BSM & Sailor Man : one and the same ?

[DVV]

Hummm ?

[Jonathan H]

'Knifeman' is a better match for Jack the Sailor.

[Jon Guy]

I`d go so far as to say BS Man, Sailor Man and Marshall`s Man were all the one and the same.

[DVV]

Hi Jon,
I'd go so far as to say I tend to agree....

Cheers

[DVV]

'Knifeman' is a better match for Jack the Sailor.

Hi Jonathan, you mean the Star's Pipeman, I presume ?

[Jonathan H]

It is more likely Schwartz told the truth to 'The Star' and not to the police:

In the press version, the second man carried a knife -- and broadly matches the description by Lawende -- and not a pipe.

[Abby Normal]

I`d go so far as to say BS Man, Sailor Man and Marshall`s Man were all the one and the same.

Absolutely" I would go so far as to possibly include PC smiths man also and call them all Peaked Cap man, as I have argued in the past.

[Bridewell]

It was 50/50 when I voted - so no pressure! On balance I think there is enough similarity to say that BS Man & Lawende's man could well be one and the same and that's the way I've voted. Agree also that both Marshall and Smith could be describing the same individual.

I guess if you think there was a Double Event (same killer) you see the similarities, but if you favour a different killer for Stride you notice the differences.

[Bridewell]

I think Schwartz's description of Pipeman/Knifeman suggests that he was 5 years or so older than Lawende's suspect so, for me, BS man is the more likely match.

[GregBaron]

Menacing to mild...

In the press version, the second man carried a knife -- and broadly matches the description by Lawende -- and not a pipe.

Knifeman's too tall for Sailor Man isn't he...?

On balance I think there is enough similarity to say that BS Man & Lawende's man could well be one and the same and that's the way I've voted.

As others have stated, we go from a staggering lunatic to a calm Popeye the Sailor in 45 minutes.....?


Greg

[DVV]

Knifeman's too tall for Sailor Man isn't he...?

Greg

Hi Greg

Yes, but more druittic.

[GregBaron]

Force fit...

Hi Greg

Yes, but more druittic.

Yes, and he's also more LeGrandic but that hardly fits a rough-neck sailor...

I sense the square peg into the round hole scenario...


Greg

[Stephen Thomas]

In the press version, the second man carried a knife -- and broadly matches the description by Lawende -- and not a pipe.

What nonsense is this?

Did Lawende describe a tall man?

Or even a fine featured public school toff?

[Bridewell]

As others have stated, we go from a staggering lunatic to a calm Popeye the Sailor in 45 minutes.....?

Remind me. Which witness alluded to a staggering lunatic?

[Wickerman]

I have my doubts about this Sailor man.

The first description of the Mitre Sq. suspect, 'Redneck', was published on Oct. 2nd,...

"of shabby appearance, about 30 years of age and 5ft. 9in. in height, of fair complexion, having a small fair moustache, and wearing a red neckerchief and a cap with a peak".

Yet it had not come from Lawende. The only one of the three witnesses who was talking, was Harris. Lawende had been 'hushed-up' and sequestered away from the public & press, Levy was refusing to talk.
Therefore Harris is the most likely source.

The Oct. 2nd description (above) made no mention of 'Redneck' looking like a sailor.

So where did the idea he looked like a sailor come from?


On Oct. 5th, at the Stride Inquest, William Marshall introduced 'the sailor'.
[Coroner] What sort of a cap?
[Witness] A round cap, with a small peak. It was something like what a sailor would wear.


The police release (Swanson's) of Oct. 19th is the first and only time the "Appearance of a sailor" is mentioned in connection with the Mitre Sq. suspect.

"age 30 ht. 5 ft. 7 or 8 in. comp. fair fair moustache, medium built, dress pepper & salt colour loose jacket, grey cloth cap with peak of same colour, reddish handkerchief tied in a knot, round neck, appearance of a sailor."


In 1892 another version of the Mitre Sq. suspect, Redneck, hit the press.

"A man of thirty-five, standing 5ft 7in to 5ft 8in, rather square shoulders, clean shaven with the exception of a heavy moustache, inclining to be sandy."

Still no mention of Redneck looking like a sailor.

There may be justification for questioning whether the Mitre Sq. suspect truly looked like a sailor.