The broken window

[Jon Guy]

If this little boy was in Mary Kelly's care though, why didn't Joe Barnett mention that he was there with Mary when Joe visited her at between 7:30 and 8pm that Thursday night? Also why didn't Maria Harvey or the untraceable Lizzie Albrook mention the little chap when they spent hours with Mary that afternoon and early evening. He seems to have been a remarkably quiet and easy child to care for, not requiring any food, drink, sleep or any other attention.

Indeed, Rosella

In the case of Alice McKenzie the boy George Dicson (Dixon), who was in McKenzie`s company on her final day, certainly gets mentioned in despatches.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Rosella,

You are asking questions which are impossible to answer.

Regards,

Simon

[GUT]

If this little boy was in Mary Kelly's care though, why didn't Joe Barnett mention that he was there with Mary when Joe visited her at between 7:30 and 8pm that Thursday night? Also why didn't Maria Harvey or the untraceable Lizzie Albrook mention the little chap when they spent hours with Mary that afternoon and early evening. He seems to have been a remarkably quiet and easy child to care for, not requiring any food, drink, sleep or any other attention.

Because it was all a cover up, he was Eddy's illegitimate son and DNA proved that on the day, so he was hidden in the Tower.

[Rosella]

If this little boy was in Mary Kelly's care though, why didn't Joe Barnett mention that he was there with Mary when Joe visited her at between 7:30 and 8pm that Thursday night? Also why didn't Maria Harvey or the untraceable Lizzie Albrook mention the little chap when they spent hours with Mary that afternoon and early evening. He seems to have been a remarkably quiet and easy child to care for, not requiring any food, drink, sleep or any other attention.

[Simon Wood]

Good Evening Roy,

You have come up with an ingenious set of reasons for why Dr. Gabe arrived in Millers Court.

But I don't think I ever said that Kelly had a son [although if I'm wrong I have no doubt that someone will take great delight in putting me right].

Let's simply say that there may have been a child in Millers Court supposedly in the care of Kelly.

In which case, given Kelly's sudden and brutal despatch from this world, the boy attracted the attention of the SPCC.

Enter Dr. Gabe.

I'm not certain why you want him to have turned up unannounced and out of the blue.

Regards,

Simon

[Roy Corduroy]

Good evening Simon,

First of all, thanks for posting up the documents and images.

You've posed the question, why was Dr Gabe, the doctor for the Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Children there, possibly implying he was there for the boy, Mary Kelly's son, reported in the early news reports.

Maybe he or someone heard the same rumor about the son that found its way into the initial reports. So he came there based on that.

Or conversely, it was not a rumor. Mary Kelly had a son there. And he came specifically for that reason.

Okay, let's say she did have a son, a fact known immediately and with certainty enough to call the special doctor from the SPCC. In that case, I'm surprised none of the inquest witnesses associated with Miller's Court said anything about the victim's son. Barnett, Bowyer, McCarthy, Prater, Lewis, Ventury and Harvey. A small boy in a court would make his presence known. No one said ' we thought of the boy' his safety, his welfare. Where was the poor dear.' Or anything like that.

There is a third possibility. Hearing of the murder, Dr Gabe went there to check on the welfare of any child living in the confines of the court, the place of the 'orrible murder. A general welfare safety check.

Roy

[Debra A]

What I'm wondering - and I don't know if it's a leap of logic - is whether Dr Gabe retained a link with the London Dispensary, just around the corner from Dorset Street, during 1888. Is it possible that he could have held a surgery there one day a week? Perhaps every Friday?

I think it's plausible, David.

[Debra A]

Hi Debra,

Am I sensing the onset of yet another Ripperological leap of logic?

Regards,

Simon

I'm just asking the question.
He is listed in the electoral registers at a tenement at 76 Farringdon Rd (it's also given as his address when he appears in an 1890 list of district medical officers) as well as Mecklenburgh Sq from the early 80s through to the 1900s so I wondered about Church St too.

[David Orsam]

What I'm wondering - and I don't know if it's a leap of logic - is whether Dr Gabe retained a link with the London Dispensary, just around the corner from Dorset Street, during 1888. Is it possible that he could have held a surgery there one day a week? Perhaps every Friday?

[Simon Wood]

Hi Debra,

Am I sensing the onset of yet another Ripperological leap of logic?

Regards,

Simon

[Debra A]

Dr Gabe also simultaneously had links to an address at Farringdon St (76 I think) in the 80s and beyond, it's given in some directories and electoral registers.
Given that the Church St address was also residential as shown by the census returns could it be that Dr Gabe kept an apartment there after his move to Mecklenburgh Sq?

[David Orsam]

In case it is unclear, no-one, least of all me, is denying that Dr Gabe resided in Mecklenburgh Square from at least 1885 onwards, including 1888, nor that he was the surgeon for the Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Young Children. But, like I said earlier, he was living a stone's throw from Dorset Street between at least 1880 and 1883 and possibly up to 1885.

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

1888 Post Office Street Directory—



On Easter Day 1885 brother Harry, aged 24, died at 16 Mecklenburgh Square.

Dr. Gabe was living at this address in 1886, when his son Ivor Stanley was born, and continued to live there until at least 1917.

In The Times, March 29th 1888, Dr. Gabe was reported to be surgeon to the Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Young Children at 7 Harpur Street, Bloomsbury, half a mile from Mecklenburgh Square.



Regards,

Simon

[David Orsam]

Interesting old Casebook page about the whereabouts of J.R.Gabe in the censuses..etc..

http://www.casebook.org/forum/messages/4926/13452.html

That thread seems to have overlooked the most interesting information from the 1891 census namely the birthplace of Dr Gabe's two daughters:

Caroline M daughter single 10 born Spitalfields

Winnifred A daughter 7 born Spitalfields

When Dr Gabe married in March 1880 he entered his address in the register as 21 Church Street, Spitalfields, and, as Debra has mentioned, was still living there at the time of the 1881 census. When Winnifred was baptised in August 1883 the same Church Street address was entered in the register.

The Western Mail of 9 April 1885 reported that Dr Gabe's 25 year old brother, Harry, who was, at the time, said to have been a medical student at London Hospital, and a medical assistant to the London Dispensary in Spitalfields, died over Easter at Dr Gabe's London residence. As Harry's death was registered in St Pancras, I deduce that Dr Gabe had moved to Mecklenburgh Square by this time.

The real point of interest for our purposes I guess is whether Dr Gabe, in 1888, retained any links with the London Dispensary.

[Debra A]

Dr Gabe and his wife and daughter ( and a servant) were actually living at the dispensary address of 21 Church St Spitalfields on the 1881 census as David mentioned.
In 1891 there are also a number of people living there, showing it was a residential address.

The Manchester times of 10th Nov reports that Dr Gabe lived in the area and was brought in to look at the body.