JTR as a disorganized schizophrenic lust murderer

[Pontius2000]

Most people agree that Kosminki was schizophrenic. and most people agree that the JTR killings were lust murders. probably by a disorganized killer.

So, a lot of you know more about specific serial killers than me and could answer this question.

Could a disorganized schizophrenic lust murderer control himself to the point of targeting a specific group of victims (prostitutes)? Wouldn't he be just as likely to attack a random person on the street in broad daylight?

I have only read a few specific cases of this type killer, but one (I believe he was killing to prevent an earthquake from hitting California) committed a few JTR style crimes and was then caught because he pulled over in front of someone's house and shot a man in the man's yard in front of multiple witnesses, and then calmly got in his car and drove off. I believe this same killer also picked up a female hitchhiker and stabbed her to death while driving down the road.

[lynn cates]

disorganised

Hello Pontius. I think you make a good point. If the killer were disorganised, he likely would not have lasted through 5 murders. In fact, I think he would have been apprehended, by, say, September 12.

Cheers.
LC

[Abby Normal]

Most people agree that Kosminki was schizophrenic. and most people agree that the JTR killings were lust murders. probably by a disorganized killer.

So, a lot of you know more about specific serial killers than me and could answer this question.

Could a disorganized schizophrenic lust murderer control himself to the point of targeting a specific group of victims (prostitutes)? Wouldn't he be just as likely to attack a random person on the street in broad daylight?

I have only read a few specific cases of this type killer, but one (I believe he was killing to prevent an earthquake from hitting California) committed a few JTR style crimes and was then caught because he pulled over in front of someone's house and shot a man in the man's yard in front of multiple witnesses, and then calmly got in his car and drove off. I believe this same killer also picked up a female hitchhiker and stabbed her to death while driving down the road.

Hi Pontius
Lust murderer/sexual serial killer yes- but I dont think JtR was disorganized or scizophrenic. I dont think a disorganized scizophrenic killer could have pulled off what he did and never get caught-especially the double event.

Also, I find it hard to beleive a disorganized schizophrenic could have conveyed enough "normalcy" to convince prostitutes at the height of the ripper scare to bring him to secluded locations for sex.

IMHO he seems to have been a rather crafty, WC street smart serial killer sociopath that took alot of calculating risks and of course had some luck, but was in the end cunning and perceptive enough to stay one step ahead of the police and knew when to escape in the nick of time when he heard someone approaching.

[Observer]

IMHO he seems to have been a rather crafty, WC street smart serial killer sociopath that took alot of calculating risks and of course had some luck, but was in the end cunning and perceptive enough to stay one step ahead of the police and knew when to escape in the nick of time when he heard someone approaching.

I'd agree Abby. He certainly wasn't disorganised in his attacks. Consequently he was not apprehended at any time, certainly not before the 12th of September.

Observer

[Wickerman]

Most people agree that Kosminki was schizophrenic. and most people agree that the JTR killings were lust murders....

But, I don't think that 'most people' see Kosminski as the Ripper.

Regards, Jon S.

[Tom_Wescott]

JTR was definitely not 'disorganized'. That's John Douglas voodoo talk. Not sure about the lust murderer thing, either.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Pontius2000]

But, I don't think that 'most people' see Kosminski as the Ripper.

Regards, Jon S.

Nor did I say that most people agree that Kosminski was JTR.

[Pontius2000]

I don't agree that the WM were not disorganized. at best, mixed. There's nothing really about them that says to me that they were organized.

[Tom_Wescott]

He killed a bunch of women on the street in a very gruesome way and got away with it. He planned, was prepared, knew what he was doing, and no one caught him in the act. That's a little bit of luck and a whole lot of preparation.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Pontius2000]

He killed a bunch of women on the street in a very gruesome way and got away with it. He planned, was prepared, knew what he was doing, and no one caught him in the act. That's a little bit of luck and a whole lot of preparation.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

I'd say more like A LOT of luck with the main preparation being that he had a weapon on him for when the opportunity may present itself.

[Tom_Wescott]

So you think the Ripper simply went out with a knife and butchered the first woman who took him behind a corner...and did this repeatedly without ever being spotted in the act, or questioned into confessing...and did so repeatedly? You'll fit in with a great number of the minimalists on these boards, Mr. Pilate. They share your faith in luck and coincidence.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Barnaby]

Just because someone is diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia doesn't mean that they will end up naked eating garbage out of a gutter. Plenty of schizophrenics out there who are obsessive, ritualistic, and perfectionist.

[niko]

A terrible incident.

Hi everyone, forgive me for goinig off thread, but I think this could be of interest. On Monday a thirty one year old Irainian immigrant came out of the metro (tube) station in Bilbao and started insulting the passersby. He stopped a couple and started insulting the woman, he then slapped her in the face very hard, when the husband tried to defend his wife and told the man he would call the police, the Irainian pulled out a seventeen cm long bladed kitchen knife from his jacket, on seeing this the man ran away down the street but the knife man was faster and caught him, and started stabbing him. The woman attacked the knife man whilst he was stabbing her husband on the floor, the knife man then started to stab her.

The knifeman then continued down the street lashing his knife at the passersby. He tried to enter a small super market but the shopkeeper fought him off with the iron rod he uses to lower the shop-shutter's. The knifeman then entered a bar and attacked the customer's, (in all this the Iranian man was shouting "you killed my family, I will kill you all") one of the pub customer who was having breakfast at the time he was a sixty-six year old retired school teacher was stabed who died from fatel stab wound's to the stomach.

Two of the pub customer's attacked the knifeman with floor-tile's they found on the street and were able to retain the knifeman untill the police arrived. The result's of the attack was one dead and six injured, in the attack it is rumored that apparently he asisted up to two hundred stab wound's.

The attacker was taken to hospital the psychiatric section and then taken into police custody. There are rumor's that the attacker was schizophrenic, he lived with his brother in another part of Bilbao, the neighbour's say that they were both educated people and seemed polite.

I write this above in answer to the question on post No.1. by Pontius2000, "wouldn't he be just as likely to attack a random person on the street in broad daylight ?"

If Jack was schizophrenic, I think he was very well disciplined, if that's the word, very clever or just lucky.

I might be wrong, but I think we cannot put all the schizophrenic's in the same boat. All the best, Agur.

niko

[niko]

A terrible incident.

Hi everyone, forgive me for goinig off thread, but I think this could be of interest. On Monday a thirty one year old Irainian immigrant came out of the metro (tube) station in Bilbao and started insulting the passersby. He stopped a couple and started insulting the woman, he then slapped her in the face very hard, when the husband tried to defend his wife and told the man he would call the police, the Irainian pulled out a seventeen cm long bladed kitchen knife from his jacket, on seeing this the man ran away down the street but the knife man was faster and caught him, and started stabbing him. The woman attacked the knife man whilst he was stabbing her husband on the floor, the knife man then started to stab her.

The knifeman then continued down the street lashing his knife at the passersby. He tried to enter a small super market but the shopkeeper fought him off with the iron rod he uses to lower the shop-shutter's. The knifeman then entered a bar and attacked the customer's, (in all this the Iranian man was shouting "you killed my family, I will kill you all") one of the pub customer who was having breakfast at the time he was a sixty-six year old retired school teacher was stabed who died from fatel stab wound's to the stomach.

Two of the pub customer's attacked the knifeman with floor-tile's they found on the street and were able to retain the knifeman untill the police arrived. The result's of the attack was one dead and six injured, in the attack it is rumored that apparently he asisted up to two hundred stab wound's.

The attacker was taken to hospital the psychiatric section and then taken into police custody. There are rumor's that the attacker was schizophrenic, he lived with his brother in another part of Bilbao, the neighbour's say that they were both educated people and seemed polite.

I write this above in answer to the question on post No.1. by Pontius2000, "wouldn't he be just as likely to attack a random person on the street in broad daylight ?"

If Jack was schizophrenic, I think he was very well disciplined, if that's the word, very clever or just lucky.

I might be wrong, but I think we cannot put all the schizophrenic's in the same boat. All the best, Agur.

niko

[Malcolm X]

why do you think the killer was disorganised and a crazed Schitzo ? because he's definitely not somebody like Kosminski, he's more like W.Bury/ G. Chapman, i.e Evil but not insane.

Kosminski is exactly like a ``care in the community nutter`` he's as harmless as a baby, he's the type that you see wondering into A&E on a saturday afternoon, he's halucinating because he's forgotten to take his drugs and right now he's talking to the Nazareen.... he is not a violent Schizo, his madness is different, it's much more hands on and totally unpredictable, this is also due to not taking his drugs either, in my opinion this type is not safe to be in the community and should be locked up all the time, just like 100 years ago.

this type would never be able to chat up MJK or even Eddowes/Stride, they'd see straight though him.... they'd tell him to move along! thus Kosminski is way too off the scale to be JTR and a violent Schizo would make far more of a mess of the body/ make more noise and be seen far more often/ covered in blood etc.

JTR controlls everything he does very carefully, he is totally observent of eveything that's going on around him, yes he lost his temper with regards to Stride, but yet again this proves how human he was.

He is also not sadistic, barbaric or hateful, like Bundy or Sutcliffe, he tries not to cause too much pain to his victims and this is quite rare.

i.e you dont see him kicking/ stamping on his victims, or smashing their heads in with a baseball bat/ claw hammer in order to kill them..... thank God, because this is flipping miles worst..... JTR is seen to be hideous because of these mutilations, but these are all post mortem and no worst than an Autopsy.

but JTR toys with his knife, so this is disturbing indeed, but it's more like a moronic imbecilic trance, most odd.

i was attacked by a Schizo too, at Southampton train station, he saw me as Satan and went flipping ballistic, it's moments like this that you wish that you had a .44 magnum, this guy was taken away by the police, he is nothing like JTR; who is as mentally stable as you and i, just seriously screwed up instead.