Druitt's personality

[pinkmoon]

I think a lot of people like druitt as a suspect because there might be a chance of this "private information" turning up in note form......don't hold your breath

[Phil H]

Well, we cannot dismiss Druitt as a suspect anyway. Because he was named by a senior police official of the time who was in a position to know, and no evidence has emerged (as say with Ostrog) to allow us realistically to dismiss him.

But neither, allegations apart, do we have a shred of evidence to allow us to say MJD WAS "Jack".

Phil

[pinkmoon]

Hi, Pinkmoon,
Have you ever discussed your ancestors' stories here on Casebook?

If so, do you remember the thread?

If not, would you mind sharing, either here, if you think it fits this discussion, if not here perhaps in a private email. I'd love to know what people living in the area had to say about the murders.

Thanks,
curious

Nothing exciting I am afraid my great grandparents were children living in whitechapel at the time my father and his two sisters were told by them that everyone thought that the killer drowned himself after last murder.Also lots of people saw the killer he had a Gladstone bag top hat and cloak but nobody reported it to the police.To give it a scientific name it's gossip nothing more.Imagine my surprise when I started buying books years ago and reading about druitt drowning himself I had solved the case and then I grew up

[pinkmoon]

Well, we cannot dismiss Druitt as a suspect anyway. Because he was named by a senior police official of the time who was in a position to know, and no evidence has emerged (as say with Ostrog) to allow us realistically to dismiss him.

But neither, allegations apart, do we have a shred of evidence to allow us to say MJD WAS "Jack".

Phil

I think the best we can hope for with druitt is maybe finding a connection with the east end .I still think when his name came to the police's attention some discreet inquiries might have been made into his whereabouts during the murders .

[curious]

Nothing exciting I am afraid my great grandparents were children living in whitechapel at the time my father and his two sisters were told by them that everyone thought that the killer drowned himself after last murder.Also lots of people saw the killer he had a Gladstone bag top hat and cloak but nobody reported it to the police.To give it a scientific name it's gossip nothing more.Imagine my surprise when I started buying books years ago and reading about druitt drowning himself I had solved the case and then I grew up

Interesting. Thanks.

[Ausgirl]

Indeed, along with a number of others. Role playing is part of the charade, along with the desire to manipulate people.
Contrary to what is promoted about Profiling, there is no clear definitive 'type' for a murderer.

I am pretty sure that providing templates of a generalised 'type' is not the end-goal of profiling, anyway. Rather, it's a means of deducing a few handy specifics about an individual killer in order to narrow the suspect list, using a body of knowledge gathered from various sources.

Really, I digress - I think you're quite right about 'role-playing'. Especially for a killer who's purely sociopathic, as opposed to psychotic.

As for Druitt, I think too little is known about him to be sure of anything. That he was working at/fired from a school for boys tempts the mind towards thoughts of him being a pedo..

But perhaps he was simply gay. Maybe a cross dresser. Chronic masturbator. Who knows? All of these things were seen as proof of sexual 'insanity', in those days (heck, they are now, in some parts of the world..). It was a catch-all term, really.

His suicide note (if he was being genuine in it) reveals a deep fear of losing his mind, 'like mother'. So I'm thinking - unless Mother Druitt was gay or a child molester, or heck, a serial killer - his primary fear and reason for suicide probably had a lot to do with the rapid onset of a mental illness such as schizophrenia.

[Wickerman]

I think the best we can hope for with druitt is maybe finding a connection with the east end .

Why do you think it is necessary to find a connection, what is the premise for such a need?

[Wickerman]

As for Druitt, I think too little is known about him to be sure of anything. That he was working at/fired from a school for boys tempts the mind towards thoughts of him being a pedo..

But there again we are being influenced by modern standards.
Males taught in boys schools, females taught in girls schools. This was the standard of the times.

But perhaps he was simply gay. Maybe a cross dresser. Chronic masturbator. Who knows? All of these things were seen as proof of sexual 'insanity', in those days (heck, they are now, in some parts of the world..). It was a catch-all term, really.

And we can see from Macnaghten's use of the term, in associating 'sexual insane' with the Whitechapel murders, that he meant in a heterosexual sense.
In other words, in Mac's opinion, the murderer was oversexed towards women, not men.

His suicide note (if he was being genuine in it) reveals a deep fear of losing his mind, 'like mother'. So I'm thinking - unless Mother Druitt was gay or a child molester, or heck, a serial killer - his primary fear and reason for suicide probably had a lot to do with the rapid onset of a mental illness such as schizophrenia.

The premise inherent in the note doesn't ring true to me. Killing yourself because you fear of 'being like mother' comes across to me as more of a convenient excuse.
If Druitt had been worried about becoming 'like mother' this would not have been a sudden thought, it would have grown stronger over months if not years. William, I would expect, should have been aware of his brother's concern's, therefore suicide should not have been a complete surprise.

[pinkmoon]

Why do you think it is necessary to find a connection, what is the premise for such a need?

No need at all it would be rather interesting though don't you think

[Ausgirl]

The premise inherent in the note doesn't ring true to me. Killing yourself because you fear of 'being like mother' comes across to me as more of a convenient excuse.
If Druitt had been worried about becoming 'like mother' this would not have been a sudden thought, it would have grown stronger over months if not years. William, I would expect, should have been aware of his brother's concern's, therefore suicide should not have been a complete surprise.

Trust me - growing up with a severely mentally ill mother makes a person -really- afraid of mental illness. I can't imagine what it would have felt like back then, when such illness was even more shameful, asylums were horrible and the mentally ill were warehoused in them.

And mental illness can be sudden onset, as well as gradual. Given a long-term and very deep seated fear of being like his mother (and/or other relatives that were mentally ill) the sudden onset of hallucinations and the like could well have proved too much for him.

[Wickerman]

Trust me - growing up with a severely mentally ill mother makes a person -really- afraid of mental illness. I can't imagine what it would have felt like back then, when such illness was even more shameful, asylums were horrible and the mentally ill were warehoused in them.

And mental illness can be sudden onset, as well as gradual. Given a long-term and very deep seated fear of being like his mother (and/or other relatives that were mentally ill) the sudden onset of hallucinations and the like could well have proved too much for him.

What I am getting at is, that Montie visited his brother in late October, and Montie still had communications with the family, yet we read of no hints or expectations from anyone about a slow decline of Montie's mental ability or frequent bouts of depression, or anything to indicate mental troubles.
The letter comes across as if Montie, one day, just decided to throw himself in the Thames.
What we are missing is the slow decline, or the long build-up to such drastic measures.

[pinkmoon]

Could it be he thought he was going to be caught or was he just good at keeping his emotions under control after all he can't be the world's first unexplained suicide.Or could his sacking from the school be leading on to a visit from the police we will never know.Looking back I think macnaughton committed a large injustice to Mr druitt his family and us all but not stating exactally what his "private information" was

[Stephen Thomas]

ie no ie

What I am getting at is, that Montie visited his brother in late October, and Montie still had communications with the family, yet we read of no hints or expectations from anyone about a slow decline of Montie's mental ability or frequent bouts of depression, or anything to indicate mental troubles.
The letter comes across as if Montie, one day, just decided to throw himself in the Thames.
What we are missing is the slow decline, or the long build-up to such drastic measures.

Hi Jon

I see that you've been infected by the dreaded JonathanH virus.

The universally accepted contraction of Montague or Montgomery is Monty.

[pinkmoon]

Interesting. Thanks.

One thing that my family agree upon is the so called "invisibility" of jack the ripper.Knowing the area well and applying the idea that most people out and about at the same time of the killer were themselves up to no good hence no one reported seeing him at work .I do actually believe that some one might have seen him actually up to his horrendous work or just finishing it and not notifying authorities.One last thing my dad told me that jack the ripper decorated the room of one of his victims with her body parts obviously Kelly.

[Wickerman]

Hi Jon

I see that you've been infected by the dreaded JonathanH virus.

The universally accepted contraction of Montague or Montgomery is Monty.

Dammit, you're right. I hadn't noticed..