Edward Buckley

[The Rookie Detective]

Hi,

Thank you for your kind comments about our research.

Have you read the JTR Forums article I mentioned a couple of posts previous?

We repeatedly mention we hope anyone and everyone adds to it, even if that means correcting some (or all) of it. Therefore, research-wise, the only protocol is sourcing everything you manage to come up with to a teeth. And please don't fear stepping on other people's toes. We have no vested interest in defending any suspect theory, whether it be Edward Buckley or anybody else, so everything that can be backed up by fact moves our understanding forward.

As the research is ever-evolving and out there for everyone to scrutinize, we do hope you present any additional research on one of the public forums, be it here or on the Edward Buckley research thread on JTR Forums ( https://www.jtrforums.com/forum/pers...esearch-thread ).

As I said, it is quite vital to read the article on JTR Forums, and not go off on a video alone.

Thank you again for your kind comments.

Fire away!

Thank you in advance,

Jurriaan

Thank you for your message.


I have read through your article and I find it absolutely compelling and refreshing.

It's very clear that your combined efforts with Johnathan have bore fruit and your work on Buckley is to be commended.

I have uncovered a few additional details of his life, but have realized that I may have gone on the wrong track at some stage; because some of the data I have collated differs from some of your own data.
It is most likely that I am mistaken, so I will re-look at my data and cross-reference it with yours in order to ascertain where the error has occurred regarding his antecedents.

Regards



RD

[New Ford Shunt]

Exceptional research and work by all involved with this.

I have also been looking at Edward Buckley over the past few months...


I have uncovered several additional facts that may be of interest.

However, some data I have discovered differs from those outlined in the brilliant video presented by Johnathan Tye.



For example...

I have evidence that Edward did live in Dempsey Street in 1882

I also have evidence his mother died when he was only 10 or 11 years of age.

He also had a sister who died in 1886 at just 25 years old.

There are a few other potentially huge details that could add another layer to Edward being considered a ripper suspect...


But how to proceed?


RD

Hiya RD,

Could you expand on both the mother's death and the sister please? We've been looking into it and Edward's background and we believe his parents are Daniel Buckley (Born c. 1821 in Ireland) and Mary Ann Elizabeth Barrett (born 1828 in the Stepney area). Edward appears to have had the following siblings:

Elizabeth Buckley - b 14/5/1847
Ann - b 19/10/1849
(Edward - b 13/7/1854)
Mary Anne - b 7/5/1857
John - b 10/4/1860
Thomas Patrick - b 16/3/1863
Alice - b 1867

All are listed as being born in the Stepney area.

If Edward's mother died when he was 10 or 11 then we clearly have the wrong Buckley family as Alice was born when Edward was 13. We also have this workhouse record from 1871 which appears to show the family at the Raine Street workhouse infirmary with catarrh:




(sorry for the poor quality)

What do your investigations tell you?

Ta!

[The Rookie Detective]

Another interesting aspect of Edward's behaviour in the build-up to his attacking Frances Jones near Guys Hospital; is that the entire incident was pre-meditated.

Prior to meeting her, Buckley wrote a letter to her, asking her for an "interview" on London Bridge.

It is my belief that he intended to kill her that night and the intervention of the policeman who heard her screams was the reason she escaped with her life.


Of all the "ripper" persons of interest, Buckley remains (arguably) one of the only men to have attacked and stabbed an unfortunate in the street by a railway arch AND stabbed an unfortunate in her bedroom after locking the door.

The mutilation wound inflicted on Frances Jones' face is perhaps our biggest clue to considering him as a legitimate suspect. It bears all the markings of a man testing the water so to speak and seeing what he can accomplish.

These attacks pre-date the ripper murders and if there's an argument to be made that the ripper would have warmed up his technique through previous attacks, then Buckley fits almost too well in that respect.


RD

RD

[Jonathan Tye]

Thank you kindly for your message.

I was eager to make it clear that everything I comment on comes from a place of admiration and respect for your research, and the last thing I would intend would be to show any disrespect towards someone else's brilliant work and research.

In terms of Edward's sister and mother; it relates to the possibility that you MAY have been incorrect with regard to his antecedents; ergo, some of his earlier life details differ from my own personal research.
It is likely the case that you are correct and I myself have made the mistake, and so on that basis, I want to tread very carefully; because your research findings differ from mine.

I am going to look closely again at my own data that I have collated on Buckley over the past few months, and cross-reference it with your own, and then determine where I have gone wrong.


RD

No problem at all . Do let me know your findings . Re Edwards mother we actually do not follow her life through in the research in contrast to Daniel , mary Ann John and Thomas. If you have found something we have missed and we can tidy up the back story of the family we would be delighted .

Jonathan

[jmenges]

FYI- Rippercast will be hosting a round table discussion on Edward Buckley this coming weekend. The audio will be released shortly thereafter. Stay tuned.

JM

[The Rookie Detective]

Hiya RD,

Could you expand on both the mother's death and the sister please? We've been looking into it and Edward's background and we believe his parents are Daniel Buckley (Born c. 1821 in Ireland) and Mary Ann Elizabeth Barrett (born 1828 in the Stepney area). Edward appears to have had the following siblings:

Elizabeth Buckley - b 14/5/1847
Ann - b 19/10/1849
(Edward - b 13/7/1854)
Mary Anne - b 7/5/1857
John - b 10/4/1860
Thomas Patrick - b 16/3/1863
Alice - b 1867

All are listed as being born in the Stepney area.

If Edward's mother died when he was 10 or 11 then we clearly have the wrong Buckley family as Alice was born when Edward was 13. We also have this workhouse record from 1871 which appears to show the family at the Raine Street workhouse infirmary with catarrh:




(sorry for the poor quality)

What do your investigations tell you?

Ta!

Hi there


Sorry for the delay in responding to your message.


I believe that the family you have listed is incorrect.

I have a different Edward Buckley.


I will need to re-check my data, but I have Edward born elsewhere.

I do have one of his brothers living in Morgan Street though, and so that particular piece of data matches.


One thing to bear in mind about the location of Morgan Street, which is situated just north of; and runs parallel to Mile End Road...the house was only a few minutes walk away from 9 Maidman Street where Ada Wilson was attacked.
In fact, if you walked from Morgan Street and crossed the Mile End road to the south side, you would have been on Maidman Street (which no longer exists and instead now forms part of Mile End Park)

Hypothetically speaking, the man who attacked Ada Wilson, could have run north, crossed Mile End Road, and then run directly into the western end of Morgan Street, all within a few minutes.


How does the description given by Ada Wilson of her attacker compare to that of Buckley?

Aged around 30
5ft 6" tall
Fair Moustache
Sunburnt face (could mean blotchy?)
Dark Coat, light trousers
Wideawake hat




RD

[The Rookie Detective]

Hiya RD,

Could you expand on both the mother's death and the sister please? We've been looking into it and Edward's background and we believe his parents are Daniel Buckley (Born c. 1821 in Ireland) and Mary Ann Elizabeth Barrett (born 1828 in the Stepney area). Edward appears to have had the following siblings:

Elizabeth Buckley - b 14/5/1847
Ann - b 19/10/1849
(Edward - b 13/7/1854)
Mary Anne - b 7/5/1857
John - b 10/4/1860
Thomas Patrick - b 16/3/1863
Alice - b 1867

All are listed as being born in the Stepney area.

If Edward's mother died when he was 10 or 11 then we clearly have the wrong Buckley family as Alice was born when Edward was 13. We also have this workhouse record from 1871 which appears to show the family at the Raine Street workhouse infirmary with catarrh:




(sorry for the poor quality)

What do your investigations tell you?

Ta!

DUPLICATE POST SORRY!


Hi there


Sorry for the delay in responding to your message.


I believe that the family you have listed is incorrect.

I have a different Edward Buckley.


I will need to re-check my data, but I have Edward born elsewhere.

I do have one of his brothers living in Morgan Street though, and so that particular piece of data matches.


One thing to bear in mind about the location of Morgan Street, which is situated just north of; and runs parallel to Mile End Road...the house was less only a few minutes walk away from 9 Maidman Street where Ada Wilson was attacked.
In fact, if you walked from Morgan Street and crossed the Mile End road to the south side, you would have been on Maidman Street (which no longer exists and instead now forms part of Mile End Park)

Hypothetically speaking, the man who attacked Ada Wilson inside her flat, could have run north, crossed Mile End Road, and then run directly into the western end of Morgan Street, all within a few minutes.


How does the description given by Ada Wilson of her attacker compare to that of Buckley?

Aged around 30
5ft 6" tall
Fair Moustache
Sunburnt face (could mean blotchy?)
Dark Coat, light trousers
Wideawake hat




RD

[The Rookie Detective]

No problem at all . Do let me know your findings . Re Edwards mother we actually do not follow her life through in the research in contrast to Daniel , mary Ann John and Thomas. If you have found something we have missed and we can tidy up the back story of the family we would be delighted .

Jonathan

Hi Johnathan

Thank you for your message


It would appear that we have a different family for Edward Buckley.

May I ask in terms of percentages; how confident are you that you have the correct family for Edward Buckley?

I ask this with utmost respect and sincerity as I just want to determine how I may have gone wrong, and so I hope you don't mind me asking.

I am more than happy to be proved wrong, so it's more a case of just clarifying the correct path; so that I can adjust my mistake accordingly.


I have my Edward Buckley as being born earlier than 1854.


RD

[The Rookie Detective]

August 1885

Edward Buckley - Assaulted a cab driver on his way back to the coffee house (where he was lodging) at 14 Hanbury Street. He jumped out en route and went into the East London Tavern until closing time.

This again confirms Edward Buckley's link between the East London Tavern and Hanbury Street in 1885.


RD




ondon tavern

[Jurriaan Maessen]

August 1885

Edward Buckley - Assaulted a cab driver on his way back to the coffee house (where he was lodging) at 14 Hanbury Street. He jumped out en route and went into the East London Tavern until closing time.

This again confirms Edward Buckley's link between the East London Tavern and Hanbury Street in 1885.


RD




ondon tavern

We very much appreciate your efforts in conducting your own research into Buckley (we hope more researchers follow that example), but if I may hand out one short piece of advice, it would be to appraise yourself of the research article made available for free:

https://www.jtrforums.com/articles/609627-introducing-edward-buckley-life-and-crimes-of-a-whitechapel-fiend-pdf-attachment-version

On page 26 for example, you'll find the Hackney cab-incident already documented and within the proper context and timeline.

Consulting the research article will save you the trouble of discovering something already documented as well as avoiding the many pitfalls as you conduct your own research.

Greetings, Jurriaan

[Jonathan Tye]

August 1885

Edward Buckley - Assaulted a cab driver on his way back to the coffee house (where he was lodging) at 14 Hanbury Street. He jumped out en route and went into the East London Tavern until closing time.

This again confirms Edward Buckley's link between the East London Tavern and Hanbury Street in 1885.


RD




ondon tavern

Hi the august 1885 attack on Herman Tage is part of a sequence of events leading to Devonshire street .This has been fully documented in the forum's article , Adam Woods crime through time article and presented at the East End Conference earlier this month. It would be great to read and listen to those as it will enable you to share new information rather than events that are all ready an established part of the story.

Jonathan

[Jonathan Tye]

Hi Johnathan

Thank you for your message


It would appear that we have a different family for Edward Buckley.

May I ask in terms of percentages; how confident are you that you have the correct family for Edward Buckley?

I ask this with utmost respect and sincerity as I just want to determine how I may have gone wrong, and so I hope you don't mind me asking.

I am more than happy to be proved wrong, so it's more a case of just clarifying the correct path; so that I can adjust my mistake accordingly.


I have my Edward Buckley as being born earlier than 1854.


RD

Hi Edward was born on July 13th ( A Thursday) 1854 . It is confirmed by his Roman Catholic baptism in Pennington street and his death certificate which we are in possession of. Records of his age vary greatly in the press and he is aged by at least ten years by many . However a criminal record - two of them confirm we have the right Edward along with his listed next of kin which show he is the Edward Buckley born to Daniel Buckley and Mary Ann Elizabeth Barret ( we also have the Marriage Cert) .The age debate is discussed fully in our work . There are a number of Edward Buckleys in the area that can cause confusion particularly one born to Ellen Buckley . Jonathan
Last edited by Jonathan Tye; Today, 07:39 AM.

[Jonathan Tye]

Hi Johnathan

Thank you for your message


It would appear that we have a different family for Edward Buckley.

May I ask in terms of percentages; how confident are you that you have the correct family for Edward Buckley?

I ask this with utmost respect and sincerity as I just want to determine how I may have gone wrong, and so I hope you don't mind me asking.

I am more than happy to be proved wrong, so it's more a case of just clarifying the correct path; so that I can adjust my mistake accordingly.


I have my Edward Buckley as being born earlier than 1854.


RD

Hi Edward was born on July 13th ( A Thursday) 1854 . It is confirmed by his Roman Catholic baptism in Pennington street and his death certificate which we are in possession of. Records of his age vary greatly in the press and he is aged by at least ten years by many . However a criminal record - two of them confirm we have the right Edward along with his listed next of kin which show he is the Edward Buckley born to Daniel Buckley and Mary Ann Elizabeth Barret ( we also have the Marriage Cert) .The age debate is discussed fully in our work . There are a number of Edward Buckleys in the area that can cause confusion particularly one born to Ellen Buckley . Jonathan

[The Rookie Detective]

We very much appreciate your efforts in conducting your own research into Buckley (we hope more researchers follow that example), but if I may hand out one short piece of advice, it would be to appraise yourself of the research article made available for free:

https://www.jtrforums.com/articles/609627-introducing-edward-buckley-life-and-crimes-of-a-whitechapel-fiend-pdf-attachment-version

On page 26 for example, you'll find the Hackney cab-incident already documented and within the proper context and timeline.

Consulting the research article will save you the trouble of discovering something already documented as well as avoiding the many pitfalls as you conduct your own research.

Greetings, Jurriaan

Thank you Jurriaan, my apologies.


Regards

RD

[The Rookie Detective]

Hi the august 1885 attack on Herman Tage is part of a sequence of events leading to Devonshire street .This has been fully documented in the forum's article , Adam Woods crime through time article and presented at the East End Conference earlier this month. It would be great to read and listen to those as it will enable you to share new information rather than events that are all ready an established part of the story.

Jonathan

Thank you for your message Johnathan, my sincerest apologies.

Regards


RD