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What makes Druitt a viable suspect?

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  • Originally posted by Wolf Vanderlinden View Post



    You seem to have missed my point. Farquharson doesn't say that his suspect drowned himself or that he was found in the Thames. All he says is that his suspect committed suicide. HOW he committed suicide, or where he was found, is never mentioned, or even hinted at:

    "His theory - and he repeats it with so much emphasis that it might almost be called his doctrine - is that 'Jack the Ripper' committed suicide on the night of his last murder....He states that a man with blood-stained clothes committed suicide on the night of the last murder..."



    As I said, Farquharson doesn't say that the murder was Kelly's, there was no "canonical 5" at the time, but according to the above quote the Ripper killed himself "on the night of the last murder." That doesn't mean the last "canonical" murder. Did Druitt kill himself on the night of the 9th of November, 1888? Obviously not, but Farquharson's theory states that part of his evidence proving the guilt of his suspect is that he committed suicide on the night of the "last murder" and did so while wearing blood stained clothes, i.e. the clothes he wore committing the murder, i.e. evidence that the suspect was indeed the Ripper. This is an essential part of Farquharson's theory. It also bares no relationship to Druitt's death.

    As I said, Druitt can be made to fit Farquharson's theory but only by ignoring what Farquharson reportedly said.

    Wolf.
    You’re correct of course Wolf that I had missed you’re initial point. I can’t respond any better than Wickerman and Roger have though. He surely has to have been talking about Druitt.
    Regards

    Herlock






    "Crime is common. Logic is rare. Therefore it is upon the logic rather than upon the crime that you should dwell.”

    Comment


    • Hi Herlock,

      Why mention Druitt? Why not?

      Macnaghten thought that nobody [aside from Anderson] was ever going to read his memorandum.

      His naming of Druitt [age and profession wrong] remained a cast-iron secret for seventy-one years, when in 1965 Tom Cullen published Autumn of Terror.

      Regards,

      Simon
      Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

      Comment


      • Hi Simon,

        I have to wonder how this memorandum could be considered a rebuttal to the Sun article concerning Cutbush? A rebuttal is useless if no one is going to read it.
        Regards

        Herlock






        "Crime is common. Logic is rare. Therefore it is upon the logic rather than upon the crime that you should dwell.”

        Comment


        • Hi Herlock,

          It was more of a knee-jerk reaction to the Cutbush story in the Sun. There was to be a general election in March, and the government was anxious to forestall any new inquiry into the Whitechapel murders.

          If an inquiry ensued, Scotland Yard would have had to demonstrate that the non-existent Jack the Ripper was not Thomas Hayne Cutbush, and in order to do that would have to further show that the non-existent Jack the Ripper was, or might have been, somebody else: somebody about whom nobody could agree. Consensus might have led to a demand for evidence, whereas uncertainty lent weight to the idea that Jack the Ripper may have conveniently died or had been incarcerated before his identity was suspected, or perhaps been too shrewd for the police, avoided arrest and was possibly still at large.

          Jack the Ripper is like a London bus. If you miss one, another will be along in just a moment.

          William Grant Grainger in this instance.

          Regards,

          Simon
          Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
            Hi Herlock,

            Why mention Druitt? Why not?

            Macnaghten thought that nobody [aside from Anderson] was ever going to read his memorandum.

            His naming of Druitt [age and profession wrong] remained a cast-iron secret for seventy-one years, when in 1965 Tom Cullen published Autumn of Terror.

            Regards,

            Simon
            Hi Simon.

            Being a little short on the facts, as we often are on this forum. I side with Paul Begg that Mac. may have confused the insane medical student/doctor (John Sanders) with Druitt.
            Also, the day the body was fished out of the Thames it was assumed to be of a man "aged about 40". This estimate must have come from the constable who took charge of the body (PC Moulson). The age was corrected at the inquest so Mac's source looks like it was Moulson's police report.
            Regards, Jon S.

            Comment


            • Hi Jon,

              The Echo, the Richmond and Twickenham Times, the Hampshire Advertiser, and the Southern Guardian all got Druitt's age right—31. The Thames Valley Times reported that the "deceased was about forty years of age."

              Macnaghten's only mention of Druitt's [wrong] age— [41] —was in the Aberconway version, written some time after 1894, so goodness knows from where he got his "private information."

              Regards,

              Simon
              Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post

                If an inquiry ensued, Scotland Yard would have had to demonstrate that the non-existent Jack the Ripper was not Thomas Hayne Cutbush, and in order to do that would have to further show that the non-existent Jack the Ripper was, or might have been, somebody else: somebody about whom nobody could agree.
                No fear of an inquiry when the suspect is dead.

                Regards, Jon S.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
                  Hi Jon,

                  The Echo, the Richmond and Twickenham Times, the Hampshire Advertiser, and the Southern Guardian all got Druitt's age right—31. The Thames Valley Times reported that the "deceased was about forty years of age."

                  Macnaghten's only mention of Druitt's [wrong] age— [41] —was in the Aberconway version, written some time after 1894, so goodness knows from where he got his "private information."

                  Regards,

                  Simon
                  Check the dates of those press reports.
                  Regards, Jon S.

                  Comment


                  • Hi Jon,

                    At your command.

                    2nd, 5th and 12th January 1889.

                    Regards,

                    Simon
                    Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                    Comment


                    • Ok so the inquest where his age was established as 31 was held on Wednesday 2nd.

                      So all press reports dated before the 2nd say "about 40".
                      The Thames Valley Times wrote "about 40" because it was written prior to the inquest, which was to be held later that day.
                      Newspapers published prior to the inquest must have obtained their details from PC Moulson, directly or indirectly.
                      Therefore, Mac. could have also used Moulson's police report.
                      Regards, Jon S.

                      Comment


                      • Hi Jon,

                        Thames Valley Times, 2nd January—about forty years old
                        Richmond and Twickenham Times, 5th January—31 years old
                        Southern Guardian, 5th January—31 years old.
                        Hampshire Advertiser, 12th January—31 years old

                        Acton, Chiswick & Turnham Green Gazette, 5th January 1889—

                        FOUND DROWNED . . . On Wednesday afternoon, Dr. Diplock, coroner, held the inquest at the Lamb Tap, when the following evidence was adduced—

                        William H. Druitt said he lived at Bournemouth, and that he was a solicitor. The deceased was his brother, who was 31 last birthday. He was a barrister-at-law, and an assistant master in a school at Blackheath . . .

                        "P.C. George Moulson, 216T, said he had searched the body, which was fully dressed excepting the hat and collar. He found four large stones in each pocket in the top coat; £2 10s. in gold, 7s. in silver, 2d. in bronze, two cheques on the London and Provincial Bank (one for £50 and the other for £16), a first-class season pass from Blackheath to London (Southwestern Railway), a second half return Hammersmith to Charing Cross (dated 1st December), a silver watch, gold chain with a spade guinea attached, a pair of kid gloves, and a white handkerchief. There were no papers or letters of any kind. There were no marks of injury on the body, but it was rather decomposed."

                        Where did P.C. Moulson mention Druitt's age?

                        Regards,

                        Simon
                        Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
                          Hi Jon,

                          Thames Valley Times, 2nd January—about forty years old
                          Richmond and Twickenham Times, 5th January—31 years old
                          Southern Guardian, 5th January—31 years old.
                          Hampshire Advertiser, 12th January—31 years old

                          Acton, Chiswick & Turnham Green Gazette, 5th January 1889—

                          FOUND DROWNED . . . On Wednesday afternoon, Dr. Diplock, coroner, held the inquest at the Lamb Tap, when the following evidence was adduced—

                          William H. Druitt said he lived at Bournemouth, and that he was a solicitor. The deceased was his brother, who was 31 last birthday. He was a barrister-at-law, and an assistant master in a school at Blackheath . . .

                          "P.C. George Moulson, 216T, said he had searched the body, which was fully dressed excepting the hat and collar. He found four large stones in each pocket in the top coat; £2 10s. in gold, 7s. in silver, 2d. in bronze, two cheques on the London and Provincial Bank (one for £50 and the other for £16), a first-class season pass from Blackheath to London (Southwestern Railway), a second half return Hammersmith to Charing Cross (dated 1st December), a silver watch, gold chain with a spade guinea attached, a pair of kid gloves, and a white handkerchief. There were no papers or letters of any kind. There were no marks of injury on the body, but it was rather decomposed."

                          Where did P.C. Moulson mention Druitt's age?

                          Regards,

                          Simon
                          Was Druitt Astrachan man, with all that money and gold on his person? Not forgetting the silver watch and more importantly gold chain and kid gloves as spotted by the eagle eyed Hutch.

                          Comment


                          • Hi Busy Beaver,

                            Unlikely.

                            Druitt was not of a 'Jewish' or 'foreign' appearance.

                            Regards,

                            Simon
                            Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Simon Wood View Post
                              Hi Jon,.....


                              Where did P.C. Moulson mention Druitt's age?

                              Regards,

                              Simon
                              Hello Simon.

                              Paul Begg believes the age came from Moulson's police report. What we have in the paragraph you quoted from the inquest was merely a list of contents from the body. Moulson is not reading his entire police report to the coroner. We have very little by way of details what happened that day, except that the body was taken directly to the mortuary. Any estimate of age must surely have come from the doctor who attended the body, PC Moulson would have been present, then writing his report when he returned to the station.
                              So, the age estimate (about 40) was reported before the inquest.

                              Regards, Jon S.

                              Comment


                              • Hi Jon,

                                Do we have a copy of PC Moulson's police report?

                                If not, then it's all pie in the sky.

                                Regards,

                                Simon
                                Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

                                Comment

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