The Mizen scam

[richardnunweek]

Hi,
We better stop all of this, or Fisherman might not appreciate the humour, which is not really relevant to his new suspect.
Regards Richard.

[Sally]

Ok Tabram.. a disgruntled soldier, or even Pearly poll [ a drunken rage]

And suddenly it all makes sense - no wonder she did a runner

[richardnunweek]

Hello Sally.
The Pearly Poll angle actually is more likely then Cross..
It reminds me when I was about 18 years old , another young lad and myself, went out on a drink, we were quite good mates, we both got plastered , and whilst we attempted to venture back home , he took offence at some thing I said, and proceeded to kick me senseless , whilst I was sitting on a wall, it was rather a brutal attack, and went on for some time, until he regained his composure,
After which he could not apologise enough..
If we put that into context with Tabram and Pearly, they too spent the evening together, they were drinking, and this assault was very much a overkill[ which can be female related] and something as small as a penknife could have been used, the notion that the same type of scenario as in my case took place is not that unlikely.
No wonder she did a vanishing act, and failed to identify anyone...
Regards Richard.

[Rubyretro]

I'm still going with: Kelly slipped in the shower

Mike

I might have to cling to your version, Mike.

Sometimes I feel that casebook is descending into madness.

Pure logic, supported by statistics, dictates empirically that whoever the one killer was who topped the canonicals, he also topped other murder victims in the short time frame.

That's all there is to it.

So if we can definitely pin one murder on a suspect, we need to look at the others and see if our suspect could have done those as well...

Lechmere/Cross shapes up well for me....

[Wickerman]

I might have to cling to your version, Mike.

Sometimes I feel that casebook is descending into madness.

Pure logic, supported by statistics, dictates empirically that whoever the one killer was who topped the canonicals, he also topped other murder victims in the short time frame.

That's all there is to it.

To be honest, statistically, the logic expressed has not always been that pure.

I personally do not doubt that one hand was at work in at least three of the five. Even some contest the logic used to arrive at that conclusion, as for the others, it is simply pure guesswork.

So if we can definitely pin one murder on a suspect,

Good luck with that, its a century old desire held by thousands.

Regards, Jon S.

[Sally]

Hello Sally.
The Pearly Poll angle actually is more likely then Cross..
It reminds me when I was about 18 years old , another young lad and myself, went out on a drink, we were quite good mates, we both got plastered , and whilst we attempted to venture back home , he took offence at some thing I said, and proceeded to kick me senseless , whilst I was sitting on a wall, it was rather a brutal attack, and went on for some time, until he regained his composure,
After which he could not apologise enough..
If we put that into context with Tabram and Pearly, they too spent the evening together, they were drinking, and this assault was very much a overkill[ which can be female related] and something as small as a penknife could have been used, the notion that the same type of scenario as in my case took place is not that unlikely.
No wonder she did a vanishing act, and failed to identify anyone...
Regards Richard.

Hi Richard - thanks for sharing your story, just goes to show how unpredicable the effects of alcohol can be.

I hadn't considered Pearly as a killer; but you never know. Maybe it was all that time cooped up in the infirmary that did it - sent her over the edge..

Tabram is always a conundrum in respect of whether she was a Ripper victim or not. Maybe not. I can't see Poll being responsible for the other victims though.

Anyhow, I'm sure this is off topic - though I'm sure there's a thread in this somewhere! - so back to the 'Mizen Scam'

[richardnunweek]

Hi Sally,
Purely tongue- in- cheek , I like to cover all angles..back to thread.
Richard.

[lynn cates]

yup

Hello Jon.

"To be honest, statistically, the logic expressed has not always been that pure."

Hear, hear.

Cheers.
LC

[Rubyretro]

Richard -although I have a 'delightful' (?) image of you sitting quietly like Aunt Sally being punched -and then apologising and placating your mate, surely your scenario is rather rare ?

Martha was killed (to my mind) by someone with superior strength, and, (the way that her body was displayed = clue), a man with some sort of twisted sexual motive.

I think that that if Pearly Poll had been a mad, muscled, lesbian....surely someone would have spotted it ?

Every indication is that Martha was killed by the same man who killed the canonicals.

[Lechmere]

Richard
The thing about Cross as the culprit is that he can be made to fit all the murders – not based on supposed witnesses seeing various men with the victims but based on geography and in the case of Chapman motive.
I personally would not put much store on any of the supposed eye witness accounts of different shaped men being with any of the victims. Lechmere/Cross could incidentally have been almost any of those supposed sightings... except the A man perhaps!
Richard - I am a little shocked by your bad experience - I trust it was unconnected to your radio listening habits?

Ruby
I agree with you about Tabram – she was clearly left ‘on display’ in a location where she would have taken a punter. It was a simplified Ripper style attack which is what should be expected for what was probably the first attack. The attack took place about 30 yards from Cross’s quickest route to work at roughly the time he would have been passing on his way to work.

Not only can Cross be made to fit all the murders, not only can his known movements, actions and words be made to fit him as the murderer of Nichols, but his family background and upbringing fit the profile one should perhaps expect to find in a serial killer with sociopathic and psychopathic tendencies.

[Fisherman]

Richard Nunweek:

" we should try to use any speculation we have to cover all the murders, which almost certainly was a series of killings committed by the same hand."

No matter what suspect we opt for, this holds true. And no matter who we choose, that suspect will be hard to reconcile with all the varying pictures we have of possible Rippers; the respectably clad broadsholdered man, the shabby sailor type, the fortyish foreigner ...

Choosing Lechmere as our suspect won´t change this. But it will give us a man that at the very least had the murders occur along the two thoroughfares that represented his logical route to work, just as it will give us a man that had good reason to be at the spot of the Stride killing too at a suitable time.

Apart from this, I concentrate mainly on the Nichols slaying, since I believe that this is where we can get to him, and once we do so, the other murders must be primarily regarded as his work too (Sorry, Lynn, Simon!)

The best,
Fisherman

[Fisherman]

Richard:

"We better stop all of this, or Fisherman might not appreciate the humour, which is not really relevant to his new suspect."

Are you kidding? I´m still trying to catch my breath after Mike´s giving Kelly the slip!

Fisherman

[richardnunweek]

Hi.
Believe me Rubyretro, the only reason I appeared to have just sat on a wall whilst being viciously beaten, was the result of a huge amount of barley wine, although the amount of blood would have befitted Kelly's room[ I still have the scars].
I was just giving a example when even the best of evenings can turn ugly.
accusations towards Pearly poll were simply tongue in cheek.
Regards Richard.

[richardnunweek]

Hi Lechmere,
Just a quick reply.
If that was a reference to my Hutchinson's airing , the unfortunate attack transpired many years previous Aug 65,and was the result of my companion facing another night sleeping rough , whilst I was fortunate to have a roof over my head[ sour grapes fuelled by alcohol].
Regards Richard

[lynn cates]

Por que la necesidad?

Hello Christer.

"once we do so, the other murders must be primarily regarded as his work too (Sorry, Lynn, Simon!)"

No need to be sorry, but why "MUST"?

Cheers.
LC