The Strange Death Of Montague John Druitt

[Wickerman]

yes I have discovered that leather billfolds exactly like we have today were in use and that, in December, this billfold would have been in the pocket of a thick wool coat. Every chance of it still being legible because of so many layers of waterproof materials around the papers. I dont want to guess at it though so I am going to conduct an experiment to see what we can see. Just FYI I have spoken to someone who makes Victorian style clothing like the ubiquitous Chesterfield coat he was likely wearing and have discovered that this coat, all by itself, once saturated, weighed enough to anchor him to the floor of the river. All any rocks would do is make sure the coat didnt ebb and flow with the tide. Will have to conduct an experiment on this to ascertain the facts as well. Going to be a busy summer. You people have given me a new lease on life!

The issue of the coat, always assuming it is the same type, only means the body may not have drifted far from where he went in. However, surface currents at the time are not known, and once it does sink and decomposition begins, the methane gas build-up in the body will lift it off the bottom and it will begin to float after a few days.
After all, Winslade was reported to have found a floating body, he did not lift it up from the river bed.

[mpriestnall]

yes I have discovered that leather billfolds exactly like we have today were in use and that, in December, this billfold would have been in the pocket of a thick wool coat. Every chance of it still being legible because of so many layers of waterproof materials around the papers. I dont want to guess at it though so I am going to conduct an experiment to see what we can see. Just FYI I have spoken to someone who makes Victorian style clothing like the ubiquitous Chesterfield coat he was likely wearing and have discovered that this coat, all by itself, once saturated, weighed enough to anchor him to the floor of the river. All any rocks would do is make sure the coat didnt ebb and flow with the tide. Will have to conduct an experiment on this to ascertain the facts as well. Going to be a busy summer. You people have given me a new lease on life!

I hope your experiments exclude actual reconstruction of MJD's fate?

[bernadette]

Without seeing evidence you would assume that these kind of documents couldn’t survive in water but clearly they can.

yes I have discovered that leather billfolds exactly like we have today were in use and that, in December, this billfold would have been in the pocket of a thick wool coat. Every chance of it still being legible because of so many layers of waterproof materials around the papers. I dont want to guess at it though so I am going to conduct an experiment to see what we can see. Just FYI I have spoken to someone who makes Victorian style clothing like the ubiquitous Chesterfield coat he was likely wearing and have discovered that this coat, all by itself, once saturated, weighed enough to anchor him to the floor of the river. All any rocks would do is make sure the coat didnt ebb and flow with the tide. Will have to conduct an experiment on this to ascertain the facts as well. Going to be a busy summer. You people have given me a new lease on life!

[Herlock Sholmes]

Yes, thanks, I did have one in mind. Took some time to find it though.

Here, from the Chelmsford Chronicle of 26 Apr. 1867





The point to note is the paperwork & hand written documents were still perfectly readable.

Without seeing evidence you would assume that these kind of documents couldn’t survive in water but clearly they can.

[Wickerman]

There’s this one

Yes, thanks, I did have one in mind. Took some time to find it though.

Here, from the Chelmsford Chronicle of 26 Apr. 1867





The point to note is the paperwork & hand written documents were still perfectly readable.

[Wickerman]

actually by 1888 people were using aniline ink. I am in the middle of designing an experiment to test out all the variables related to the ink, paper, printing method and coverings for the paper. It will take about 6-8 weeks then I will let you know.

We can't say who was using it though, we can only know what was the most common, and that was Iron Gall. There were different inks available.

[bernadette]

The body was floating, erect?

feet had been tied to a cement block, thus the comments about whether he had been depressed.

[bernadette]

That was not necessary, I looked up body's found drowned in the B.N.A. there were several cases of paperwork (cheques & documents) found on a body where the ink was still intact and perfectly readable after several weeks in the water.
The post will still be there in the last major Druitt thread we debated on a few years ago.

As a footnote, it may be well to add, Iron Gall Ink was the most common ink used in the 19th century, by the nature of its ingredients it was waterproof. No need to seek out anything special.

actually by 1888 people were using aniline ink. I am in the middle of designing an experiment to test out all the variables related to the ink, paper, printing method and coverings for the paper. It will take about 6-8 weeks then I will let you know.

[bernadette]

[QUOTE=Simon Wood;n831393]Hi Bernadette,

Excellent post.

Other things we should consider are the two cheques on the London and Provincial Bank (one for £50 and the other for £16), a first-class season pass from Blackheath to London (Southwestern Railway), a second half return Hammersmith to Charing Cross (dated 1st December) found in a pocket.

They must all have been printed on water-resistant paper and the cheques signed with waterproof ink.

Simon[I know that with the checks, they could have been using just the indentations from the fountain pen. when I looked into the matter I realized that the paper 100% rag not as degradable as wood pulp paper, was inside of a leather wallet inside of a pocket of a heavy winter coat which may have been rubberized as a raincoat/macintosh making it less likely to be destroyed. HOWEVER even with all that I am skeptical. I have designed an experiment to check all these variables. Right now I am waiting for suppliues to be shipped in. I will keep everyone up to date on the results.

[Herlock Sholmes]

The body was floating, erect?

Are you branching out into Carry On film territory Wick?

[rjpalmer]

I dont know anything about that area in late Victorian era. Can anyone offer insight?

If you're interested in seeing this section of the Thames, you can take a virtual tour on the nifty Panoramic View of The Thames website, linked below. Many of the same buildings that were there in 1888 still stand.

When you click on the link, you'll see Hammersmith Bridge (opened in 1887) on the extreme right. Druitt's last train ticket was to Hammersmith.

Then just click one of the left pointing arrows on the lower left side of the screen and you'll drift down to Chiswick Mall.

Watch for the marker for "Chiswick Ait" and this is very near where Druitt's body was pulled from the river.

Digby Mansions - Chiswick and Hammersmith (panoramaofthethames.com)

[Wickerman]

The body was floating, erect?

[Herlock Sholmes]

There’s this one

[Wickerman]

...


They must all have been printed on water-resistant paper and the cheques signed with waterproof ink.

Simon

That was not necessary, I looked up body's found drowned in the B.N.A. there were several cases of paperwork (cheques & documents) found on a body where the ink was still intact and perfectly readable after several weeks in the water.
The post will still be there in the last major Druitt thread we debated on a few years ago.

As a footnote, it may be well to add, Iron Gall Ink was the most common ink used in the 19th century, by the nature of its ingredients it was waterproof. No need to seek out anything special.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Bernadette,

Excellent post.

Other things we should consider are the two cheques on the London and Provincial Bank (one for £50 and the other for £16), a first-class season pass from Blackheath to London (Southwestern Railway), a second half return Hammersmith to Charing Cross (dated 1st December) found in a pocket.

They must all have been printed on water-resistant paper and the cheques signed with waterproof ink.

Simon