The "Suspects": Current Opinion

[Lechmere]

Jon
That is the other alternative, and it was just happenstance that the next bloke along would call himself by a name he was never recorded as using and ended up disagreeing with the first policeman he met about what he had said.

Caz
Or so he said
Your are learning. Slowly.

I know that 'I think' means it is a matter of opinion - your opinion. And it was the basis upon which you had formed your opinion that I was challenging you.
No 'possible' case implies that it is impossible for there to be a case against Lechmere.
You shouldn't be judging the possibility of such a thing on my feeble efforts.
I don't judge Hutchinson against what Ben says, or Fleming against what DVV says, or Tumblety against what Mike Hawley says, or Druitt against what Jonathan H says.
I look into it myself and make my decisions - they.
I wouldn't say it was impossible for any of those to have done it although I would say there was virtually no chance of Tumblety or Druitt being guilty.

As for Lechmere, given that it is almost certain that the police did not 'check him out' properly back in 1888, given what has been put together about him subsequently - mostly in the last couple of years - I think it is obvious that if it were possible (which it clearly isn't), he should be arrested on suspicion.

By your ever-so-high standards on which to evaluate whether someone should even be arrested on suspicion I doubt of anyone would have got arrested on suspicion during the Ripper case. Yet we know that lots of people were, some on terribly flimsy grounds.

[Harry D]

I'm not saying Jacob Levy was the Ripper, but he was the Ripper.

[Lechmere]

Convince Caz that there is even a case against him that should cause him to be arrested on suspicion.

[Harry D]

Convince Caz that there is even a case against him that should cause him to be arrested on suspicion.

Well, at the risk of being a broken record:

* Lived locally and would've been privy to the labyrinthine layout of the area.
* Was mentally unstable.
* Was said to be prowling the streets at all hours.
* Had the anatomical skill/knowledge for the crimes.
* Fits several witness descriptions.
* Was related to Joseph Hyam Levy, an "evasive" witness, and also the possible witness who identified the Jewish suspect but refused to testify against him.

Levy is without doubt the best suspect for the crimes.

[Lechmere]

Let Caz be the arbiter for that claim.

[Jon Guy]

Well, at the risk of being a broken record:

* Lived locally and would've been privy to the labyrinthine layout of the area.
* Was mentally unstable.
* Was said to be prowling the streets at all hours.
* Had the anatomical skill/knowledge for the crimes.
* Fits several witness descriptions.
* Was related to Joseph Hyam Levy, an "evasive" witness, and also the possible witness who identified the Jewish suspect but refused to testify against him.

Levy is without doubt the best suspect for the crimes.

He`s too "obvious" to be the Ripper, Harry.
We should be looking for someone "normal". Someone who appears to function well in society, no signs of being mentally unstable, having a stable marriage and work record.... wait a minute ...

[pinkmoon]

Well, at the risk of being a broken record:

* Lived locally and would've been privy to the labyrinthine layout of the area.
* Was mentally unstable.
* Was said to be prowling the streets at all hours.
* Had the anatomical skill/knowledge for the crimes.
* Fits several witness descriptions.
* Was related to Joseph Hyam Levy, an "evasive" witness, and also the possible witness who identified the Jewish suspect but refused to testify against him.

Levy is without doubt the best suspect for the crimes.

Hi,this levy character seems to tick all the boxes shame we have no evidence then again lack of evidence has never stopped anyone proposing a suspect before has it. I have always believed that our killer was heading for home when he came across eddowes and found her to good a chance to turn down.one last point wouldn't a mad butcher who lived near the area of the murders set someone at the asylum thinking and maybe contact the police.

[caz]

No 'possible' case implies that it is impossible for there to be a case against Lechmere.

Hi Ed,

It doesn't matter what you think it implies, because I have already told you - several times now - what I was implying and what I wasn't. The fact that I don't think a case can possibly be made against Lechmere does not mean he cannot still have been guilty. It just means I can't imagine any evidence exists, that has yet to come to light, that could ever be enough to build a case against him. Someone was guilty of those murders, whether a case can ever be made against him or not. These are two completely different concepts.

I don't judge Hutchinson against what Ben says, or Fleming against what DVV says, or Tumblety against what Mike Hawley says, or Druitt against what Jonathan H says.

Good for you. And I don't judge Lechmere against what you say, nor have I ever said or implied that it would be 'impossible' for any of the above to have killed one or more of the victims. They were alive at the right time and have no solid alibi for each and every murder. Not saying much though, is it?

As for Lechmere, given that it is almost certain that the police did not 'check him out' properly back in 1888, given what has been put together about him subsequently - mostly in the last couple of years - I think it is obvious that if it were possible (which it clearly isn't), he should be arrested on suspicion.

But 'he should be' is about as different from 'he would be' as chalk from cheese. Any suspect theorist thinks it's obvious his/her man 'should be' at the top of the list, but whether he 'would be' arrested today if that were possible is another matter entirely.

Love,

Caz
X

[Lechmere]

Caz
I pointed put some posts back that this whole rigmarole only got going due to your carelessness in saying 'no possible case'.
That means I accepted your subsequent explanation, even though you were shy of admitting your sloppiness.

The policy don't have a great track record for arresting suspects in cases such as this - at least not at any early stage. They usually get their man when it becomes blatantly obvious or through some piece of luck.
So I suspect that although Lechmere should be arrested (if what we know now was known then) he probably wouldn't be.

[Harry D]

one last point wouldn't a mad butcher who lived near the area of the murders set someone at the asylum thinking and maybe contact the police.

Maybe it did? Maybe it didn't? Doesn't change the fact that Levy was mentally ill. Doesn't necessarily follow that he was some drooling lunatic roaming the streets at that stage.

Another point is that Levy was sent to the asylum around the time the murders canonically ended. Robert Anderson's wife stated the Ripper had been sent to an asylum "near Stone", and Jacob Levy spent the last year of his life at Stone Asylum.

I'm sure people will go through a lot of the evidence for Levy and remark that "it could apply to a lot of people", and perhaps it could, but those people aren't suspects. From the list of names available to us thus far, Levy stands above the rest, imo.

[pinkmoon]

Maybe it did? Maybe it didn't? Doesn't change the fact that Levy was mentally ill. Doesn't necessarily follow that he was some drooling lunatic roaming the streets at that stage.

Another point is that Levy was sent to the asylum around the time the murders canonically ended. Robert Anderson's wife stated the Ripper had been sent to an asylum "near Stone", and Jacob Levy spent the last year of his life at Stone Asylum.

I'm sure people will go through a lot of the evidence for Levy and remark that "it could apply to a lot of people", and perhaps it could, but those people aren't suspects. From the list of names available to us thus far, Levy stands above the rest, imo.

Hi Harry,sir Melville found no need to mention him in his famous memo I'm quite sure he would have if there was anything on him also if my memory serves me right wasn't a reward of 500 quid offerd after Kelly's appalling murder I think any one who didn't want to grass on a relative or friend might be tempted by this amount which I think is about 50000 grand in today's money.

[caz]

Caz
I pointed put some posts back that this whole rigmarole only got going due to your carelessness in saying 'no possible case'.

I will repeat - I still think there is 'no possible case' that will ever be made against Lechmere.

Maybe one day you will find evidence that amounts to a case and prove my opinion wrong. I wish you luck.

I will also repeat for good measure - someone was guilty of the murders and it may well prove impossible to make a case against that person, or persons. By the same token, Lechmere could have been guilty but it wouldn't follow that a case can, or ever could, be made against him. All that exists somewhere in the record is all we will ever have to build a case with. That's why many crimes are never cleared up, nor ever could be.

Love,

Caz
X

[Lechmere]

Caz
I suspect that you set your 'case bar' too high.

[pinkmoon]

Caz
I suspect that you set your 'case bar' too high.

I think after 125 years all we can go on is what has been written down at the time of the murders or shortly after.However there is no harm in debating or proposing suspects in fact we have just found out something interesting and quite ground-breaking in the past few posts.

[lynn cates]

plural

Hello Caroline.

". . .it may well prove impossible to make a case against that person, or persons."

Well spoke, mate!

Cheers.
LC