Macnaghten as a suspect

[Captain Hook]

The problem, She from Nicosia, is that there was no tarpaulin.

Is it clear now? Cross saw a shadowy mass - THOUGHT it was a tarpaulin, and thought it was a valuable thing to pick up and take home. When he came closer, lo and behold, he saw it was no tarpaulin. IT WAS A DEAD WOMAN!

Pas de bâche! Une machabbée, c'est tout! IL S'ETAIT TROMPÉ!

T'as compris maintenant?

À plus
Crochet

[STRONG]

Explanation...

Wow, even after having it pointed out to you, and with you going so far as to quote the English passage back to me proving that I was right, you still think it said something completely different than what it did.

One more time: there was no tarp. Cross mistakenly thought there was a tarp, because it was dark and that was his first thought on seeing a dark shape on the ground for which he couldn't make out details. When he got there he saw that it was a woman, because he was wrong about it being a tarp, not because he lifted an imaginary tarp.

These are elements seen by Cross, the night when Nichols was murdered. Step by step, that's what he saw when he was approaching the body (In order of preference, by chronology)

1) Dark shape on the ground (ok)
2) Tarpaulin (ok)
3) Body of Polly Nichols (ok)


The tarpaulin was the 2nd thing seen by Cross ! Then after, he noticed the corps below/under.
ref : (Times 4 september 1888 page 8)
I don't understand where is the pbm.

[STRONG]

For Information !

She Strong,

I have met quite a few people from Cyprus - both sides. They all spoke excellent English but poor French. That should come as no surprise since Cyprus was ruled by Britain for a number of years. But you, She, are quite comfortable in French as not at all in English. Yet another enigma.

As I said, I have not come into this thread to fight. If that is what you want to do, I'd better get my carcasse elsewhere.

Bonne chance, She!

Crochet

IN THE NORTH OF THE CYPRUS ISLAND - NICOSIA - (HEART OF NORTH), MOST OF PEOPLE DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH !
MY MOTHER IS FRENCH, THAT'S WHY I'VE READ HERFORT'S THEORY !

[STRONG]

What do you insinuate ?

Everybody has understood that strong/herfort firmly believes that Polly has been discovered under a tarpaulin, which is enough to show how expert (20 years of research!!!) she is, and how open-minded.
But there is much more in this ridiculous book (available in all good supermarkets, between cheese and cold sausage).
Let's take the chapter about Nichols'murder:

p30: "Polly married William Nichols on 16 Jan 1864 (...). In 1881, Polly leaves her husband after an union of 24 years."
As everybody knows, 1881 minus 1864=24 (!)

p31: we know that Polly found a job in Mr and Mrs Cowdry, thanks to Lambeth Workhouse, and then wrote a letter to her father as she started working in Wandsworth.
But according to Herfort, the letter was sent from Lambeth, where Polly was happy so much! Sigh...

p32-33: herfort suggests that Polly's killer is also responsible for the fire in Shadwell.
Well, why not...since he was in London that night...

p34: no mistake here...because there is only a map!

p35: "Jack the tarpauliner!"

p36: false quotation! (Herfort states the post-mortem being from the Times, 3 sept, but that is not the text of the Times. Bravo!)

p36-37: Don't you know how Jack has suffocated Polly? With her clothes, that he has pulled up on her face!!!
"Quand elle s'est retrouvée sur le dos, le tueur a retroussé ses vêtements sur le visage pour l'étouffer."

p37, too: end of the chapter. OUF!
20 years of research!
So funny... and there is much more about Chapman!
But I think it's enough and there is no point discussing such a stupid book.
I'd just mention that its form fits the substance. It sounds like a cheap novel, or, if you prefer, like an industrious 14 years pupil's composition.

Do you insinuate that a "stupid" book would be sold in Great Shops / main stores as Fnac (many shops in Paris), Lafayette Galleries, Printemps on Bvd Haussman ? PARIS !
Do you insinuate that this "stupid" book - by accident - would be quoted / exhibited by a prestigious London Museum (Museum in Docklands) ? Have you ever noticed that a great part of suspects - quoted HERE in Casebook - are not exhibited in the Museum ?

Wonder why !

Where are the cheese end the sausages ? In you head like the rest ?

All your rubbishes are expressing bad faith. The readers refer to backnotes, notes (solid references from National Archives) and that's all ! Your remarks are worthless.

[Captain Hook]

She Strong,

I have met quite a few people from Cyprus - both sides. They all spoke excellent English but poor French. That should come as no surprise since Cyprus was ruled by Britain for a number of years. But you, She, are quite comfortable in French as not at all in English. Yet another enigma.

As I said, I have not come into this thread to fight. If that is what you want to do, I'd better get my carcasse elsewhere.

Bonne chance, She!

Crochet

[Dan Norder]

It's absolutly clear : under the tarpaulin (bâche) the body of a woman was lying ! It was the corps of Polly Nichols !

Wow, even after having it pointed out to you, and with you going so far as to quote the English passage back to me proving that I was right, you still think it said something completely different than what it did.

One more time: there was no tarp. Cross mistakenly thought there was a tarp, because it was dark and that was his first thought on seeing a dark shape on the ground for which he couldn't make out details. When he got there he saw that it was a woman, because he was wrong about it being a tarp, not because he lifted an imaginary tarp.

[STRONG]

Mme. Herfort a mal compris ce qu'elle a lu sur le meurtre de Polly Nichols. Charles Cross n'a pas vu une bâche sous laquelle se trouvait le corps de Polly. Il a vu une "masse sombre" qu'il a d'abord cru être une bâche, c'est à dire, un "tarpaulin", en anglais. En s'approchant, il a realisé que cette masse était, en fait, une femme qui gisait à même le sol.

Crochet.

Charles Cross n'a pas vu une bâche sous laquelle se trouvait le corps de Polly. Il a vu une "masse sombre" qu'il a d'abord cru être une bâche, c'est à dire, un "tarpaulin", en anglais. .

À plus,
Crochet.

Herfort ne va pas raconter tous les détails sans importance. Oui, Cross a vu une masse sombre. On te l'accorde. En quoi ça contredit l'étape suivante où il dit voir une bâche par la suite.
Crochet paye toi des lunettes ! C'est exactement ce qu'elle dit dans sa théorie; Cross voit d'abord la bâche, ensuite, il comprend que c'est une femme dessous ! Point à la ligne.

p 35 " Charles Cross (...) découvre une bâche abandonnée..." T'as vu qu'il parlait d'une femme dessous ? T'es fort ! Ensuite Cross comprend que c'est une femme (forcément, il soulève la bâche et là comprend qu'il y a un cadavre dessous)

Dis-moi t'achète souvent les livres que tu trouves minables ? C'est étrange comme comportement. Tu vois un psy pour ça ?

En tout cas, tu comprends très mal le français !

[STRONG]

Charles Cross n'a pas vu une bâche sous laquelle se trouvait le corps de Polly. Il a vu une "masse sombre" qu'il a d'abord cru être une bâche, c'est à dire, un "tarpaulin", en anglais. .

À plus,
Crochet.

Crochet paye toi des lunettes ! C'est exactement ce qu'elle dit dans sa théorie; Cross voit d'abord la bâche, ensuite, il comprend que c'est une femme dessous !

p 35 " Charles Cross (...) découvre une bâche abandonnée..." T'as vu qu'il parlait d'une femme dessous ? T'es fort ! Ensuite Cross comprend que c'est une femme (forcément, il soulève la bâche et là comprend qu'il y a un cadavre dessous)

Dis-moi t'achète souvent les livres que tu trouves minable ? C'est étrange comme comportement.

En tout cas, tu comprends très mal le français !

[STRONG]

I suppose you have no doubt that Breuil Bois Robert is the capital of Cyprus.
Is it in the Turkish part, or in the Greek one?
Why don't you read "Bitter limons" by Durrell, and forget Ripper's studies, for which you are obviously not gifted?

Come in Nicosia, you'll be treated as you deserved.
Why do I read some bullshits when i can read many interesting researches / theories.
Ripper's studies I keep it for my ass when I miss some perfumed papers...
I prefer intellectuals than idiots or amateurs, full of jalousy.

[DVV]

I'M NOT A COWARD AND A LIAR, IF YOU WANT TO COME IN CYPRUS BE THE WELCOME ! I'll be There !

I REPEAT AGAIN : WHO REALLY READ HER THEORY ? If it's not a the case, I propose that all you shut it, once and for all ! RIGHT ?

I suppose you have no doubt that Breuil Bois Robert is the capital of Cyprus.
Is it in the Turkish part, or in the Greek one?
Why don't you read "Bitter limons" by Durrell, and forget Ripper's studies, for which you are obviously not gifted?

[DVV]

Some fun more about Herfort/Strong

Everybody has understood that strong/herfort firmly believes that Polly has been discovered under a tarpaulin, which is enough to show how expert (20 years of research!!!) she is, and how open-minded.
But there is much more in this ridiculous book (available in all good supermarkets, between cheese and cold sausage).
Let's take the chapter about Nichols'murder:

p30: "Polly married William Nichols on 16 Jan 1864 (...). In 1881, Polly leaves her husband after an union of 24 years."
As everybody knows, 1881 minus 1864=24 (!)

p31: we know that Polly found a job in Mr and Mrs Cowdry, thanks to Lambeth Workhouse, and then wrote a letter to her father as she started working in Wandsworth.
But according to Herfort, the letter was sent from Lambeth, where Polly was happy so much! Sigh...

p32-33: herfort suggests that Polly's killer is also responsible for the fire in Shadwell.
Well, why not...since he was in London that night...

p34: no mistake here...because there is only a map!

p35: "Jack the tarpauliner!"

p36: false quotation! (Herfort states the post-mortem being from the Times, 3 sept, but that is not the text of the Times. Bravo!)

p36-37: Don't you know how Jack has suffocated Polly? With her clothes, that he has pulled up on her face!!!
"Quand elle s'est retrouvée sur le dos, le tueur a retroussé ses vêtements sur le visage pour l'étouffer."

p37, too: end of the chapter. OUF!
20 years of research!
So funny... and there is much more about Chapman!
But I think it's enough and there is no point discussing such a stupid book.
I'd just mention that its form fits the substance. It sounds like a cheap novel, or, if you prefer, like an industrious 14 years pupil's composition.

[Captain Hook]

Et je te dis que si tu n'as aucune argumentation valide, va-t'en et n'espère pas que je quitte ce forum sans avoir eu le dernier mot ! La théorie de Herfort si tu ne la connaîs pas, ta place est ailleurs que sur ce thread ! Pas besoin de médiateur. Seulement des arguments intelligents de personnes qui lisent ce qu'elles ont le luxe de critiquer.

She Strong,

D'abord, She Strong, est-ce que tu es homme ou femme? Ce n'est pas important et moi je ne suis pas sexiste; tout simplement je voudrais savoir comment je dois t'addresser. Plus tôt je t'ai appellé "mon vieux"; si tu es une femme, je t'appellerai d'une autre façon.

Ensuite, je ne cherche pas à te chasser de ce forum et cela m'es égal que tu le quittes ou pas.

Et pour finir, qui t'a dit que je ne connais pas la théorie de Mme. Herfort? Non pas seulement j'ai lu son livre mais je l'ai devant moi, et je vais te le prouver. Ouvre-le dans la page 133; le premier mot dans cette page c'est "déchets"; le dernier, "femme".

Une fois ma bonne fois établie, je tiens à te dire que le passage à la page 35 que tu cites dans ta réponse à Dan Norder prouve à mon entière satisfaction que Mme. Herfort a mal compris ce qu'elle a lu sur le meurtre de Polly Nichols. Charles Cross n'a pas vu une bâche sous laquelle se trouvait le corps de Polly. Il a vu une "masse sombre" qu'il a d'abord cru être une bâche, c'est à dire, un "tarpaulin", en anglais. En s'approchant, il a realisé que cette masse était, en fait, une femme qui gisait à même le sol.

Ergo, il y a là une grave erreur de fait. Il y a aussi d'autres erreurs dans le livre; ce qui m'amène a avoir des reserves sur le travail et les conclusions de Mme. Herfort.

À plus,
Crochet.

[STRONG]

Strong mon vieux, tu te trompes. Il'y a des gens ici qui parlent français et le comprennent encore mieux mais qui se sont rendu compte tout de suite que tu es en train de te moquer de tout le monde avec ton imitation d'un petit "frog" qui masssacre l'anglais. Je suis sûr que tu ne vas pas t'attarder dans ce forum parce que tu n'es pas serieux.

À plus
Capitaine Crochet

Je parle français moi un peu moi aussi. Fan de Mike Brant et de la France ! Et je te dis que si tu n'as aucune argumentation valide, va-t'en et n'espère pas que je quitte ce forum sans avoir eu le dernier mot ! La théorie de Herfort si tu ne la connaîs pas, ta place est ailleurs que sur ce thread ! Pas besoin de médiateur. Seulement des arguments intelligents de personnes qui lisent ce qu'elles ont le luxe de critiquer.

She Strong,

[STRONG]

Poor strong,
go take fresh air and piss in your own trousers.
If you are not a coward yourself why don't you come here with your genuine name, Sophie Herfort, instead of lying and saying "I'm a reader..."

I'M NOT A COWARD AND A LIAR, IF YOU WANT TO COME IN CYPRUS BE THE WELCOME ! I'll be There !

I REPEAT AGAIN : WHO REALLY READ HER THEORY ? If it's not a the case, I propose that all you shut it, once and for all ! RIGHT ?

[STRONG]

Rubbishes Again !

[QUOTE=Dan Norder;33670]There was no tarp. Sophie misread the witness testimony. Cross at first thought Nichols' body was a tarp because it was too dark to see properly, but it was really a dead body. For as much as you rant here about people not being able to read French, she can't read English well enough to get basic facts about the case straight.QUOTE]

DON'T TELL RUBBISHES AGAIN ! SHE SAID THAT GEORGE CROSS WALKED ALONG BUCK'S ROW AND SAW SOMETHING LYING IN FRONT OF THE GATEWAY LIKE A TARPAULIN. CROSS THEN SAW IT WAS A WOMAN !
Cross's Testimoy quot. : " Witness walked along Buck's row and saw something lying in front of the gateway like a tapaulin. He then saw it was a woman. A man came along and witness, having felt one of the deseased woman's hand and findind it cold, said : "I believe she's dead" !

Conclusion : she reads better than you basic facts ! You're unable to translate simple french words into you own language !

QUOTATION page 35 (from her theory) : " 3h40 à 3h45 - Charles Cross part travailler dans le quartier de Pickfords lorsqu'il découvre une bâche abandonnée dans Buck's row. Robert Paul, résident de Foster street, lui aussi charretier, part dans Corbett's Court dans Spitalfields lorsqu'il découvre une bâche dans Buck's row (...) Arrivé devant la masse sombre, Cross soulève la bâche : "Je crois qu'elle est morte"..."

It's absolutly clear : under the tarpaulin (bâche) the body of a woman was lying ! It was the corps of Polly Nichols !

Something else to add to the rubbishes list ?

YOU CAN ADMIT KNOW THAT YOU'NEVER READ HER THEORY. I'M AFRAID YOU WASTE MY TIME WITH WRONG TRANSLATIONS AND GOSSIPS !


IT'S CLEAR YOU'VE NEVER READ HER RECONSTITUTION. I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW YOU CAN TELL ALL THESE RUBBISHES.
I SUPPOSE IT'S COMING FROM YOUR HEAD ? NO HAVE OTHER EXPLANATIONS !
I have a good french teacher for you if you need one !



She Strong