John McCarthy

[Normy]

Hiya all
Is there anything known about the landlord of Millers court John McCarthy? He might have been one person to have a key to MJK room.
Or, as she was renownd for allowing other prostitutes stay with her is it possible the murderer was another prostitute?

Cheers

[Limehouse]

Welcome Normy,

Quite a lot is known about John McCarthy, although others have done far more research on him than I have. It seems he came from quite a humble background but went on the become quite wealthy. How this was achieved has been the source of some debate. Some people think he was controlling prostitutes and others think he was an astute landlord who capitalised on the need for cheap lodgings. He was a supporter of local charities in his later years and was buried in the same cemetery as Mary Kelly, although in a much grander style.

As for the possibility of Mary being killed by another prostitute, personally I don't think it's likely. I believe she was killed by a male client - the same male who killed Eddowes, Nichols, Chapman and possibly Stride.

[Normy]

Hi Limehouse
Thanks for the info, seems McCarthy might be an intersting character though not neccessarily anything to do with the murders.
I suppose it's possible the other murdered women had stayed with MJK at her lodgings but not sure where that would lead.

Anyway Cheers.

[Graham]

Hi Limehouse
Thanks for the info, seems McCarthy might be an intersting character though not neccessarily anything to do with the murders.
I suppose it's possible the other murdered women had stayed with MJK at her lodgings but not sure where that would lead.

Anyway Cheers.

Hi Normy,

There was a stack of information on the old boards about McCarthy - shame it's all disappeared, unless some enterprising soul managed to salvage it. He really was an interesting character, and left something of a legacy interesting not only to JtR buffs but also to anyone interested in the East End of London. I can't even point you in the direction of a good book about the bloke, as it seems that in most books about the Ripper he is mentioned only in the context of his being Kelly's landlord and she owed him rent. It was even suggested at one time that he could be the Ripper. Maybe someone will see this and suggest other sources of information about him.

Cheers,

Graham.

[Normy]

Thanks Graham
Would be good if someone could come up with a few details, who knows where it might lead.
Anyway, let's wait and see.

Thanks again.

[Stephen Thomas]

Well, he may well have been a one-man Kray Twins but he seems to have been an erudite and witty fellow as shown here:

http://www.casebook.org/victorian_london/the-worst-street-in-london.html

[Normy]

Great, thanks that's an interesting, entertaining read!
I see here he's titled JACK McCathy!!! I wonder.

Cheers

[Normy]

Just thought of something, wasn't there a letter 'M' on a torn envelope at the scene of the second murder? Along with the number 2 written on it?
I see it's been mentioned somewhere on the boards (though I can't find it now) that this has been linked to Barnett.
Isn't it possible it's connected to McCarthy's shop number 27 Dorset st.
If Chapman had been lodging there she might have owed him money like Kelly did!

[Dan Norder]

Hi Normy,

The envelope was traced and found to have nothing to do with the killer. Chapman had picked it up at random in the lodging house so that she'd have something to store pills in.

[Normy]

Hi Dan
Ah well, so much for that idea!
Mary Kelly owed him 30 shillings didn't she?
Some of the other victims stayed in Dorset st possibly in property he rented didn't they?

Cheers

[Sam Flynn]

Some of the other victims stayed in Dorset st possibly in property he rented didn't they?

Mary was the only victim to have been living in a McCarthy owned/rented property at the time. The other victims drifted in and out of doss-houses owned/rented by Cooney, Crossingham and others.

Interestingly, I believe that John McCarthy was renting out rooms at Great Pearl Street around 1888, so there's a faint possibility that the witness Sarah Lewis might have been one of his tenants, albeit from another part of his embryonic "empire".

[Normy]

Hi Sam
Well it seems my attempt to get something on McCarthy isn't going to well.
Thanks for the input and info.
My one last ditch attempt to get anything out of this might be that MJK had at times allowed other prostitutes to stay with her in her lodgings, whether that led to anything I doubt but that's me just about out ideas!

[Sam Flynn]

McCarthy's "motive"?

Taken across from a "Rent Arrears" thread.

And by the way, in case anyone is interested, no I don't think McCarthy killed her to get her out of the bloody room so he could rent it!

Neither do I, Chava... so why would he have killed and savagely mutilated her?

If the answer is, "because he was the psychopath known as Jack the Ripper", then (ignoring the circularity of that argument) we may need to rule out Stride and Eddowes from the list of the Ripper's victims. Judging by the events surrounding Kelly's murder, both women were killed well before he stopped serving in his shop. (We also know that a chandler's shop on Thrawl Street stayed open until at least 2AM, based on independent evidence put forward in relation to the Tabram case.)

We would also have to consider removing Annie Chapman from the "canon", on the assumption that McCarthy would have had to have been scrubbed up, calmed down and ready to open his shop for business - if it wasn't already open - within perhaps tens of minutes after her death.

[Robert]

And he couldn't very well have left a sign in his shop window, "Gone ripping."

[miss marple]

Mccarthy

This site is constant repetition.For the benefit of newby Normy,
Mccarthy's family tree
John was eldest son of Daniel and Margaret McCarthy.
He was born in Dieppe in 1848
Marries Elizabeth Stephens 1877 at Sr Leonards WHITECHAPEL
1874 Son John born, later to change his name to Steve, have theatrical career, marry music hall star Marie Kendall 1895 and be the grandfather of actress Kay Kendall
1876 daughter Margaret born.
1878 daughter Elizabeth born
1886 daughter Anne born
1891 daughter Nelly born
1893 daughter Rosy born
John McCarthy also looked after his younger brother Daniel who had TB, he died in 1895. Daniel married Anne Crossingham, daughter of William Crossingham of the lodging house.
Jeremiah McCarthy, John's brother also married in same month and year as John. It was quite common for working class people to live together and half children before they married. One of my grandmother's born 1885 had her first child, before she married the father and went on to have nine others My East end Great grand father had nine children by my greatgrandmother, before they married, the last was born legit.
McCARTHY was a shrewd businessman who when he died, left quite a lot of money. He was also a strong family man with an extended family who took care of his own. There is nothing in his charactor to suggest a psycopath or disturbed man.
Miss Marple