The Juwes Graffiti

[erobitha]

Man be glad, in halle and bour;
This tyme was born our Savyour

In this tyme a chyld was born
To save tho sowle that wen forlorn,
For us he werde garlond of thorn
Al it was for our honour

The eytende day he was schorn
To fulfylle the law that was beforn;
Of meknesse he blew his horn.
Al it was for our honour

On Good Fryday was don on rode;
The Juwes spyltyn his herte blode;
Mary his moder be hym stode.
Ye ben our help and our socour.
On Esterne Day he gan up ryse
To techyn hem that wern onwyse.

Ah, ye 'Olde English' example. I have found versions of this hymn / carol where Jews is spelt correctly.

I have deliberately avoided using examples from Old English for these reasons.

For those who are interested, this is a carol from the 15th Century called "Man, Be Glad in Halle and Bour".

[Astatine211]

Man be glad, in halle and bour;
This tyme was born our Savyour

In this tyme a chyld was born
To save tho sowle that wen forlorn,
For us he werde garlond of thorn
Al it was for our honour

The eytende day he was schorn
To fulfylle the law that was beforn;
Of meknesse he blew his horn.
Al it was for our honour

On Good Fryday was don on rode;
The Juwes spyltyn his herte blode;
Mary his moder be hym stode.
Ye ben our help and our socour.
On Esterne Day he gan up ryse
To techyn hem that wern onwyse.

[erobitha]

I often think that with the time given a opportunity to leave a message or further one could have happened with the MJK murder .

That is a fair point. After all he had the time.

However, just because he may not have there does not validate that he may not have done so on Goulston Street as well. The debate over the FM initials still goes on however.

Also he left no doubt (for most logical and rational people) that MJK was his handiwork. He had nothing to prove. In the case of Stride it could have been mistaken (and still is now by some) as not being his victim. He wanted the credit.

[paul g]

I often think that with the time given a opportunity to leave a message or further one could have happened with the MJK murder .

[Dickere]

Hi Dickere!

Fair point.

If you are from London you're going to have a far better handle on this than me, a northern English girl living in Scotland making exceptionally poor attempts at a cockney accent!!

I think I was pretty much channeling Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins with my efforts.!

You're showing your age too there

[Herlock Sholmes]

Speaking as someone with a London accent, rubbish or otherwise, it feels like quite a stretch to me. The idea of it being someone trying to appear uneducated appeals to me.

I agree Dickere. I’m undecided on the graffito but I think there’s at least a fair chance that the person was trying to appear less educated than he actually was. And why would a person have felt the need to disguise his level of education in a piece of graffiti, a) if it was entirely random and unconnected to the murders, and b) unless he was of a much higher education level than your average Whitechapel citizen?

He spells Jews wrong - wouldn’t a literate person have seen ‘Jew’ or jewish’ written down fairly often?
Then he adds a very obvious double negative.

But he spells ‘blamed’ and ‘nothing’ correctly. Not particularly easy words.

No definites here of course. I just think it’s a possibility that the killer might have been of a higher level of education. (Like a Barrister/schoolteacher for example)

[Ms Diddles]

Well in 1888 all jury trials were made up of male jurors

www.trevormarriott.co.uk

It's interesting.

Whether this has any bearing on it or not, it's nice to see a different (and to my knowledge) new interpretation considered.

[Ms Diddles]

Speaking as someone with a London accent, rubbish or otherwise, it feels like quite a stretch to me. The idea of it being someone trying to appear uneducated appeals to me.

Hi Dickere!

Fair point.

If you are from London you're going to have a far better handle on this than me, a northern English girl living in Scotland making exceptionally poor attempts at a cockney accent!!

I think I was pretty much channeling Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins with my efforts.!

[Dickere]

Interesting! That's an interpretation that I've never seen considered before.

Would the same apply to "jewellers"?

I just tried saying that in a rubbish London accent and it kinda works.

Speaking as someone with a London accent, rubbish or otherwise, it feels like quite a stretch to me. The idea of it being someone trying to appear uneducated appeals to me.

[Trevor Marriott]

Interesting! That's an interpretation that I've never seen considered before.

Would the same apply to "jewellers"?

I just tried saying that in a rubbish London accent and it kinda works.

Well in 1888 all jury trials were made up of male jurors

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[Ms Diddles]

Try pronouncing the word Jurors and if you back in 1888 didnt know how to spell it you would write it as it sounds Juwes

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

Interesting! That's an interpretation that I've never seen considered before.

Would the same apply to "jewellers"?

I just tried saying that in a rubbish London accent and it kinda works.

[erobitha]

To have any relevance to the Ripper,it should first be proven to have been written by that person

JTR was not in the habit of leaving ripped and bloodied clothing strewn all over Whitechapel. It just so happens to be pure coincidence it was below a message written in chalk? Or was it Eddowes sanitary towel?

I think the odds are more likely that he did write it than he didn’t.

Clarky, again you will need to make your own judgments. Many on here (and I include myself) have theories and ideas which do not exactly have universal consensus.

[harry]

To have any relevance to the Ripper,it should first be proven to have been written by that person

[Trevor Marriott]

It could be someone trying to write with misspellings to try and make it sound like a cockney.

Try pronouncing the word Jurors and if you back in 1888 didnt know how to spell it you would write it as it sounds Juwes

https://www.trevormarriott.co.uk

[erobitha]

There was some speculation of the word being derivative of French.

I believe the late Martin Fido suggested it might have been written by a cockney.

The word 'Juwes' cannot be found anywhere else as written like that.

It could be someone trying to write with misspellings to try and make it sound like a cockney.

The From Hell and Openshaw letters are both guilty of that in my opinion.