday Murders. The idea that the murders may have been committed not by a madman but by 'normal' East Enders came as a bit of a shock. It rather depressed me for a while. The idea that a tiny percentage of the population might have an illness that would drive them to commit such crimes seems far less disturbing than the idea that ostensibly normal people might go do as an exercise in power.

MrB

[Jeff Leahy]

This is an interesting post, Jeff. One that caused me to stop and think about "Jack" in way that I've not done previously. It occurs to me that from my earliest exposure to the murders (my early teens), I've always, on a somewhat subconsious level - felt that the killer was someone to be pitied. I suppose that upon reading the details of the murders my young impressionable mind formed an opinion: these crimes were committed by someone whose life was a hell.

Even now, the murders strike not as the work of someone evil, but of someone who was very, very sick.

Obviously, this is something quite subjective. I'm curious if others feel the same way.

A few years ago at one of the Jack the Ripper conferences that all us lambs seem to attend... (And I think Trevor Marriot gave a speach) Someone gave a rather good talk about the Jack the Ripper Mytholgy. And how the idea of Jack the Ripper has entered out psychi. It was the conference in Brick lane and I'm hoping someone can jog my very poor memory..It was about the myth the boogie man and the baggage we bring to the case before studying it..

But I do recall he tackled this question about our perceptions very well

Hoping someone comes to our assistance, as I believe the guy in question wrote a book and she that must be obeyed said that it was the best talk of that entire conference (Obviously I thought Jake and I were)

Yours Jeff

PS and please PM me if you are in London in October Jx

[pinkmoon]

"Couldn't have been".

So, it's absolutly impossible. That's what your saying, right?

Wait....were you there? Were you actually AT all the murder sites in 1888? I mean, for you state it as FACT that the shawl wasn't there....and COULD NOT have been there..... I mean, I know it was dark. Could you have missed it? I want to trust your keen eyesight and powers of observation, but, I'm going to need just a bit more. But, if you were there.....why not just tell us!? WHO was Jack the Ripper?

Unless you've information I've not come across, there's been no difinitive dating of the shawl that places it's manufacture after 1888. I've seen that written....then refuted. Thus, that matter seems unsettled.

Far fetched as I think this whole 'shawl' business is...... I'm impressed that you not only have the conviction to state that it "couldn't have been at any of the murder sites", but that you feel compelled to post the same sentence over and over again as if it's some sort of performance art. But then, maybe you're also mumbling it under your breath, screaming it in public places, shouting it in your sleep. If that's the case, I think you may want to talk to someone...in person, that is. Not on the forum.

As there is absolutely not one shred of EVIDENCE to even place that shawl in the same decade as the murders I think my post is quite correct.Over the years we have had to suffer the ridiculous and in some cases down right dishonest stories or theories this overtakes them all by light years.

[Lechmere]

Don't you mean Osborn Street? The City Hotel?
When you were previewing your documentary?
That interesting talk was I think as much about the mythology was contemporaneous with the actual murders.

[Jeff Leahy]

Don't you mean Osborn Street? The City Hotel?
When you were previewing your documentary?
That interesting talk was I think as much about the mythology was contemporaneous with the actual murders.

Yeah it was me and Jake looking like the dapper cool guys we are…

But it was the City Hotel either 2011 or 12

Lots of sexy lambs in attendance…

Don Rumblow also gave a memorable speech

But does anyone know the name of the guy that gave the talk on Jack the Ripper Mythology?

Cheers Lechmere

Jx

[robhouse]

Yes, I understand that is what was published back in 2010. But is not the full story as I know it....will leave it at that.
Wolfie

What full story are you talking about anyway? Just to clarify... Yes many books have published that Woolf Abraham's was Aaron's brother-in-law. That does not make it correct. Have you done some Polish genaeology that I am unaware of?

RH

[Chris]

Yes many books have published that Woolf Abraham's was Aaron's brother-in-law.

It's also unfortunate that the current A-Z still has this error in it. And also omits part of the information Jacob Cohen gave to Dr Houchin, including the reference to self-abuse!

[lynn cates]

claims

Hello Theagenes. Thanks.

Perhaps not you, but MANY got agitated and thought science had solved the case. It hadn't.

And now we see that the claims about DNA were WILDLY exaggerated.

Cheers.
LC

[Chris]

Perhaps not you, but MANY got agitated and thought science had solved the case.

I don't think anyone here thought that.

[lynn cates]

bottom line

Hello Cris.

"Something presumed by its author as evidence has been presented, nothing more."

Right. Bottom line.

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

Hear ye.

Hello Jason. Good. Keep beating the drum. Perhaps even the deaf will hear.

Cheers.
LC

[Lechmere]

I don't recall reading anyone getting excited, on either forum, that science had solved the case.
Perhaps I may have missed the odd stray remark though.

We don't now see that the DNA claims have been WILDLY exaggerated.
We have seen questions raised, which may or may not be satisfactorily answered - one way or the other.

The wild and exaggerated claims unfortunately can largely be characterised as personal abuse.

[lynn cates]

public

Hello Chris. Thanks.

Well, HERE people knew--or many did--that the shawl was not genuine.

But the dear public?

Cheers.
LC

[Chris]

Well, HERE people knew--or many did--that the shawl was not genuine.

A Mathematician, a Physicist, and an astronomer were travelling north by train. They had just crossed the border into Scotland, when the Astronomer looked out of the window and saw a single black sheep in the middle of a field. "All Scottish sheep are black," he remarked. "No, my friend," replied the Physicist, "Some Scottish sheep are black." At which point the Mathematician looked up from his paper and glanced out the window. After a few second's thought he said blandly: "In Scotland, there exists at least one field, in which there exists at least one sheep, at least one side of which is black."

http://www.mathmos.net/misc/jokes.html

[wolfie1]

What full story are you talking about anyway? Just to clarify... Yes many books have published that Woolf Abraham's was Aaron's brother-in-law. That does not make it correct. Have you done some Polish genaeology that I am unaware of?

RH

Sent PM re details.