The local guy hypothesis without evidence

[John G]

Hi,

Ripperologists sometimes seem to favour the "local guy" hypothesis even if they have no evidence connecting a person to the murders.

Perhaps they assume that most victims are murdered by someone they know. So it has to be someone living in the area.

My research has led me to a theory that opposes such a view. The person I have found did not live in Whitechapel. And still I have data connecting him to the murders.

Why would this person want to walk around in Whitechapel?

And why would all the local guys do the same?

This question of course says nothing about motives (although I know his motives).

But does it perhaps say anything about probability?

Another interesting question is:

If the local guy is the dismemberment murderer, what did he do in Battersea and Chelsea?

Regards Pierre

Hello Pierre,

I think he must have had local knowledge, considering Whitechapel was a complete labyrinth. Moreover, the fact that the murders occurred within a remarkably small area is also strongly indicative of a marauder, therefore local.

JtR wasn't the Torso killer, as the MO/signatures are drastically different. Moreover, there's no proof that most of the Torso victims were even murdered.

[richardnunweek]

Hi,
As this thread has raised serious points.
i would say that the killer of these women , resided in the Dorset street area, and worked in the area, most likely at a local market, he was middle aged, short , and stout, and at least one of the victims was premeditated,that being MJK.
Regards Richard.

[John Wheat]

Hello Pierre,

I think he must have had local knowledge, considering Whitechapel was a complete labyrinth. Moreover, the fact that the murders occurred within a remarkably small area is also strongly indicative of a marauder, therefore local.

JtR wasn't the Torso killer, as the MO/signatures are drastically different. Moreover, there's no proof that most of the Torso victims were even murdered.

Hi John

If most of the Torso victims were not murdered how did they die? And how were there Torso's then dismembered?

Cheers John

[packers stem]

Hi,
As this thread has raised serious points.
i would say that the killer of these women , resided in the Dorset street area, and worked in the area, most likely at a local market, he was middle aged, short , and stout, and at least one of the victims was premeditated,that being MJK.
Regards Richard.

Joe Barnett then Richard?

[John G]

Hi John

If most of the Torso victims were not murdered how did they die? And how were there Torso's then dismembered?

Cheers John

Hello John,

It has been argued, by Trevor Marriott, for example, that some of the torso victims may have been subject to botched abortions. However, it isn't a theory I subscribe to; it doesn't explain the risks taken in disposing of the bodies, some of the victims had never been pregnant, and the medical professionals detected no signs of botched abortions.

[richardnunweek]

Hi,
Joe Barnett..once upon a time,he was ''Number one suspect''.I started that thread some 14 years ago.
But if I had to hazard a guess, into the killer of Kelly, it would be Joe, but not likely the ones we know about?
Regards Richard.

[Pierre]

He didn´t flee into Whitechapel

Eddowes's killer fled into Whitechapel. This is the biggest piece of evidence in favor of a local killer.

That, and Occam's razor.

Hi,

No, he didn´t flee into Whitechapel. He walked from Mitre Square 10 minutes to a hiding place outside of Whitechapel, left what he took from Eddowes there, washed up, took the piece of apron and a chalk with him, went back and left the two pieces of evidence, then went back to the hiding place.

This night was extremely well planned. As was Miller´s Court.

Occam´s razor sometimes cuts away important things.

Regards Pierre

[barnflatwyngarde]

Hi,

No, he didn´t flee into Whitechapel. He walked from Mitre Square 10 minutes to a hiding place outside of Whitechapel, left what he took from Eddowes there, washed up, took the piece of apron and a chalk with him, went back and left the two pieces of evidence, then went back to the hiding place.

This night was extremely well planned. As was Miller´s Court.

Occam´s razor sometimes cuts away important things.

Regards Pierre

Aah!

It was caught on CCTV.

It's all clear now.

[John G]

Hi,
As this thread has raised serious points.
i would say that the killer of these women , resided in the Dorset street area, and worked in the area, most likely at a local market, he was middle aged, short , and stout, and at least one of the victims was premeditated,that being MJK.
Regards Richard.

Hi Richard,

What do you think of Francis Thompson as a suspect? Richard seems to have established a probable connection with Dorset Street, he'd been living rough in the local area for some time, had a reputation for starting fires, like many serial killers and, of course, he trained as a surgeon!

[John Wheat]

Hello John,

It has been argued, by Trevor Marriott, for example, that some of the torso victims may have been subject to botched abortions. However, it isn't a theory I subscribe to; it doesn't explain the risks taken in disposing of the bodies, some of the victims had never been pregnant, and the medical professionals detected no signs of botched abortions.

Hi John

Yes I'm well aware of Trevor Marriot's ahem theory on the Torso victims. It is also a theory I don't subscribe to as it has a number of flaws as you've outlined.

Cheers John

[richardnunweek]

Hi John...
Entirely plausible suspect, has a lot going for him, pity his name was not Joe Thompson..?
Regards Richard.

[Wickerman]

Mrs. Long described her suspect as "shabby genteel", incidentally, which does not mean "respectably-dressed" and certainly not "middle class". The ruffian who visited Mrs. Fiddymont's pub was also described that way, and "respectable" his appearance certainly wasn't.

You might want to read up on what "Genteel" means with regard to attire.

"refined, or respectable, often in an affected or ostentatious way."

Any man, attired in respectable clothing is "Genteel".
That same clothing, when creased, dusty, well worn at the knees and elbows, if slightly stained, is described as "Shabby".
The man seen by Mrs Long also wore a deerstalker, as opposed to the common flat or peaked cap, wideawake, or similar.

Her description of "Shabby-genteel" was in response to being asked if he looked like a dock laborer or working man, her response indicates she thought him slightly above that station.
This suspect appeared a cut above the common working man, though he may have seen better days.

Sorry Ben, no top hat, cape or black bag....
Respectable is not exclusive to, "Toff".

[DJA]

Hi,
he was middle aged, short , and stout, and at least one of the victims was premeditated,that being MJK.

+1

Rhetorical question.....what was the distance between Nichols and Chapman's murders?

Perhaps he was walking home.

[Robert St Devil]

WICKERMAN. I have my doubts that she was clever enough to contrive the term "shabby genteel" for the purposes of her description. As in:

MRS LONG: I dunno, officer... He was shabbily dressed. Kinda had a genteel manner. I guess you could say he was a... shabby-genteel lol.

She's using a ready-made description.

[Rosella]

^ as for 'middle aged', people in their early thirties were regarded as middle aged then, (and yes I know Mrs Long described a man who she thought was over forty, and foreign ie Jewish) just an example of how life expectancy has changed.