Kelly's Home Office files

[judyj]

James Kelly

Hi all
I haven't posted for some time, but I am going to spend more time on the greatest JTR site there is.
There have been many new suspects, with a lot of great imput, however my fav. suspect is still Kelly. I realize that it has not been proven that he was in London at the time but nor has it been proven that he wasn't. It seems that his family were upper middle class or hi class. He was left a good amt. of money from his father's estate. He could have paid for his lodging and or paid someone to hide him for a while untill he was able to get away. London is a big place and I am sure than a person could blend into the crowd. His age , looks, height fits the bill. His actions toward his wife speaks volumes. And unless I read wrong he did have STD and hated prostitutes. He travelled to America for one and it's possible other countries. And the murders started and stopped during the time that he was missing. What do you think?

julie

[prince]

My understanding is that James Tulley was eventually given access to the Home Office file despite it being closed until 2030...."Finally came the magical moment when file number H.O. 144/10064 was placed in my eager hands. It contained ....." (page xiii of his book). Instructions had been given that no photocopies of pages could be made.

I will go back and read the relevant parts of the book again but it seems that the late James Tulley put more importance on the 17 documents that were removed rather than what he did see in the file. As pointed out above, it is quite normal to remove unimportant pages from official files rather than that being to cover up anything.

James Kelly could remain on the possibilities list until more evidence of where he was or wasn't on the important dates either supports or excludes him completely.

Until that happens, I go with the theory that JtR is someone we haven't even heard about as yet (I think that is Donald Rumbelow's theory).

[Roy Corduroy]

I think you mean Straffen.

Thanks for the correction, Bob.

JT Straffen, convicted murdered who escaped Broadmoor in 1952 and murdered again.

Also you seem to be hung up on the idea that in 1952 only the Kelly file was weeded. They, in all probability were, it's something that is done on a continual basis, one week we will weed this filing cabinet, next week that one and so on.

Not a hang up, just something I noticed.

Roy

[Celesta]

Kelly died in late 1929, so by the time they got round to actually closing his file it would be 1930- 100 years from then is 2030. No mystery just systems.

"Just systems." Funny how that happens sometimes, isn't it? Just plain old, everyday systems at work.

Best wishes, Bob.

[The Good Michael]

Is it possible to get a copy of Kelly's confession or story that he gave to Broadmoor when he returned. The TV program wasn't so great, in my opinion, but Tully revealed a little more information in his book. I think it would be beneficial to read the entire thing. If anyone knows about it and I could pay to have it published here, I would be glad to do it. Is it at Broadmoor, or at Reading, or at Kew?


Cheers,

Mike

[ChainzCooper]

I wonder what the differences in the two files are. Or if even the sealed file will hold anything pertinent at all. I've always been interested with Kelly as a suspect in The Ripper case along with Maybrick
Jordan

[jason_c]

Kelly died in late 1929, so by the time they got round to actually closing his file it would be 1930- 100 years from then is 2030. No mystery just systems.

No need to worry. Trevor Marriot is on the case.

[Bob Hinton]

Closed in 1930

Kelly died in late 1929, so by the time they got round to actually closing his file it would be 1930- 100 years from then is 2030. No mystery just systems.

[Bob Hinton]

Files

Thank you Bob, for your insight.

In 1952, the Kelly file was culled of the seventeen items and marked closed till 2030. (Tully)

Following the Criminal Justice Act 1948 Broadmoor changed from an institution to a hospital and in 1950 responsibility for Broadmoor was transferred from the Home Office to the Ministry of Health. In 1952 security was stepped up after a patient, J.T Straffe, escaped and killed a young girl while he was at large. Now there is a siren at the hospital - if it sounds, local schools and institutions have to lock their doors. (Bracknell Forest Heritage website, Berkshire Family Historian Website, BBC News Online)

Since there had been a change of governance, and Broadmoor was no longer a Home Institution, perhaps a file review was in order. But I find the timing, after the highly publicized Straffe escape in April of that year, then the culling and closing in October of that year, of the Kelly file, he a former Home Office charge who had also escaped (in 1888) to be, well, striking. Could this be the hot potato, twice baked?

Roy

I think you mean Straffen. The file would be kept sealed for 100 years after it was closed, which means it was closed in 1930. Why it was closed then I've no idea. when did Kelly die?

Also you seem to be hung up on the idea that in 1952 only the Kelly file was weeded. They, in all probability were, it's something that is done on a continual basis, one week we will weed this filing cabinet, next week that one and so on.

[Roy Corduroy]

1952

Thank you Bob, for your insight.

In 1952, the Kelly file was culled of the seventeen items and marked closed till 2030. (Tully)

Following the Criminal Justice Act 1948 Broadmoor changed from an institution to a hospital and in 1950 responsibility for Broadmoor was transferred from the Home Office to the Ministry of Health. In 1952 security was stepped up after a patient, J.T Straffe, escaped and killed a young girl while he was at large. Now there is a siren at the hospital - if it sounds, local schools and institutions have to lock their doors. (Bracknell Forest Heritage website, Berkshire Family Historian Website, BBC News Online)

Since there had been a change of governance, and Broadmoor was no longer a Home Institution, perhaps a file review was in order. But I find the timing, after the highly publicized Straffe escape in April of that year, then the culling and closing in October of that year, of the Kelly file, he a former Home Office charge who had also escaped (in 1888) to be, well, striking. Could this be the hot potato, twice baked?

Roy

[Bob Hinton]

Files

In the thread on the Jack The Ripper In America documentary, Roy Courderoy said the following:





This is the first I've heard of such a file, presumably because I've not had the benefit of reading Prisoner 1167. I suppose the answer is given there, but I'll not likely have access to the book before the end of the year and so I'd like to ask: why were Kelly's records sealed for so long? And is there any idea what those seventeen redacted items were?

Don't get too excited. Files on people in mental asylums are normally sealed for 100 years. When I was working on the Sweetman case the only reason I had access to his file was it was closed in 1909.

Also don't get too caught up in files with pages removed. This is known as weeding and the stuff normally removed are papers of no relevance, such as thank you notes that sort of thing. However there is usually a note of such papers on the note sheets.

[Defective Detective]

In the thread on the Jack The Ripper In America documentary, Roy Courderoy said the following:

There are two files. One is the Broadmoor file, now held at the Archive in Reading. This is the file the detective was shown looking at on TV.

The other file is closed until 2030. It is held at the Home Office Archives. That file has had 17 items removed. That's all we know about it.

This is the first I've heard of such a file, presumably because I've not had the benefit of reading Prisoner 1167. I suppose the answer is given there, but I'll not likely have access to the book before the end of the year and so I'd like to ask: why were Kelly's records sealed for so long? And is there any idea what those seventeen redacted items were?